Long slip shafts....options?

[chicago]

Looking for the options for a long slip DC front shaft for my 40 build...
What length of slip do I need?
If I got a "build your own shaft" kit, how do I adapt a DC joint to it?

The ":kits" Ive seen are....

Marlin 179, 8 in slip (out of stock)
Daves off road performance 10 in
Trail Gear 12 in slip

All fall around the same price.
I had seen in a TT YEARS ago where Mark W had built one using farm s***. Cant find the mag for some reason.
Anything I can pull from a bone yard.

Planning a SR for my 40 so Ill probably need this, and I DO WANT a DC shaft for vibe issues that it may have without.

 

[Mace]

IIRC Mark used a Cab forward Steering shaft for his Driveshaft

 

[Fast Eddy]

13": toyota-long-slip

 

[chicago]

13": toyota-long-slip

Fawk yeah!

 

[chicago]

IIRC Mark used a Cab forward Steering shaft for his Driveshaft

Was that the write up he did in TT?
I remember the article...I read it, but didnt pay THAT close of attention to where the parts were from. I wanna say like farm n fleet...
What is a cab forward steering shaft?

 

[4rnr]

As far as I can tell, Marlin has always been out of stock.

It depends on how much slip you need...The front of a 40 prolly needs more than most, being a short shaft and shackles in the back of the springs etc... Too long and you'll bottom, and destroy your t-case, too short and well you know....

If you want a nice shaft that can be driven on the road I suggest calling Jesse at High Angle Drivelines, he is the man and when all said and done he is very reasonable on the price, if you want to make your own go square...

 

[bustanutley]

13": toyota-long-slip

With spicier joint though?? yuck.

Good deal as long as you can fit a yota joint in it.

 

[chicago]

As far as I can tell, Marlin has always been out of stock.

It depends on how much slip you need...The front of a 40 prolly needs more than most, being a short shaft and shackles in the back of the springs etc... Too long and you'll bottom, and destroy your t-case, too short and well you know....

If you want a nice shaft that can be driven on the road I suggest calling Jesse at High Angle Drivelines, he is the man and when all said and done he is very reasonable on the price, if you want to make your own go square...

I do have quite a bit of length for the front shaft with the auto and dual case set up, so Im thinking its gonna have to be pretty long. I guess that Ill know more when I get the front SOA installed, but I DID wanna start thinking ahead. Anything custom built complete is gonna be $$$$$$!

Thanks for the input.

 

[mano002]

I got some 19" slip splines put on some stock toyota CV shafts at Drivelines of Fresno. just google them. Great guysto deal with, and I was recommended by another Mudder.

 

[Boing]

How I usually do it is when I set my bumpstops & shock tower lengths. Take the leaves apart leave only the three longest leaves, then flex the rig full bump to full droop on the passenger side. When at full bump measure from the yoke to t-case ouput, at full droop do the same. I like to have at least 2-2.5" of plunge at full droop.... Give these measurements to any driveline shop and they can make it. (Some will be substantially cheaper than others, HAD shipped to my house is cheaper than any local shop... by alot!)

To be clear I am talking about articulation full bump to droop, not total suspension travel.

Jess @ high angle is good people!


In terms of what shaft etc... there are tons of options have made my own out of several different things (farm tractor stuff, Transmission output shafts, square tube etc....)... In the end the cost of a professional one is only slightly more expensive & not having to limp a rig off a trail is worth quite a bit to me... That being said I have also torn up good high dollar shafts.

 

[chicago]

Well if I were to go with one of the KIT style shafts that I build my own...I SHOULD be able to have it balanced, correct?
I have a guy in Carson that does all my drive shaft and diff work and he's reasonably priced. Still...about 350 bucks for him to build one. He did the work on my 62 for the rear DS.
Seems that most are recommending to just have it built IF I want it to behave in 4WD on the road?
My wife has the idea of taking this to and from work once in a while....99.99999% of the time, that will be during the summer where she can run with the top off D) and she will NEVER be in 4 WD for that, but....I just think it would probably be better to have it so it can be driven in 4WD at SOME speed if need be.

 

[chicago]

How I usually do it is when I set my bumpstops & shock tower lengths. Take the leaves apart leave only the three longest leaves, then flex the rig full bump to full droop on the passenger side. When at full bump measure from the yoke to t-case ouput, at full droop do the same. I like to have at least 2-2.5" of plunge at full droop.... Give these measurements to any driveline shop and they can make it. (Some will be substantially cheaper than others, HAD shipped to my house is cheaper than any local shop... by alot!)

To be clear I am talking about articulation full bump to droop, not total suspension travel.

Jess @ high angle is good people!


In terms of what shaft etc... there are tons of options have made my own out of several different things (farm tractor stuff, Transmission output shafts, square tube etc....)... In the end the cost of a professional one is only slightly more expensive & not having to limp a rig off a trail is worth quite a bit to me... That being said I have also torn up good high dollar shafts.

Boing...
Why take the leaves OUT for this?
Why not just do it with the leaves youll be running? Would that be WORST CASE flex sort of thing?
That is a good point...when I get the DIY kit, that is 179 bucks, then finding a DC joint to cut apart and tubing...I guess that wouldnt be that far from a new one.

 

[4rnr]

How I usually do it is when I set my bumpstops & shock tower lengths. Take the leaves apart leave only the three longest leaves, then flex the rig full bump to full droop on the passenger side. When at full bump measure from the yoke to t-case ouput, at full droop do the same. I like to have at least 2-2.5" of plunge at full droop.... Give these measurements to any driveline shop and they can make it. (Some will be substantially cheaper than others, HAD shipped to my house is cheaper than any local shop... by alot!)

To be clear I am talking about articulation full bump to droop, not total suspension travel.

Jess @ high angle is good people!


In terms of what shaft etc... there are tons of options have made my own out of several different things (farm tractor stuff, Transmission output shafts, square tube etc....)... In the end the cost of a professional one is only slightly more expensive & not having to limp a rig off a trail is worth quite a bit to me... That being said I have also torn up good high dollar shafts.

pretty much, exactly...

Well if I were to go with one of the KIT style shafts that I build my own...I SHOULD be able to have it balanced, correct?
I have a guy in Carson that does all my drive shaft and diff work and he's reasonably priced. Still...about 350 bucks for him to build one. He did the work on my 62 for the rear DS.
Seems that most are recommending to just have it built IF I want it to behave in 4WD on the road?
My wife has the idea of taking this to and from work once in a while....99.99999% of the time, that will be during the summer where she can run with the top off D) and she will NEVER be in 4 WD for that, but....I just think it would probably be better to have it so it can be driven in 4WD at SOME speed if need be.

If you build one, and go to get it balanced...odds are they are going to have to cut your welds and reweld it strait....unless you manage to weld it perfectly square the first time, they will charge you for that.

$350 is more than I spent (after core return) for my HAD front shaft, made by the best in the business with a clearenced CV, 11" slip, new joints, .090 wall, fully bad ass shaft. The difference between Jesse and most local places (atleast around me) is Jesse knows how to build a strong balanced shaft for wheelers. My local shops (the very few that can spell toyota let alone work on them) are all drag race shops and I always have to fight with them over why I want atleast .090 wall tubing....then they tell me im an idiot and it will never balance, and if I really want a strong shaft they will make me a large OD aluminum or carbon one....I digress...id rather give my $ to Jesse.

Boing...
Why take the leaves OUT for this?
Why not just do it with the leaves youll be running? Would that be WORST CASE flex sort of thing?
That is a good point...when I get the DIY kit, that is 179 bucks, then finding a DC joint to cut apart and tubing...I guess that wouldnt be that far from a new one.

Removing leaves is to just make it easier to flex the truck out so you can truely find max droop/bump...its hard to simulate a good cross up in the driveway. If you have your shocks on, and your spring straps on and closed, and some bump stops....the numbers should be the same as if you had all the leafs on, on the trail.

 

[chicago]

pretty much, exactly...



If you build one, and go to get it balanced...odds are they are going to have to cut your welds and reweld it strait....unless you manage to weld it perfectly square the first time, they will charge you for that.

$350 is more than I spent (after core return) for my HAD front shaft, made by the best in the business with a clearenced CV, 11" slip, new joints, .090 wall, fully bad ass shaft. The difference between Jesse and most local places (atleast around me) is Jesse knows how to build a strong balanced shaft for wheelers. My local shops (the very few that can spell toyota let alone work on them) are all drag race shops and I always have to fight with them over why I want atleast .090 wall tubing....then they tell me im an idiot and it will never balance, and if I really want a strong shaft they will make me a large OD aluminum or carbon one....I digress...id rather give my $ to Jesse.



Removing leaves is to just make it easier to flex the truck out so you can truely find max droop/bump...its hard to simulate a good cross up in the driveway. If you have your shocks on, and your spring straps on and closed, and some bump stops....the numbers should be the same as if you had all the leafs on, on the trail.

Alright then. That is some good stuff there 4rnr.
Ive talked with Jessie years ago at a "trade" show that he came to here in Reno.
Ill check him out and see what he can do once I get the SOA complete and get a more accurate dimension.
My gear guy is a wheeler too, but his customer service leaves a LOT to be desired. However, he is relatively local and REALLY REASONABLE for the area and he does good work when all is said and done. BUT...its a drive shaft and not a re gear on a 50 plus LB diff...

Thanks for the info!

Keith

 

[ToyRoverlander]

How I usually do it is when I set my bumpstops & shock tower lengths. Take the leaves apart leave only the three longest leaves, then flex the rig full bump to full droop on the passenger side. When at full bump measure from the yoke to t-case ouput, at full droop do the same. I like to have at least 2-2.5" of plunge at full droop.... Give these measurements to any driveline shop and they can make it. (Some will be substantially cheaper than others, HAD shipped to my house is cheaper than any local shop... by alot!)

To be clear I am talking about articulation full bump to droop, not total suspension travel.

On articulation (bump on the left/droop on the right or vice versa) the diff doesn't move up or down as much as when the axle rises or droops as a whole, like in parallel to the ground. That's because one end of the axle moves down, but the other end moves up so the middle of the axle stays more or less in the same place.

This is how I do it.
Measure between flanges at ride height, then grab a high-lift jack and raise the vehicle till the wheels are off the ground, or just about to come off the ground. Now measure again between the flanges.
On mine, at the front, I measured something like 75cm at ride height and 82 or something with both wheels off the ground. That's a 7cm difference. My leafs are fairly flat so I know that the change in length is not as much on compression as it is on droop.
I took 5cm to be sure. So that made 12cm of slipjoint. The company that made mine only did 11cm and 18cm sliders so I opted for the 18cm one. Told them that I wanted the driveshaft to be 68cm fully compressed and 86cm fully extended. Good safety margins that way on both ends..
Doing it this way you can also see what the u-joint angles are going to be like.

 

[Chop Shop]

Long slip shafts are heavy and eat bearings.

Just put a limiting strap on a stocker and be done.

You need to figure out the max compressed length. While running one leaf flex it out to full compression and measure flange to flange.

Now have a shaft built with a half inch more compression left (so it can never bottom out). Then install the shaft and lift the front of the rig with a hilift on the frame and let it droop out ill the toyota slipyoke just shows a 1/4 inch of exposed splines.

Now at this level put a limiting strap on the diff. The front axle will fully articulate like the gent said above this post. One tire at a time can flex just fine. At full flex it wont even make the strap tight. The only time it will ever make the strap tight is when "popping" off the top of an obsticle and unloading both tires at once. Having both tires unload and fall out of the rig is not good even if you have a long spline shaft.

Its funny how full body rigs and toy truck guys all run these long slip shafts when a simple strap is all you need and it wont affect travel at all.

If ya think a strap is going to limit things, think about why folks use suck down winches, to limit down travel. Theres no reason to let both tires fall at full droop, unless its a SCORE truck.

 

[Chop Shop]

Oh and unless you have had the front axle cut and turned, a CV is not going to benifit you at all. If you have any angle on the lower joint, a CV will give you vibes.

Plus a cv needs more crossmember clearance and adds more Ujoints to the rig.

Plus a single joint is far cheaper than a CV to purchase.

 

[Mace]

A limit strap on a Stock LC front driveshaft in a shackle reversal situation will limit your flex significantly.

At least run Mini Stuff.

 

[ToyRoverlander]

Long slip shafts are heavy and eat bearings.

Just put a limiting strap on a stocker and be done.

You need to figure out the max compressed length. While running one leaf flex it out to full compression and measure flange to flange.

Now have a shaft built with a half inch more compression left (so it can never bottom out). Then install the shaft and lift the front of the rig with a hilift on the frame and let it droop out ill the toyota slipyoke just shows a 1/4 inch of exposed splines.

Now at this level put a limiting strap on the diff. The front axle will fully articulate like the gent said above this post. One tire at a time can flex just fine. At full flex it wont even make the strap tight. The only time it will ever make the strap tight is when "popping" off the top of an obsticle and unloading both tires at once. Having both tires unload and fall out of the rig is not good even if you have a long spline shaft.

Its funny how full body rigs and toy truck guys all run these long slip shafts when a simple strap is all you need and it wont affect travel at all.

If ya think a strap is going to limit things, think about why folks use suck down winches, to limit down travel. Theres no reason to let both tires fall at full droop, unless its a SCORE truck.

Though that is at all possible, and it sure works (I want a center limit strap on the front axle, to improve climbing).
That wouldn't work on a leaf sprung land rover,you'd still have no wheel travel. Slipjoints on those things are very, very short..

 

[Chop Shop]

A limit strap on a Stock LC front driveshaft in a shackle reversal situation will limit your flex significantly.

At least run Mini Stuff.

I have no experience with fj stuff other than cutting it off and tossing it.

All the info in my post was directed at using a minitruck slip with 5 inches of slip.

I looked at one of the shafts that came with my cruiser and the slips are not worth building a shaft with to me.

A limit strap on a cruiser with a mini T shaft might be just fine though.