I am at my wits end on the ignition problem with my 78 FJ40 with 2F engine. It has the OME electronic ignition system on it. Was running fine, but I had a rear main seal leak. Pulled tranny and transfer case and replaced seal. After putting back together, started her up and it ran fine for a few minutes. Then, sometimes it would run for 5 minutes and next time only 1 minute. Now, she will not crank at all. I don't see how the tranny and transfer case removal could have anything to do with this, I think the ignition problem is a separate problem. With the ignition switch on, I have power to the two prong plug that feeds the ignitor. But it seems as though I have nothing after that, but I really don't know how to check on down the line to see if the ignitor, coil, or distributor are the cause of my problem. Thought about getting an ignitor, coil and distributor from cruiserparts.net and just replace all of these, but I hate to spend $250 if I can narrow the problem down. Can anyone out there in cruiser land offer me any help or advice? I have always prided myself on being a fairly good mechanic, but this one has me by the balls, and I need them for more fun things. Help me please if you can...
Ignitor or coil or ????
- Thread starter gibgoaz8
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Check to see that all the starter electrical connections are tight. I also run an engine ground to frame and a frame to body ground. If all you did was repalce the rear main which probably involved removing the BH, the electricals may be the culprit.
The ground straps are a good idea.....even if I am off base
Ed
The ground straps are a good idea.....even if I am off base
Ed
so is it cranking right now? if not start there, easily could have bumped a wire by the starter, or ground issue. The engine should crank over with or without the coil.
darn it Ed, you type faster than me
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When you say "won't crank", do you mean it won't crank (starter will not turn the crankshaft) or do you mean the engine won't start?
- Thread starter
- #5
I'm sorry, I am new to the site and did not put all of the details in. She turns over real well. Put a new battery in a while back and she turns over real fast, but the engine will not crank up. Like I said, fire is getting to the plug that feeds the igniter but when I pull a spark plug wire and come close to a ground, no spark at all. Any help will be appreciated...
1- Run a seperate wire from the - batt to the coil bracket and make sure all contacts under the screws are good.
Try that if it don't work.
2-Test your coil for firing , if it is firing your problem , is either igniter or distributor .
3- Post your results , it will make it easier once the condition of the coil is known.
To eliminate confusion try not to say " I got fire going to...." when you mean "I got power going to ....."
and not to say "cranck" when you mean "start"
Try that if it don't work.
2-Test your coil for firing , if it is firing your problem , is either igniter or distributor .
3- Post your results , it will make it easier once the condition of the coil is known.
To eliminate confusion try not to say " I got fire going to...." when you mean "I got power going to ....."
and not to say "cranck" when you mean "start"
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Use a meter to measure the resistance of the distributor pickup. Test across the 2 pins of the connector at the dissy. Post up results.
Maybe post a pic of the coil/ignitor unit. It might be helpful to see the condition & quantity of wires at the screw terminals on the coil, and the mounting bolts.
Maybe post a pic of the coil/ignitor unit. It might be helpful to see the condition & quantity of wires at the screw terminals on the coil, and the mounting bolts.
I had the same problem with mine. I ended up testing the primary resistance and the secondary resistance on my coil and found it was bad, but still no spark from the distibuter to the plugs. got into the dist. and the pickup coil inside there was all gunked up over 30 years. Took the two screws out and cleaned it with a wire brush and then put it back in careful to set the gap and she started up no problem.
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- #10
VICM: I guess I am dumber than I thought on mechanics. How do I test my coil for firing?
Do what Jim said as qouted below and post the result, and post pics if you can.
----------------
Here is how you test the coil,
https://forum.ih8mud.com/40-55-series-tech/196883-testing-ignition-coil.html
The 2 prone plug going to the igniter, are sure you got power in both wires there with the key (ON)?
Also did you try to run a good grounding wire to the coil bracket.
----------------
Here is how you test the coil,
https://forum.ih8mud.com/40-55-series-tech/196883-testing-ignition-coil.html
The 2 prone plug going to the igniter, are sure you got power in both wires there with the key (ON)?
Also did you try to run a good grounding wire to the coil bracket.
Consider fuel filter??
I'm not an expert on FJ40's... but... When a car starts for a few minutes and then stalls... then it is not the starter, plugs, distributor, alternator or ground. These things all run exactly the same from the second the engine starts until it is cut off.
First I would inspect the fuel filter or line. That would make the exact problem you describe. Did you mess with the fuel tank or lines? One of two best ways to test it... 1. Remove the fuel filter and gently blow in it, if its clogged you can tell. They only cost $5. Or easier.... Spray some engine starter fluid in the carb while turning it over. If it starts and runs while spraying... but then stalls after you stop spraying its not getting enough fuel. Probably fuel filter but could also be fuel pump depending on what year your 40 is. And as we all know... the carb on the 40 ain't too reliable.
The easiest way to test your coil is to pull one wire off a plug. Pull back the rubber protector. Put the metal connector very close to engine or another grounded object (DO NOT HOLD IN YOUR HAND... 100,000 volts hurts very badly... I KNOW BY EXPERIENCE). Have someone turn the key.... If you see a spark jumping from the wire to the engine then you are probably OK. Can't see why your timing would be off from tranny work. If the dizzy or coil was bad it wouldn't start at all.
Yeah, these are backyard diagnostics... I used to have a muscle car that broke down all the time, my old man taught me them.
Remember the basics first. Needs gas, air and spark to run. If it won't run its probably not getting one of these. Check them all. If it runs poorly/stalls then it needs fine tuning on one of the above!!
When you hear hoofs coming... you think its a horse right... not a zebra.
I'm not an expert on FJ40's... but... When a car starts for a few minutes and then stalls... then it is not the starter, plugs, distributor, alternator or ground. These things all run exactly the same from the second the engine starts until it is cut off.
First I would inspect the fuel filter or line. That would make the exact problem you describe. Did you mess with the fuel tank or lines? One of two best ways to test it... 1. Remove the fuel filter and gently blow in it, if its clogged you can tell. They only cost $5. Or easier.... Spray some engine starter fluid in the carb while turning it over. If it starts and runs while spraying... but then stalls after you stop spraying its not getting enough fuel. Probably fuel filter but could also be fuel pump depending on what year your 40 is. And as we all know... the carb on the 40 ain't too reliable.
The easiest way to test your coil is to pull one wire off a plug. Pull back the rubber protector. Put the metal connector very close to engine or another grounded object (DO NOT HOLD IN YOUR HAND... 100,000 volts hurts very badly... I KNOW BY EXPERIENCE). Have someone turn the key.... If you see a spark jumping from the wire to the engine then you are probably OK. Can't see why your timing would be off from tranny work. If the dizzy or coil was bad it wouldn't start at all.
Yeah, these are backyard diagnostics... I used to have a muscle car that broke down all the time, my old man taught me them.
Remember the basics first. Needs gas, air and spark to run. If it won't run its probably not getting one of these. Check them all. If it runs poorly/stalls then it needs fine tuning on one of the above!!
When you hear hoofs coming... you think its a horse right... not a zebra.
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OP states in post #5 that the spark test shows no spark at the plug wire.
I will go out on a limb and say it is probably not the coil. I have never seen a stock coil of any kind fail. I have only seen after market, high performance, super duper, high voltage, shazzam coils fail due to overheating or insulation breakdown.
If you would take a minute and measure the resistance of the distributor pick up coil, like Jim C suggested, that might point you to the problem.
In the absence of any new information, then just go ahead and replace both the pick up and the ignitor and it should solve your problem. Then you will have one spare because chances are that both of them aren't bad.
If you would take a minute and measure the resistance of the distributor pick up coil, like Jim C suggested, that might point you to the problem.
In the absence of any new information, then just go ahead and replace both the pick up and the ignitor and it should solve your problem. Then you will have one spare because chances are that both of them aren't bad.
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I have also not seen a Denso coil fail electronically.
However, I have seen a number of failed coils here in the rust belt, but only because the can rusted out where it crimps on the plastic tower. This will be obvious by the rust and oily residue. Once the oil leaks out, the coil no worky.
So show us a pic of the junk. We may spot something that the untrained eye misses.
However, I have seen a number of failed coils here in the rust belt, but only because the can rusted out where it crimps on the plastic tower. This will be obvious by the rust and oily residue. Once the oil leaks out, the coil no worky.
So show us a pic of the junk. We may spot something that the untrained eye misses.
- Thread starter
- #16
Ignitor, coil or ????
I checked the resistance across the two prongs going to the distributor and got a reading of 164.8 ohms. Attached are 3 pictures that hopefully will help. Please note that I have a ground wire attached from the - terminal of the battery to one of the screws that holds the cover down on the ignitor. This screw also goes into the coil bracket. So, should have a good ground. Also, please note coil is new, but this was installed shortly after I started having all of my problems and has not helped a bit. Old coil that I took off is probably just fine. Had no reason to replace coil, just thought it may be my problem. Have not tested coil yet, will do this tomorrow. Also took, coil bracket, all screws and all places of metal to metal contact and sanded and wire brushed them so I should have a good ground. Also, the 2 prong connector going to the ignitor has power on both prongs with the ignition turned on. Hopefully the pictures will help. I want to thank you all so very much for the help that you have been so far. I am a rookie to this site, but it is the BEST.
I checked the resistance across the two prongs going to the distributor and got a reading of 164.8 ohms. Attached are 3 pictures that hopefully will help. Please note that I have a ground wire attached from the - terminal of the battery to one of the screws that holds the cover down on the ignitor. This screw also goes into the coil bracket. So, should have a good ground. Also, please note coil is new, but this was installed shortly after I started having all of my problems and has not helped a bit. Old coil that I took off is probably just fine. Had no reason to replace coil, just thought it may be my problem. Have not tested coil yet, will do this tomorrow. Also took, coil bracket, all screws and all places of metal to metal contact and sanded and wire brushed them so I should have a good ground. Also, the 2 prong connector going to the ignitor has power on both prongs with the ignition turned on. Hopefully the pictures will help. I want to thank you all so very much for the help that you have been so far. I am a rookie to this site, but it is the BEST.
That pickup coil resistance is fine to me, mine is 144.5 ohms.
Check the coil for firing by removing the HT wire from the coil .
Run wire from ground and hold it close to the coil HT output (1/2" will do). Crank and see if you get a steady spark from the coil.
If you do, you need to look at the HT circit.
If you don't , check the 3 prone plug going from igniter to distributor, if everything is connected and tight, you need igniter.
From what I see in the pics.
The HT wire looks like it is installed backwards and the whole thing is too close to the battery,not good for saftey.
Check the coil for firing by removing the HT wire from the coil .
Run wire from ground and hold it close to the coil HT output (1/2" will do). Crank and see if you get a steady spark from the coil.
If you do, you need to look at the HT circit.
If you don't , check the 3 prone plug going from igniter to distributor, if everything is connected and tight, you need igniter.
From what I see in the pics.
The HT wire looks like it is installed backwards and the whole thing is too close to the battery,not good for saftey.
check coil wire at starter
Also check the wire from starter solenoid to + terminal of coil. Provides 12V to coil during cranking, ignition switch provides power when you release the key.
Also check the wire from starter solenoid to + terminal of coil. Provides 12V to coil during cranking, ignition switch provides power when you release the key.
coil testing
here is how to shoot the coil windings
I found the FSM specs on a post about a 78 --should be close in any case
you want low resistance on the primary windings and high (Kohms) on the secondary
also when checking the coil scratch a little paint off the case and check pri and sec to the case if you have continuity to the case ---bad
Make sure you disconnect the wires before you shoot it
dont worry about small deviations from the specs on the resistance---probably would just be open or shorted anyway
Like the others said it is not real failure prone but checking the coil will at least put your mind to rest on it so you can look elsewhere
There is also a required gap for the pickup coil that you may want to check
here is how to shoot the coil windings
I found the FSM specs on a post about a 78 --should be close in any case
you want low resistance on the primary windings and high (Kohms) on the secondary
also when checking the coil scratch a little paint off the case and check pri and sec to the case if you have continuity to the case ---bad
Make sure you disconnect the wires before you shoot it
dont worry about small deviations from the specs on the resistance---probably would just be open or shorted anyway
Like the others said it is not real failure prone but checking the coil will at least put your mind to rest on it so you can look elsewhere
There is also a required gap for the pickup coil that you may want to check
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With the fully eletronic ingnition, there is no ballast resistor , so the coil is always getting 12v , no need for the wire you mentioned.
