KISS Dual Battery Upgrade

[ohsix]

How's the paint coming along on the rear bumper?

Still sitting bare. I went with no swingouts. My plan is to put it on the vehicle and see how it looks. I may want to fab something to fill in where the swingouts would bolt in.

I also screwed up when ordering. I told Ben "I want the mounting hardware powder coated black and the outer parts left bare so I can have it painted to match." What I should have said is "I want the mounting brackets powder coated black." There's a bag of bolts with all the bolt heads powder coated black.

 

[FrazzledHunter]

For those of you going the Goal Zero Yeti route for your second battery: I just got and tested a Victron Orion 12/24 15 that connects directly to my starting battery. It charges my 1500X at the rate of 360+ watts via the Anderson Powerpole PP45 input which is exactly 3 times the rate of the wall charger that comes with it!

I'm going to have to mount it on something and supply a cooling fan as it gets really hot when it's run in power supply mode.

Test setup:

 

[Scylth]

For those of you going the Goal Zero Yeti route for your second battery: I just got and tested a Victron Orion 12/24 15 that connects directly to my starting battery. It charges my 1500X at the rate of 360+ watts via the Anderson Powerpole PP45 input which is exactly 3 times the rate of the wall charger that comes with it!

I'm going to have to mount it on something and supply a cooling fan as it gets really hot when it's run in power supply mode.

Test setup:

View attachment 2698986

Are you mounting in your engine bay? I have a Redarc charger, and I think for LI they didn’t recommend putting it in the engine bay (which can be cooler or hotter depending on how you mount, shielding, venting, etc), but not sure what the recommendation is for your unit.

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Are you mounting in your engine bay? I have a Redarc charger, and I think for LI they didn’t recommend putting it in the engine bay (which can be cooler or hotter depending on how you mount, shielding, venting, etc), but not sure what the recommendation is for your unit.

In case it wasn't clear, the Victron 12/24 15 charger is charging a Yeti Goal Zero 1500X power station which will ride in the cargo area and not a battery in the engine compartment.

I also have a Redarc BCDC 1225D that charges an Odyssey Group 31 AGM [EDIT: both of which are] which *is* mounted in the engine bay on the passenger's side. I've had it installed for a year and have had no problems with the Redarc or the AGM battery whatsoever.

As for the Victron 12/24 15, I am not planning on mounting the charger in the engine bay. I have an Anderson SB50 connector on the driver's side below the dash that's connected to a 50A Blue Sea breaker in the engine bay which then runs straight to the main battery all with 6 GA wire.

What I am planning on doing is mounting the Victron charger to a wooden board with a blower for cooling. I'll add some sort of handle to the board for transport. Wires wil be anchored to the board. It will probably end up looking a bit "MacGyvered" but it will be portable and allow me to charge the 1500X from any 12V power source, even my own 2nd battery.

I may run some sort of connection from my 2nd battery into the cabin on the passenger side but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

 

[Scylth]

In case it wasn't clear, the Victron 12/24 15 charger is charging a Yeti Goal Zero 1500X power station which will ride in the cargo area and not a battery in the engine compartment.

I also have a Redarc BCDC 1225D that charges an Odyssey Group 31 AGM [EDIT: both of which are] which *is* mounted in the engine bay on the passenger's side. I've had it installed for a year and have had no problems with the Redarc or the AGM battery whatsoever.

As for the Victron 12/24 15, I am not planning on mounting the charger in the engine bay. I have an Anderson SB50 connector on the driver's side below the dash that's connected to a 50A Blue Sea breaker in the engine bay which then runs straight to the main battery all with 6 GA wire.

What I am planning on doing is mounting the Victron charger to a wooden board with a blower for cooling. I'll add some sort of handle to the board for transport. Wires wil be anchored to the board. It will probably end up looking a bit "MacGyvered" but it will be portable and allow me to charge the 1500X from any 12V power source, even my own 2nd battery.

I may run some sort of connection from my 2nd battery into the cabin on the passenger side but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

I apologize if this is (another) repeat question, but I assume you don’t have a drawer system?

 

[FrazzledHunter]

I apologize if this is (another) repeat question, but I assume you don’t have a drawer system?

No I don't have one of those.

 

[Aifer]

Jumping into this thread.
I am considering a dual battery setup with Redarc and fridge and other aux battery consumers.
But, I see more solutions such as Yeti and Goal Zero that you can secure in the trunk, get it charge by the car 12DC and power the fridge. Why not?
What are the benefits of dual battery setup ?

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Jumping into this thread.
I am considering a dual battery setup with Redarc and fridge and other aux battery consumers.
But, I see more solutions such as Yeti and Goal Zero that you can secure in the trunk, get it charge by the car 12DC and power the fridge. Why not?
What are the benefits of dual battery setup ?

I started out with just a Redarc 1225D dual battery setup and I really thought I would be done.*
I then added a Yeti 1500X mainly for the enormous 100AH DC supply for our Dometic fridge/freezer and the 2000W inverter.
But we only take the Yeti and refrigerator combination on camping trips.
So the advantage of the second battery is that it's ALWAYS with you and ALWAYS charged and ready to go in case you or someone else needs a jump which you can't do with the Yeti.
The second battery can of course run all sorts of DC loads and I can also charge the Yeti with it if I absolutely had to.

*Things do tend to snowball.

 

[Aifer]

I started out with just a Redarc 1225D dual battery setup and I really thought I would be done.*
I then added a Yeti 1500X mainly for the enormous 100AH DC supply for our Dometic fridge/freezer and the 2000W inverter.
But we only take the Yeti and refrigerator combination on camping trips.
So the advantage of the second battery is that it's ALWAYS with you and ALWAYS charged and ready to go in case you or someone else needs a jump which you can't do with the Yeti.
The second battery can of course run all sorts of DC loads and I can also charge the Yeti with it if I absolutely had to.

*Things do tend to snowball.

Thanks for the reply.
How long does it take your car to charge the yeti?
On my trips I camp for one night and than move. Would a yeti 500x be sufficient for one night usage of fridge and
Get charged the day after while driving?

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Thanks for the reply.
How long does it take your car to charge the yeti?
On my trips I camp for one night and than move. Would a yeti 500x be sufficient for one night usage of fridge and
Get charged the day after while driving?

I use a Victron Orion-Tr Smart 12/24-Volt 15 amp 360-Watt DC-DC Charger set to power supply mode. It can charge the Yeti at 360Watts but the time it takes to charge obviously depends on how much it's discharged. Yeti's website gives charge times for their various combinations of batteries and charging devices based on %discharge.

Yeti now has a car charger that can charge at a rate of 600W which wasn't available when I bought my 1500X to that's why I have the Victron unit.

I would think that a 500X would be more than sufficient for 1 day/night and a fridge. But I err on over-engineering and over-sizing everything. Hey I drive a Land Cruiser LOL!

 

[grinchy]

Thanks for the reply.
How long does it take your car to charge the yeti?
On my trips I camp for one night and than move. Would a yeti 500x be sufficient for one night usage of fridge and
Get charged the day after while driving?

I have a small (size of a shoebox, 380Wh, 300W, LFP) stand alone battery 'solar generator'. It can power a fridge for 36+ hours and recharges easily in a day of driving off the AC outlet in the back of the rig. A 500x at 505Wh would definitely go overnight; probably 48+ hours (depends on how hungry the fridge is of course).

 

[Aifer]

I believe the market will slowly turn into LiFo solutions that are also mobile. Check what Recarc is launching on 2022

 

[spazzyfry123]

I believe the market will slowly turn into LiFo solutions that are also mobile. Check what Recarc is launching on 2022

Looks very nice! $2200 USD is a tough pill for 1200Wh, though...

 

[Aifer]

Looks very nice! $2200 USD is a tough pill for 1200Wh, though...

indeed!

 

[FrazzledHunter]

I believe the market will slowly turn into LiFo solutions that are also mobile. Check what Recarc is launching on 2022

Looks like they're competing with Goal Zero. Good! GoalZero needs more competition.

 

[spazzyfry123]

@TeCKis300 (Tellurium Carbon Potassium Lexus IS300?) I really like the ease of this. While I'm not interested in turning the 2016 Mom Mobile 200 into anything more than a glorified pavement pounder at this time (unless you can talk her into the Dobinsons MRA I want?), I think the concept rings true for my 80's minimal needs. I like simple, and, if done correctly, the removal of excess redundancy. There's already enough packed away in this thing for my long weekend camp trips, and I've got a lithium jump starter for emergencies. I know it's a 200 forum, but the discussion is applicable and already baked. Only difference I see is smart alternator of 200 vs not-smart (dumb?) alternator of 80.

At first, I was planning on the "proper" dual battery system. Two group 27 AGMs, ACR, maybe a DC-DC charger, see if I can find a place to install a RedArc sticker so the people know, all the jazz. But it's overly excessive for me to power effectively just a 65L dual zone fridge that advertises 0.7 Ah of draw (likely double if I want ice cream in Florida). I've a winch that gets used on every trip (those damn J#@ps), but in all my years I cannot recall a time that I used one without engine running (and at higher-than-idle RPMs). I've put together my comparison spreadsheet, and the cost just seems like I'm getting too Overlandy and exaggerating my needs for "proper."

Fridge has built in auto low-voltage cut:

I'm stuck between

A) Creating a larger bank as you've spelled out here (I've got a battery tray sitting here in my office waiting for me to slap another lead acid in) with continuous power run to the rear

• Would either require a fixed solar system to keep things going while parked for long periods* or
• Simply disconnecting the fridge while the truck is parked for long periods* to avoid draining the battery

B) Just running what I've already got (a single lead acid group 27) with ignition-on-signal-only sending power to the rear power source (tap into a relay or something?)

• This power source will power a power bank (~500 Wh Jackery, Goal Zero, etc.) while driving to power the fridge
  • Potential to reduce costs by going with a lower Wh pack - becomes cheapest option if so
• Disconnects truck's power to rear of truck when the truck is off so the power bank does its thing independently with enough juice between alternator charges

C) Running what I've already got (a single lead acid group 27), but with CONTINUOUS power run to the rear with a permanently mounted solar panel

*Long periods = think storage at the house...camp trips are typically a long weekend with exploring each day - meaning alternator will charge for the trip.

All of these options are close in cost between the cost of a power bank vs the auxiliary items needed to make a dual battery system fit/function (sans solar introduction for option A). All will require a power run to the rear regardless (isn't in place for the 80, nor would I want to use a typical cigarette lighter style DC plug for the fridge).

OPTION A​	OPTION B​	OPTION C​
PROS​	PROS​	PROS​
Integrated	Least labor intrusive - use what's in place and just run power to rear	"Forever" power with the permanently mounted solar
Large capacity	Portable power source	No need to tap into factory electrical to pull ignition signal
No need to tap into factory electrical to pull ignition signal	Integrated inverter, USB, DC, MPPT, etc.	Integrated
Cheapest
CONS​	CONS​	CONS​
Requires disconnecting the fridge from power to avoid dead battery	Not integrated	No redundancy with a single battery
Additional cost to include inverter (nice to have, not critical to existing plans)	Need to tap into factory electrical to pull ignition signal	Most expensive (solar + MPPT > power pack)
Potential additional cost if solar is wanted	Potential additional cost if solar is wanted
Most labor intrusive

It's funny looking at the chart. The least expensive option has the most cons. The most expensive has the least cons.

Anyway, if anything, to further the discussion on the ultimate KISS vs slightly less-KISS and avoiding full expo-bro... Curious on your thoughts. What am I overlooking?

Excellent topic. 5 stars. Would discuss again.

 

[Aifer]

I like option B

 

[NTV]

I started out with just a Redarc 1225D dual battery setup and I really thought I would be done.*
I then added a Yeti 1500X mainly for the enormous 100AH DC supply for our Dometic fridge/freezer and the 2000W inverter.
But we only take the Yeti and refrigerator combination on camping trips.
So the advantage of the second battery is that it's ALWAYS with you and ALWAYS charged and ready to go in case you or someone else needs a jump which you can't do with the Yeti.
The second battery can of course run all sorts of DC loads and I can also charge the Yeti with it if I absolutely had to.

*Things do tend to snowball.

Agree 100 percent. I started with just using jackery 1000 for my fridge but had not wired dedicated 12v charge to my jackery so last year on a 7 night trip I would drive certain days for 8hrs and not be taking advantage of this precious charging time. With the 1000w capacity I basically had almost 3 full days without needing to set up my 2 100w filing panels. But I just couldn’t get the idea of fully integrated dual battery so I am planning that in spring. Two main issues with portable power banks 1) they take up precious cargo space 2) it gets to be a pain in the ass to set them up if just heading out for a couple nights. Something satisfying knowing you just have it ready and with you all the time for dual battery. To me the being able to still bring the jackery along as redundancy and top it off while driving is just a great option. This keeps me away from having to install an inverter in the 200 which I feel is overkill for my needs. It sure does snowball but it’s a lot of fun!

 

[NTV]

Agree 100 percent. I started with just using jackery 1000 for my fridge but had not wired dedicated 12v charge to my jackery so last year on a 7 night trip I would drive certain days for 8hrs and not be taking advantage of this precious charging time. With the 1000w capacity I basically had almost 3 full days without needing to set up my 2 100w filing panels. But I just couldn’t get the idea of fully integrated dual battery so I am planning that in spring. Two main issues with portable power banks 1) they take up precious cargo space 2) it gets to be a pain in the ass to set them up if just heading out for a couple nights. Something satisfying knowing you just have it ready and with you all the time for dual battery. To me the being able to still bring the jackery along as redundancy and top it off while driving is just a great option. This keeps me away from having to install an inverter in the 200 which I feel is overkill for my needs. It sure does snowball but it’s a lot of fun!

*just couldn’t get the idea of of full dual battery out of my head. Something happens in the brain when we say the words “well what if I run out of power” that causes this idea of I better have more than less!

 

[NTV]

@TeCKis300 (Tellurium Carbon Potassium Lexus IS300?) I really like the ease of this. While I'm not interested in turning the 2016 Mom Mobile 200 into anything more than a glorified pavement pounder at this time (unless you can talk her into the Dobinsons MRA I want?), I think the concept rings true for my 80's minimal needs. I like simple, and, if done correctly, the removal of excess redundancy. There's already enough packed away in this thing for my long weekend camp trips, and I've got a lithium jump starter for emergencies. I know it's a 200 forum, but the discussion is applicable and already baked. Only difference I see is smart alternator of 200 vs not-smart (dumb?) alternator of 80.

View attachment 2879978

At first, I was planning on the "proper" dual battery system. Two group 27 AGMs, ACR, maybe a DC-DC charger, see if I can find a place to install a RedArc sticker so the people know, all the jazz. But it's overly excessive for me to power effectively just a 65L dual zone fridge that advertises 0.7 Ah of draw (likely double if I want ice cream in Florida). I've a winch that gets used on every trip (those damn J#@ps), but in all my years I cannot recall a time that I used one without engine running (and at higher-than-idle RPMs). I've put together my comparison spreadsheet, and the cost just seems like I'm getting too Overlandy and exaggerating my needs for "proper."

Fridge has built in auto low-voltage cut:

View attachment 2879927

I'm stuck between

A) Creating a larger bank as you've spelled out here (I've got a battery tray sitting here in my office waiting for me to slap another lead acid in) with continuous power run to the rear

• Would either require a fixed solar system to keep things going while parked for long periods* or
• Simply disconnecting the fridge while the truck is parked for long periods* to avoid draining the battery

B) Just running what I've already got (a single lead acid group 27) with ignition-on-signal-only sending power to the rear power source (tap into a relay or something?)

• This power source will power a power bank (~500 Wh Jackery, Goal Zero, etc.) while driving to power the fridge
  • Potential to reduce costs by going with a lower Wh pack - becomes cheapest option if so
• Disconnects truck's power to rear of truck when the truck is off so the power bank does its thing independently with enough juice between alternator charges

C) Running what I've already got (a single lead acid group 27), but with CONTINUOUS power run to the rear with a permanently mounted solar panel

*Long periods = think storage at the house...camp trips are typically a long weekend with exploring each day - meaning alternator will charge for the trip.

All of these options are close in cost between the cost of a power bank vs the auxiliary items needed to make a dual battery system fit/function (sans solar introduction for option A). All will require a power run to the rear regardless (isn't in place for the 80, nor would I want to use a typical cigarette lighter style DC plug for the fridge).

OPTION A​	OPTION B​	OPTION C​
PROS​	PROS​	PROS​
Integrated	Least labor intrusive - use what's in place and just run power to rear	"Forever" power with the permanently mounted solar
Large capacity	Portable power source	No need to tap into factory electrical to pull ignition signal
No need to tap into factory electrical to pull ignition signal	Integrated inverter, USB, DC, MPPT, etc.	Integrated
Cheapest
CONS​	CONS​	CONS​
Requires disconnecting the fridge from power to avoid dead battery	Not integrated	No redundancy with a single battery
Additional cost to include inverter (nice to have, not critical to existing plans)	Need to tap into factory electrical to pull ignition signal	Most expensive (solar + MPPT > power pack)
Potential additional cost if solar is wanted	Potential additional cost if solar is wanted
Most labor intrusive

It's funny looking at the chart. The least expensive option has the most cons. The most expensive has the least cons.

Anyway, if anything, to further the discussion on the ultimate KISS vs slightly less-KISS and avoiding full expo-bro... Curious on your thoughts. What am I overlooking?

Excellent topic. 5 stars. Would discuss again.

Agree option B for a true KISS. But after a year that portable bank strapped down with the cords all floppy starts to motivate you to want to go full dual. Or maybe I just have an addiction to being more amped!