Hardwood Flooring Installation Questions

[dkroth]

I'm planning on laying a hardwood floor in the diningroom. I've not done this before, but I've done a little research and it looks straightforward. However, I do still have a couple questions:

1) How do you nail the first/last few boards? When you're too close to the wall to use the nailer, what do you do?

2) Nails or staples? I've seen both talked about and advertised. What are the plusses and minuses for both?

There's some good info in the archives here, but no one addresses these specific questions.

Thanks!

 

[Johnnymiz]

1.you face nail them.
2.real hard wood, i used nails with a portanailer.

 

[Michael Hanson]

Face nail near the walls, I use a nail gun (spot nails) but doesnt matter what brand. I also keep pieces of 2x4 etc. material around to jam the boards in real tight next to the walls, while still leaving about1/2 inch gap at the walls themselves for expansion. Lay the floors very tight with very little crack between individual boards,never lay joints in 2 rows next to each other. Put the boards in the room several days beore you lay them,keep house temp. constant until finished. Mike

 

[Gumby]

I just laid almost 900 sq. ft. of pre-finished oak in my house.

Rent an air powered floor stapler. Buy an air powered finish nailer. Every project requires at least one good tool purchase. The finish nailer will make a lot of things go easier with the floor and you'll have it afterwards. Use it to do the first and last rows. If you don't have one, rent or buy a power miter saw.

Turn a board to use as the transition when at a doorway.

Lay out 10-15 rows about 2' in front of where you are working. Make sure no end is within 3-4 inches of an end in the previous or next row.

Get the boards as tight as possible to each other.

Get good knee pads.

Best prices I found was at Lumber Liquidators.

Feel free to PM with any questions.

 

[dkroth]

Thanks for the input guys. I think I've got a handle on it.

Gumby, I've got all the tools (and air) escept for the floor nailer. Home Depot rents them by the day, so I've got that covered too.

I'll have to do a couple test runs with my finish nailer on the bench just to make sure I can tuck the nail into the tongue without splitting the board or exposing the nail. Either one of those would be a problem fitting the next board.

 

[Johnnymiz]

get yourself a good nail set

 

[jjbodean1970]

I'll have to do a couple test runs with my finish nailer on the bench just to make sure I can tuck the nail into the tongue without splitting the board or exposing the nail. Either one of those would be a problem fitting the next board.

i would just nail through the top of the board and countersink, fill with stainable wood filler.

 

[Gumby]

get yourself a good nail set

i would just nail through the top of the board and countersink, fill with stainable wood filler.

not needed with a good finish nailer.

Oak floor is going to require pre-drilling if you want to face nail with a hammer. You just added about 4 hours of kneeling tedious work to the job.

 

[dkroth]

Oak floor is going to require pre-drilling if you want to face nail with a hammer. You just added about 4 hours of kneeling tedious work to the job.

I ordered the Cherry on Tuesday and have to pick it up tomorrow. Not planning on nailing anything by hand if I can help it. Cherry is pretty frickin hard (much harder than oak) so my fingers are crossed that I won't be bending nails or splitting edges.

I can't get to the project for at least two weeks so the wood will have some time to cure in the house before I start.

 

[Lulu]

I'd have to agree with getting nail set, I don't care how good the nailer is, sometimes those little fawkers don't go in all the way. Better than having to leave to go get one, with a rented gun sitting at your house. I did 1500 sq ft of soft bamboo in our new house. I had to use the nail set several times to actually finish the staple. Bad form, getting tired, etc. It happens.
Another thing not mentioned here but may be in archives, make sure to undercut the door jambs, so that the wood floor slides under them.

 

[dkroth]

What do you guys recommend for handling the base boards?

Since this is an upgrade to an existing house there are existing base boards in place (and in good condition too).

I assumed I was going to pull these out, rip them to fit and reinstall (height needs to be flush with base boards in the two entrances to the room). Now I'm considering leaving the base boards in place using a 1/4 round to hide the gap between the floor and existing base board.

Recommendations?

Will the 1/4 round look low-rent? Or is that normal procedure in many installations?

Should I find a cherry 1/4 round to match the floor, or use pine and paint it to match the base board (white)?

Hmmm.

 

[WarDamnEagle]

If the flooring is prefinished then the stapler as recommended by Gumby will work. If it's the real stuff then it won't - BTDT. The only thing that will work is the one that you hit with a hammer. I laid almost 4000 ft2 of it in the last house that we built....almost killed me.

I would pull the baseboards. Even if you cover them with shoe moulding the baseboard will look too small if you don't raise them above the floor. I always like shoe moulding that matches the floor but that's just my preference. In our house we had 10' ceilings and I used a D grade 1x6 with a base cap which was all painted. I then used had special Oak shoe moulding ran to match the floors.

 

[Johnnymiz]

i painted the shoe moldings. it's preference thing. remember, dont put the shoe molding tight to the flooring. leave about a book match-thickness separating the molding from the floor. lets the floor move with the seasons AND makes is it easier to paint the molding if ur gonna paint it. and actually, i prefer a small cove molding to shoe or half round. buy a few feet of each, and see what u like better.

 

[jjbodean1970]

leave the baseboards down. pain to remove with the tops being caulked, end up tearing the sheetrock and an even bigger pain. chances are they arent sitting on the subfloor, so it wont look too small.

i did an oak quarter round stained to match the floor. looks good.

 

[WarDamnEagle]

leave the baseboards down. pain to remove with the tops being caulked, end up tearing the sheetrock and an even bigger pain. chances are they arent sitting on the subfloor, so it wont look too small.

i did an oak quarter round stained to match the floor. looks good.

Wimp! LOL

You take a box cutter and slice along the top of the baseboard before you pull it (perpendicular to the wall). That way you don't tear the sheetrock. The cut in the sheetrock will be covered by the baseboard when you move it up. Nothing worse than a 3 1/2" tall baseboard.

 

[jjbodean1970]

yeah, i know HOW you do it that way, but invariably part doesnt get cut all the way through, you get a pull, and all hell breaks loose. leave em down.

 

[bigdaddy]

I used this manual nailer Amazon - Bostich Flooring Nailer to install prefinished bamboo in a rental. Great arm work out, but it was great at keeping a tight fit between boards.

x100 on the nailset/staple setting tool, you will need it!

All good tips listed above....I would add to think about all the problem spots and how you will handle them (Door transitions, corners, uneven areas, under-cutting jams etc). I tried to do a lot of fore-thought into my layout and it made handling them easier when the time came.

I would add Advil or Tylenol and take your time and do it right. Determine where you are starting and which way to work. A helper would be nice, even if they just help you lay out the pattern and get your drinks.

Good Luck and get up some pics when you can.....

 

[dkroth]

Finally following up on my hardwood floor install. Thanks for all the great feedback and help. Mud makes this stuff easy!

A little background so you don't have to re-read the thread: Wife and I decided we wanted hardwood in our diningroom. I was also looking for a (late winter) project and figured I could save a few bucks in the process by doing it myself.

We bought Brazillian Cherry at the local Carpet One franchise. $5.99 per square foot, which I thought was fair for the product. Other woods are cheaper, some are more expensive. We liked this. Brazillian cherry is different from American cherry. It's a very hard wood and looks more like mahogany than the cherry I'm used to. Nevertheless, there it is.

We bought the wood in February. I had some minor surgery that distracted me for a while. I knew it was coming so the delay was no big deal. It gave the wood some extra time to acclimatize to our house.

First, tore out the old carpet and pad. Duh. The subfloor was originally put in with construction adhesive and (power) nails. I screwed it down with 2" drywall screws to eliminate the chance of any future squeaks.

The flooring store sold me a paper/tar underlayment. I almost switched to 15 lb builder's felt based on some internet reserach, but didn't. No big deal either way, I think.

Rented a Bostitch pneumatic nailer from Home Depot for $36 per day. Nails were $15 per box - only needed 1 box. I pre-drilled and face nailed the first 4 rows, making sure I centered the boards in the room and got them square to the walls. As several people suggested, I turned a board at the enterance to the room for a nice asthetic effect. The first four rows took two evenings to complete, working slowly and taking time out for family activities. Saturday (two weeks ago) was devoted to the bulk of the floor as the rental had to to back Sunday morning or face late charges. This past weekend I put in the shoe molding and painted it up. The last piece is tonight - the threshold to the kitchen. That will accommodate the hardwood on one side and the kitchen vinyl on the other. I made it from a leftover piece of cherry.

So, it took me just over 2.5 weeks to complete in calendar time. It was probably 30 hours all-told for the actual labor. Not very cost effective as they only wanted $500 for installation. But as I said I was looking for a project and this was something new for me. Plus I did it the way I wanted it done! No one to blame but myself.

The only real pain in the azz was I had a tendinitis flare-up in my right arm just days before starting the project. That took a lot of fun out of it. Oh well.

Here are a couple pics of the finished product:

 

[dkroth]

Two more.

 

[Johnnymiz]

looks fantastic. well done!