Jeep Tratior Needs Help Which Lc To Buy?

[Atoyot1031]

and lc's are for fat chicks.....you've got a 3rd row to remove and sqeeze em in


j/k all good and fun remember i'm coming to the *darkside*

Are you calling my wife fat, you sonuva?!? She's hot (especially considering two kids)!

Well if she can be converted from the Heep world, I guess anyone can...

(All in good fun)

 

[Walking Eagle]

ok kewl got some of what i needed there how's the vc in the hf2av? i had a np249 with a vc in my zj and swapped it out for a np242 to get rid of the vc and allow for true 50/50 split of power,

The VC is fine. You get a 50/50 split in low, or you can add a center diff lock switch and get 50/50 in high range. You can also take the VC completely out if it gives you trouble - though you will be making the transfer case act like an open differential.

also what tranny's are most reliable for the lc's?

The ones that come from the facotry. Seriously, you only get one choice for the year you buy, but none are problimatic

are there t-case swaps for you guys?

You can put a 60 series part time case in - at least that's what people do when they swap to diesels. Really though, the stock case will take care of anything you want to do unless you want a lower low range. Then it's crawler box time ($$$$$$)

of this nature as i keep seeing somthign about people trying to get part time in their lc's whats the deal with this?

Well, some people do it for mileage or to keep the front driveshaft from spinning on really tall lifts.

you guys feel the 4.5l engine is a good long distance runner?

yes, plenty of us in the 200K plus club planning on going 300K. It is after all a Toyota.

from what i'm reading i want a 97...

'93-97 anything in that range is good, '91 and '92 are good if you want to do a engine swap for more than 145hp

they all used the same axels right? floating...? and how interchangable are parts between lc's and other lc's and lc's and say chevy or somthing? jeeps interchange well with ford and chevy axel swaps between dana44a and the ford 8.8 is quite common, what's out there for you guys??not being smug just learning
and where's all of the newbie comments? you guys are being wayy too nice lolz!

Axles - we don't interchange with much. There are a couple guys running Volvo Portal Axles. Jeeps go to Dann 44's and ford 8.8 because they start out with weak crap to begin with (is that un-nice enough?). Land Cruiser axles are closer to Dana 60 or Ford 9" in strength - sans the birfields. Most everything on Landcrusiers has been built to 1 ton specs rather than 1/4 ton stuff on Jeep historically. The origonal design for the axles on the cruiser was basically copied from Dana 60 and Ford 9", and the origonal tranny was taken from a dump truck. I never had any requirements to be air dropped like the orrigonal jeeps of WWII, so low weight wasn't #1 on the list.

 

[landtank]

the years that are the best for easy modding beyond the simple lift are the ones with a Sombrero on the grill. This is mainly do to having OBDII electronics. Fuel management for forced induction is a slam dunk and if you want to add a York OBA system there is no pair valve getting in the way. These also get better MPG out of the box.

For me personally I put OBDII as second behind lockers as far as priority goes.

 

[Nay]

Axles - we don't interchange with much. There are a couple guys running Volvo Portal Axles. Jeeps go to Dann 44's and ford 8.8 because they start out with weak crap to begin with (is that un-nice enough?). Land Cruiser axles are closer to Dana 60 or Ford 9" in strength - sans the birfields. Most everything on Landcrusiers has been built to 1 ton specs rather than 1/4 ton stuff on Jeep historically. The origonal design for the axles on the cruiser was basically copied from Dana 60 and Ford 9", and the origonal tranny was taken from a dump truck. I never had any requirements to be air dropped like the orrigonal jeeps of WWII, so low weight wasn't #1 on the list.

The front end is not one-ton. It's comparable to a Dana 44, which can make it a bit suspect on a rig this heavy. Good reason to keep weight low and it's a consideration on tire sizes.

A front swap would be an interesting story, because you'd really need to go Dana 60 to improve on it, and then you are dealing with a pretty big clearance loss as well as loss of the factory locker. Better to truss it and upgrade the axles and birfs if you are getting truly hardcore (body damage likely trails with tires 37"+).

But is is a good fit for the 80 - most breakage we hear about has a pretty distinctive reason that was more about the driver than the axle. Not always, but plenty of the time. It you fix stupid with strength in one part of the system stupid will always find the next weak spot

 

[THEIZZARDKING]

kewl thanks for the info pretty much what i was looking for the toyo hat on the grill is a good tip on what to look out for i drove around for a few hours today trying to find a couple to drive and look at these things are pretty hard to find here in teh northwest anybody know someone or know a place thats good for these,

obtw, i was in a yota dealership i told the guy i'm only intrested in the 80 series lc's becuase of off road performance and he said we dont have those but have seen the new outbacks.......loz i seriously laughed at the guy, do you guys ever feel like you know way more than than most car sales men? it's just funny how if you didnt know anything you could get stuck in a samuri or somthing gay .... and i never really thought that off road capiablity was such an objective thing...hell by some standards i could call a geo metro off road capable as when i was in college we did some mudding and whoops in one of those with a little hand winch lolz

so i've done some reading whats the deal with the pero perdo....somthing like that, and please help me find ma lc in washington cheer and beers guys!

 

[Walking Eagle]

The front end is not one-ton. It's comparable to a Dana 44, which can make it a bit suspect on a rig this heavy.

humm.... what's the weight carrying rating on the land cruiser pickups? 1 ton?

 

[green73]

If you want a visual on what to look for concerning factory lockers, crawl under a TRD Tacoma, or most any FJ Cruiser. You will see a wiring harness, and an electric motor. It will be obvious that it is factory e-locked by the diff alone, if you can't see any details of the interior due to tint. For starters 285's (metric 33's) fit an FJ/FZJ80 without a lift. If I am correct it takes 3-4" of lift on a ZJ/WJ/XJ for that size tire. Hopefully you find one that is good for you and your purpose. After the 1st Cruiser, you'll probably want another!

 

[FJBen]

here's my advice.

Find the cleanest cruiser with the most history of maintenance you can find. Definitely put locker preference up there, but I'd rather have a very nicely maintained unlocked cruiser over a so-so locked.

The only difference between an unlocked and locked is just that...the lockers. The axles are the same/full floater/abs/stregth. You can always run ARB's. some actually prefer ARB's over factory lockers.

Make sure to TEST the factory lockers on a dirt road too when you are buying. They most likely will be sticky because people didn't use them. If the both engage then you are good to go. If they don't, it could be either you just have to keep "exercising" them (on/off) and driving in figure 8's or S's until they engage. if they don't engage, there is some troubleshooting that could be somthing simple...OR could be shot actuators which are like $500 from Toyota...used $200 or you "might" be able to rebuild. A good bargaining point if they don't work.

If you are going to lift and run 35's (doesn't everyone?) you'll want to regear so you'll be in the diff's to put in ARB's anyway if the rig doesn't have them. You can run the ARB's off of the factory E-locker switch if you want it to look factory

Drive as many as you can. I have owned some REALLY nice ones, and test driven some REALLY bad ones. You can still find original owner rigs and those are usually kept in better shape. Check with the dealers as they get them in trade in and usually are sent to wholesalers or auction. maybe you can catch them before the go there.

Then the mods come and thats all the fun part.

 

[Nay]

humm.... what's the weight carrying rating on the land cruiser pickups? 1 ton?

Right, that's why people break it. It's a half-ton axle on a one-ton application. No different than Jeep using a Dana 30 on a Grand Cherokee - in fact, I'd say we are busting way more R&P's than the Jeep crowd on Dana 30 4.88's (they have a better fuse in the Spicer u-joint, so not an apples to apples comparison).

This isn't a negative - a lighter front end with the strength to clearance ratio of a Toyota 8" is a very good choice for a hardcore but not extreme rock crawler/daily driver. The Toy 8" front has about the clearance of a Dana 35 with a good axle size and R&P strength along with a reasonably solid housing. It's a very good front axle choice for our typical 33"-35" application (note my choice of 5.29's in said axle).

A few of us refer to this axle as "mini-truck crap", and I disagree. You are the first to refer to it as "one-ton" .

Unless you are going into the really hardcore chop top stuff, going to a one ton front end would probably have more drawbacks than advantages - the trailer queen crowd would not face those problems with a shaved pumpkin setup like a ProRock 60, but you don't daily drive a reduced differential volume setup on an AWD vehicle if you care about the effects of proper lubrication.

Bottom line: The 80 has probably the highest tolerance before you get out of the box of just about any rig ever factory produced except the Rubicon Unlimited. It is flat out designed to handle 35" tires with very little downside. Outside of semantics, choose your favorite 3"-4" lift, slap on your 35's of choice, add sliders and t-case skid, do bumpers if you want them (front is needed cosmetically, rear really is not), regear at some point to 4.88 or 5.29, and wheel the crap out of it. The only hitch is caster correction, which may influence your lift choice.

You'll even be damn comfortable stopping at the mall on your way home.

Most of the other stuff on this forum is largely spawned from the OCD types who buy these vehicles . For example, people who are convinced that this platform will go 300K miles without a blip in the far corners of the world on contaminated local fuel in brutal conditions with no real maintenance but also order Blackstone oil analysis wear reports every 6K miles and report the results in a near feverish state to the great acclaim of forum approval plus a recommendation to make sure they check again at the next oil change.

 

[shinton]

Ok, so my licence tag says JEEPNERD on the back of my 93 Cruzr so I am "with ya" on the jeep thing.

I have owned a 97 ZJ with the 5.2L and now the 93 FJ80 and I will tell you the POWER vs your ZJ is gonna feel awful.

However that is deceptive, the yota has GOBS of torque so for offroading purposes it as good/BETTER setup. For stop light to stop light performance, the ZJ would spank the FJ all day long. (Who cares...)

For towing...let me get back to you on that this summer. I towed 5000+ miles with my ZJ and it did great. I am expecting to tow some with my FJ and because of the torque, it will do fine, but I won't be in any hurry to take off. (Sold my diesel excursion, if you wanna tow FAST go diesel anyway...)

So with that said, take your time, get a FJ with factory lockers and enjoy. If the ZJs had factory F&R lockers though...I would still be tempted by them. I lean 'yota mostly because of connections in the family...but still love Jeeps too (owned 4 to date, restoring a 46 willys with dad now)

Sam

 

[THEIZZARDKING]

cool good to hear! how do you guys feel about a 99 with the v-8 is this still part of the 80's series?
yea i test drove a few yesterday and they where really slow in comp. to the 5.9L but really anything will seems slow next to that lolz but still far better then some of the other suv's that i thought about, tried a 4runner for chits and giggles not much better @ all and really not worth the down grade imo,
so i'm looking @ the 80's series only, yea i really like ma jeep but it breaks to much and with age i'm finding i'm far to lazy to be spending hours freezing in the driveway fixing the dam thing, here is ma history with her i ve replace the 46re tranny @ 150,000 2 fuel pumps 2 steering pumps , battery cables,e-fan,blower motor, a/c sompressor,rear lift gate,t case swap,sways,wiring problems,front and rear axel bearings, gears now 4.11's from 3.72 (i thnk), and it keeps on going i feel if i was to seel it start out with a more stable platform and build from there all of the money i dumped into repairs i could have had lockers bumpers fpik throttle bodys, pipes and pretty much all of the other cool stuff i wanted when i first got the zj, the only thing that keeps me holding on is the look on the asians faces when i blow the doors off thier honda's @ the stop light then rip off road up trail, but like our goverment it's just a money pit.....


what are the advantages of arb-air lockers over the stock (electric?)-lockers ?
what's the most hp/tq you guys get from the 4.5(7?)L engine? built of course thanks guys!!!

 

[sprocket3]

The 99 is a 100 series LC (98-2007 years). That is a whole different machine and has it's strong points as well. Most consider it less of a hard core wheeling machine though. Some still wheel it pretty hard anyway. Depends on what you want from it.

 

[Atoyot1031]

cool good to hear! how do you guys feel about a 99 with the v-8 is this still part of the 80's series?
yea i test drove a few yesterday and they where really slow in comp. to the 5.9L but really anything will seems slow next to that lolz but still far better then some of the other suv's that i thought about, tried a 4runner for chits and giggles not much better @ all and really not worth the down grade imo,
so i'm looking @ the 80's series only, yea i really like ma jeep but it breaks to much and with age i'm finding i'm far to lazy to be spending hours freezing in the driveway fixing the dam thing, here is ma history with her i ve replace the 46re tranny @ 150,000 2 fuel pumps 2 steering pumps , battery cables,e-fan,blower motor, a/c sompressor,rear lift gate,t case swap,sways,wiring problems,front and rear axel bearings, gears now 4.11's from 3.72 (i thnk), and it keeps on going i feel if i was to seel it start out with a more stable platform and build from there all of the money i dumped into repairs i could have had lockers bumpers fpik throttle bodys, pipes and pretty much all of the other cool stuff i wanted when i first got the zj, the only thing that keeps me holding on is the look on the asians faces when i blow the doors off thier honda's @ the stop light then rip off road up trail, but like our goverment it's just a money pit.....


what are the advantages of arb-air lockers over the stock (electric?)-lockers ?
what's the most hp/tq you guys get from the 4.5(7?)L engine? built of course thanks guys!!!

Negative, that is a 100 Series. All 80s have I-6s. Not only that, but the 100s have IFS. My 80 runs great with a supercharger and exhaust. Not sure of hp though...

 

[THEIZZARDKING]

any differance in preformance between the dual pipe setup and the sright pipe change in 95? also do the chargers come stock? oh and dont know if you guys noticed but what kind of lockers are teh stock ones? air, e ,mech?

 

[FJBen]

any differance in preformance between the dual pipe setup and the sright pipe change in 95? also do the chargers come stock? oh and dont know if you guys noticed but what kind of lockers are teh stock ones? air, e ,mech?

The duals is just side by side cats and those are on OBDII setups. Those exhaust actually run lower "under" the frame as opposed to earlier setups. Dunno if there is actually ANY noticeable difference.

Chargers don't come stock, but you could (dunno if still) get them for the 80 series.

The lockers are electrical. There is an electrical motor on the diff that locks/unlocks. Pretty slick setup. You can actually convert it to cable actuated as well.

Looks like this: I have the sensor plate off, but you get the idea.

 

[THEIZZARDKING]

thats pretty cool i'd way rather have stock e lockers over arb air anyday, but then again... how many of you guys run on board air? i havent yet but was concidering it but was thinking the plumbing/labour and cost would out weigh what i would gain from it.... still thinking i would be better of with e lockers and a mini costco air pump lolz.... what e-lockers are available for you guys? non stock. easton makes one for the lc?
i like e lockers less clicking more dependable engage , either that or mech but i also dont want to drill holes for the mech. wire and handle..... can you get an after market elocker and run it with the stock wiring and switch?

 

[FJBen]

thats pretty cool i'd way rather have stock e lockers over arb air anyday, but then again... how many of you guys run on board air? i havent yet but was concidering it but was thinking the plumbing/labour and cost would out weigh what i would gain from it.... still thinking i would be better of with e lockers and a mini costco air pump lolz.... what e-lockers are available for you guys? non stock. easton makes one for the lc?
i like e lockers less clicking more dependable engage , either that or mech but i also dont want to drill holes for the mech. wire and handle..... can you get an after market elocker and run it with the stock wiring and switch?

Whats available aftermarket...um ARB ;p for selectable... Thats it.

Pretty much everyone runs some sort of OBA...be it small compressor, York or CO2 driven. Check the FAQ's...there is a lot of different writeups and methods.

People have been known to swap E-lockers for ARB's...just saying. If installed correctly, the ARB is not less dependable. I've had them on various rigs and so have friends without issue. I did however have to replace the actuator on my old 80 series as it was rusted shut (there's a breather line that disattached and allowed water/snow in and not out.) That wasa $200 used....new is $500 for just the actuator.

 

[MJADDICTION]

I've owned a bunch of Jeeps, still own one. The 80 series is incredible in my opinion. Fit and finish is industrial, yet refined. What I mean is, everything is built tough, but it doesn't leave you with that big truck/ minimalist feeling.

Compared to my 4.0 HO XJ, the FJ is slower, BUT. Really after driving the slower of the 80 series (3FE), I've gotten used to her. AND really she moves along just fine. They still have some power, but the ride, and build is really incredible. I drive mine every day with 210,000 miles on the clock, and would drive it anywhere. Reliable, worry free driving. I've been pulling a trailer, wheelin' in some of the most ridiculous mud on a j home building job site, pulled a whole palette of 105 8" concrete block about 50 feet, piled her insides with tons of construction gear, and just a lot of general abuse. Cold weather, warm weather, just anything you throw at these things, they will gladly take it.

I really thought I's d swap out to a 350 Chebby, but these 80's are all about the Yota thing. They aren't meant to move fast, they're meant to move mountains. I'll rebuild the 3FE when, if she ever goes. I've become a really big fan of the timing gear driven 3FE, and non-computerized tranny. The whole thing just screams utility... now if only I could convince my local rental center that I can pul a trailer with a bobcat on it...

Hopping from the XJ to the 80, I really notice how tight the Yota is, even with over 200 grand on the clock.

The 80 series really is a Classic 4x4 Yota. There just isn't anything like them on the planet.

Find one that has been well cared for. I found one with a lot of maint. and new parts. Well worth the extra cash for a good one.