Flex better or worse?

[WolfpackTLC]

Did a little research... now I want some opinions...

What flexes better offroad... the new Slee 6" springs, or the OME's w/ Christo's coil spacers? I have OME coils w/ Christo's spacer's now... my flex is limited by the bumpstops... I was thinking that if I just did a body lift from Marks4wd, maybe a 2", and I could run 37's or so and have GREAT flex, as opposed to 6" springs w/ no BL, and extended bumpstops.

Am I oversimplifying this?

 

[Junk]

are you concerned about flex or performance? Big difference between a poser flex and how it wheels on the trail. I'm running 36's right now, obviously not quite 37's, and have stuffed and full drooped them all over the last 2-1/2 yrs. There's not much I'm planning on changing at this point.

 

[WolfpackTLC]

Come on Junk...

NO.... no poser flex. I'm looking for trail performance... I've lifted my wheels more than I'd like (front especially) around here @ Tellico and GWNF...

 

[Curran]

Neglecting the body lift, your overall suspension travel will be the roughly the same for both the five and six-inch lift. Up travel will be limited by the bump stops and down travel will be limited by the length of the shocks. Since both kits use the same bump stops and shocks, I think it is pretty even. The difference is the starting point.

If you’re worried about your suspension’s flexibility off road, toss your sway bars. This forum seems to think that that removing your sway bars is taboo, but if your are worried enough about off road performance in rocks to consider a body lift, do yourself a favor and DX the those things. Then go with the longer springs ‘cause it gives you the better approach, break over and departure angles. When you aren’t working against the stiffer spring and the sway bars Christo’s new springs are perfect. Plus from a quality design standpoint, fewer parts and fewer connections mean there are fewer things to go wrong with your truck when you are out in the big bad GWNF.

I have Christo's 6-inch springs and the OME L shocks front and rear with 35-inch TrXus tires. No sway bars front or rear. I can easily stuff the “small” 35 all the way up to my bump stop with a 2” drop in the rear and get darn close to my un-dropped stops in the front. I think Christo did an awesome job dialing in the specs on these springs.

Prior to this set up I was running OME 850J/863 springs with the L springs just in front.
Personally, I like the 6-inch springs without sway bars off road much better than the OME springs with sway bars.

 

[WolfpackTLC]

That's what I was thinking too, all though I've watched Shawn Jackson's rig w/ 37's, a 3" OME, and a 3" body stay PLANTED, all the way through his articulation over the crack in Moab... I have to say... that was impressive. That's my method of thought right now.... If I can let my axles travel up further, I have more flex... So... 86 the bump stop drops, raise the body, and I get the same effect, no?

 

[robbie]

I had the OME 864 in the rear with the spacers and 850 in the front with spacers (both 1.5). A real solid truck for the long haul and it did every thing I wanted expect allow more axle movement. I did not want to go to the J springs because it did not have the spring rate I wanted (with the fuel tank in the rear and the drawer system with the stuff I care). So then I moved up to the 6 inch heavy in the rear and reg in the front. I am very happy wtih the movement off road. Much more axle movement that allow the wheel to be on the ground more. Also this allow for 36 to 37 inch tires to be used. I have limite up trave in the rear to not mess up the springs or drive the tire too far up into the wheel well. I have not remove the Sway bar but used the drop brackts and spacers. I do travel alot with the truck on the road. If I was staying in an area and felt I needed more flex then I could remove the sway bars (like moab for 4-5 days). As for the Crack on golden crack, I did the upper crack section as well as many other obsticals with no complaints on axle travel with the sway bar in place. I also did white knuckle up and down this year, as well as nose dive, upchuck, double wammy and many more with more ease then I have with past systems I have used. Moab was done with 13 36 16 swampers bias ply.
On road manors need more refinment that I currently working on(spacers for the width, and stablity)
This is just my experence with my truck the way I have it set up and not to take away from any other persons experence. Yea my truck weighs alot, close aproching 6800 lbs.
later robbie

 

[NW-sickboy]

Neglecting the body lift, your overall suspension travel will be the roughly the same for both the five and six-inch lift. Up travel will be limited by the bump stops and down travel will be limited by the length of the shocks. Since both kits use the same bump stops and shocks, I think it is pretty even. The difference is the starting point.
.

Couple things (I went from the Js to the six inch spring recently)

1. I wouldnt neccesarily look at the six inch springs as a "kit". If your shocks are limiting get some bilstiens under there that are longer... i am in the process of mounting my shocks differently to get more drop (there is defenitly more to be had). Main concerns fabbing up something simple up front for the ABS wires, and something to allow the E-brake cable in the rear to drop more... right now my cable has the last brace removed.

2. I would like to think my 80 is "light" compared to other 80s. no long range tank. tubed rear bumper... trimmed the ARB up front..no rear seats. no drawere systems. In regauds to weight i kept my Sway bars in the rear but fabbed up some cool spacers and it seems to let me flex all i want. I need some stability because i am dont have much weight so it feels like my rig is WAY up there.....

3. I have tried a 2 inch spacer up front and it is great at times for breaking over and head on obstacles but seems pretty tall when i get on off camber stuff. love the up travel on it though so its on it now.

4. I felt to really get ALL the flex i wanted and still have the drivability i wanted that i need something other than the slee fron control arms so i went custom. the are a little longer and allow more flex in "theory". will get lots of product testing on these in the near future.

SO why go 6 inch springs .......


I dont think you should do it JUST for flex cause i LOVED my J's with 35's really an amazing set up that lets most guys do everything they will ever want to do(think of all the 80s your seeing on the con and in moab, most on that set up)think of . I cant count the number of times that saw my 80 and the first thing they always said was "look at the flex" and mention the stability....

I think this is the funnest part of wheeling. have fun with it...

Oh ya.. dont just dithc your BUmp stops... you will want them to stop your rig before the shocks or body do.. just place them in the right place.

Go longer shocks... but you need diffent mounts so you can get more up and down travel ..

GOOD LUCK..

 

[Tooth Fairy]

Excellent thread with posts/comments from those that regularly use/wheel their 80's.

Makes me proud.

 

[WolfpackTLC]

Wow. Hey guys thanks for all the responses.

1. My original intent was to run some 38's, perhaps even some 39's w/ trimming. Why? The red clay and wet surface wheeling we have around here requires tires OTHER than an MT/R (unless it's a 40", those self clean pretty well) that self clean, AND my heavy-ass rig )better than 7k, I'm sure) needs larger tires for better performance in the unfortunate (and inevitable) mud.

2. I'd also like to keep my COG as low as possible (I know, I know, no body lift) while still gaining enough clearance to run 38's. NW-Sickboy had mentioned in a previous post that he may have had better performance w/ his OME's.

3. I keep thinking that my limiting factor in performance (up travel) is related to the bumpstops halting the upward progress of the axle to save the body. That's why I was thinking a body lift would let me remove my bump stop extensions.

4. I'm not sure how long the L shocks are, fully extended... any body know? Christo assures me (and of course, I believe him) that my shocks are longer than the LTR's... so I guess that means Bilsteins are in order?

5. Shed Guy told me that I should consider moving the axle back an inch in the rear w/ longer control arms. He said it has no adverse affect on panhards and such. I'm inclined to believe him. Anybody else got any comments?

Thanks for all your help!

WolfpackTLC... out

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

5. Shed Guy told me that I should consider moving the axle back an inch in the rear w/ longer control arms. He said it has no adverse affect on panhards and such. I'm inclined to believe him. Anybody else got any comments?

Thanks for all your help!

WolfpackTLC... out

My rear was moved back also gives you the clearance needed to stuff 37's


Phil

 

[Uglibus]

COG and body lift are not exactly related that way. If you raise the frame and body up 2 more inches with springs or spacers you put all the weight up higher, while a 2" body lift puts only the weight of the body up 2" up so the COG will not be as high. DO NOT REVOME the bump stops even with a body lift. The 37s will smash the body hard. I have lowered them 2" and the tire still stuffs the well. 38s 39s or 40s won't fit without cutting the door or panels up on my truck with Js up front and 863 in the rear (soon to be Js) I have been surprised on the amount of cutting I have had to do and will need to do. With the stock arms up front I had to cut the inner front well out. I got 1" longer arms and will now need to cut the bumper and front of the wheel well out. Granted my trucks track width has been extended and my shocks are stock lengthish bilsteins (need to change soon). Here is a photo for fun.

 

[landtank]

I think Uglibus has posted an excellent pic of the problems of running with rims of the wrong backspacing.

 

[Uglibus]

Not wrong, but perfect!!!! 10" rims with 2.5" BS 3/4" wheel spacers in the rear very stable!!!!!

 

[hoser]

Wow, if my math is correct, your rear rims stick out 4.75" more than stock... plus the extra width of the tire! How about some more pics?

 

[WolfpackTLC]

I see.... well...

I don't mind cutting up my front fenders, and I'm running Christo's arms already...

As for the rear, I'd rather not have to (and I'm not sure how I would anyway) cut the doors up. Christo and I discussed tubbing the rear wells, and I can see that in the future... I'm running J's all the way around, w/ Christo's spacers... his 5" lift basically...

Again, I refer to the videos and pics of Shawn Jackson w/ his 3" OME and 3" body and wheeling and flexing like crazy all over Moab. I was impressed.... that's what I'd like to have, and I thought I had an advantage over him, seeing as how I've already got more lift than he does...

Anymore thoughts? Keep em' coming! I like this... gives me ideas...

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

37's will fit inside on the rear without cutting if you use longer arms. Panhard bar setup is important also if you are going fit large tires inside. My set-up is a little wider than stock but they fit.

Where would I find the videos and pics of Shawn Jackson in Moab?

Phil

 

[WolfpackTLC]

I've got Christo's panhard too.... Call me SLEE boy... ;-D

Shawn's stuff is here:

http://www.actionjackson.com/cruiser/

Pay attention to his run @ Golden Crack... WOW.

J

 

[NW-sickboy]

i forgot to state that my rear axle is also moved back an inch or so.... and you will want BS like Uglibus's if you go that big and still want stability....

I have to do some body work up front from a flop on my passenger side so i can still use my turn signal and at the same time am trying to figure out how to Cut some fender out .... Maybe we can find or get christo to post how he trimmed the front of the short bus.

 

[WolfpackTLC]

If I remember correctly.... from our conversation he told me he simply removed the fender flares and trimmed along the line that they inevitably leave... that's what I'm planning as well. BUT, you lose structural integrity of the fender. Christo says that Shortbus's fender flaps around... hmm...

All you people that moved your axles back.. did you relocate your shocks and mounts for springs and such?

J

 

[NW-sickboy]

All you people that moved your axles back.. did you relocate your shocks and mounts for springs and such?

J

thanks heads up on the trimming ....

No. did nothing with shock or spring mounts.. its only an inch/inch and a half most.... springs are fine and shocks have enough in the busshings to accomodate....i am redoing my shock mounts anyways but for different reasons.