We don't have Live Oak in my part of MO. How does it rate to Red or White Oak?
Firewood? (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter D'Animal
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After reading the question, I had to lookup about oak…. There are some crazy technical write-ups on the properties of all oak trees. They all seem to provide about the same amount of BTU’s from a cord of wood with live oak and white oak around 30,000,000 and red oak near 27,000,000. White oak and live oak are the most closely related and the USS Constitution a/k/a “Old Ironsides” was constructed of live oak.
Most oak varieties burn long, burn clean and produces little smoke when dried. I have 7 acres of red oak and white oak So it is all we ever use. Oak is also one of the most desired woods along with mesquite and other fruit wood used in BBQ smoking…On occasion I’ll find one that had died, but is still standing and the bark has dropped off. The wood has dried and aged to a washed gray color., these trees are as hard as baseball bats and can dull a saw chain in a few cuts.
now whose got a match
Most oak varieties burn long, burn clean and produces little smoke when dried. I have 7 acres of red oak and white oak So it is all we ever use. Oak is also one of the most desired woods along with mesquite and other fruit wood used in BBQ smoking…On occasion I’ll find one that had died, but is still standing and the bark has dropped off. The wood has dried and aged to a washed gray color., these trees are as hard as baseball bats and can dull a saw chain in a few cuts.
now whose got a match
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I think the Oaks in the Central Valley have a wide range of BTU output.
The Valley Oak is also called a Swamp Oak. It grows where there is an abundance of water.
When green, it cuts like white oak. There is so much moisture in the wood that you generally have to let it dry two years after it is split. It looses a lot of the weight and is as light as cottonwood. It puts out heat but burns quickly and leaves a lot of Ash.
The Black Oak or commonly called Mountain oak grows in the mountains. It doesn’t hold up to the summer heat of the Central Valley.
This cuts, dries and burns similar to the White Oak that grows in the Midwest.
The Live Oak is a very slow growing tree. They are native to the foothills. They need very little water and can be planted in the valley. I have cut 15” diameter Live Oaks that have 120 growth rings . It is slow burning and puts out serious heat. An armload of Live Oak will burn clean and complete and yield a large Yeti cup of ash from an armload of wood.
Blue Oak is a hybrid species that is a combination of the Mountain Oak and Valley Oak. The hybridization began when the native Americans moved their camps between the mountains and valley and ground the acorns together. Blue Oaks are somewhat rare.
The Valley Oak is also called a Swamp Oak. It grows where there is an abundance of water.
When green, it cuts like white oak. There is so much moisture in the wood that you generally have to let it dry two years after it is split. It looses a lot of the weight and is as light as cottonwood. It puts out heat but burns quickly and leaves a lot of Ash.
The Black Oak or commonly called Mountain oak grows in the mountains. It doesn’t hold up to the summer heat of the Central Valley.
This cuts, dries and burns similar to the White Oak that grows in the Midwest.
The Live Oak is a very slow growing tree. They are native to the foothills. They need very little water and can be planted in the valley. I have cut 15” diameter Live Oaks that have 120 growth rings . It is slow burning and puts out serious heat. An armload of Live Oak will burn clean and complete and yield a large Yeti cup of ash from an armload of wood.
Blue Oak is a hybrid species that is a combination of the Mountain Oak and Valley Oak. The hybridization began when the native Americans moved their camps between the mountains and valley and ground the acorns together. Blue Oaks are somewhat rare.
1911
chupacabra
We have a lot of Live Oak (and Red Oak) on our place. It does burn hot and long; I tend to save it for my smoker. Very dense wood.
Got up this morning to this page open on my iPad … for those interested. frankly, I still gotta cut, carry and stack it and that warms me up easily no matter which oak it is
treejourney.com
9 Reasons Why White Oak Is Better Firewood Than Red Oak
Grab your marshmallows - because there is nothing better than relaxing by a toasty fire. Whether it’s by a campfire or by a fireplace, sitting by a fire is a time to relax and unwind and
treejourney.com
Good info guys. My woods are oak of various types and hickory. The ash trees have almost all been killed by ash borer beetle. I've never tried using oak for smoking, just the hickory. I save the dead ash for the fireplace, it burns quick and has nice viewing, doesn't last long. The hard woods go in the outdoor boiler.
We forgot about the best type of oak....Free Oak, ones you don't have to cut and drag out of the woods.
We forgot about the best type of oak....Free Oak, ones you don't have to cut and drag out of the woods.
WarDamnEagle
SILVER Star
A lot of the serious BBQ pork guys in the South swear by oak vs hickory. They claim that hickory is too strong. I've tried both and not sure I could honestly tell the difference since I never had them side by side.
I read a long scientific article a few years back that said that all oak trees are subspecies of either Red Oak or White Oak. I don't recall all the details behind that thesis but I do recall the part about the acorns they produce. All White Oak species produce "sweet" acorns and all Red Oak produce "bitter" acorns. I know from personal experience that deer much prefer White Oak over Red Oak acorns. Okay, enough rambling.
Back to topic, I did cut some more with my new MS400; still incredible. I keep waiting for it to even think about bogging down but it hasn't happened yet.
So I saw these folks out back and asked them….white oak or red oak acorns….
unanimous …. They like both
unanimous …. They like both
Big Ed
SILVER Star
Live oak has the highest BTU on here, there’s no valley oak to compare it to.
Osage Orange, I believe is higher.
Big Ed
SILVER Star
Yeah, seems that and hickory are the only ones higher than live oak.
Osage Orange is hard to find around me. Years back they used it for fence posts, it doesn't rot.
pb4ugo
SILVER Star
I got more osage than I know what to do with. It's my nemesis. I hate dealing with it, but love burning it, when the temps dip or i need a long burn. Native Americans Indians it is supposed to be sacred. It's the hardest and hottest wood I've run across. It burns like coal. I burn a bunch of wood thru winter, all hardwoods, mostly 24/7, red, white, pin oak, hickory, maple, etc. Then there's osage/hedge, when you attack that tree you know you're going to get bloody. Its a nasty thorny, wirey tree that won't die easily, it grows to the light to the point where it will fall or lean and it continues to grow. Ive cut large logs and over the summer they'll grow limbs. When you cut it, it doesnt fall. It just leans because it's limbs are so intertwined with the surrounding trees it wont hit the ground. You need to pick your battles when you harvest it. If it's overcast or near dusk you can see sparks coming off the saws chain. I wouldn't burn it in an open fireplace, it sparks alot. Stove only. It's a hard wood to light, it's best to ad it to an established hot fire.
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Big Ed
SILVER Star
I searched and read where it grows, Missouri isn’t listed. It was Oklahoma, Arkansas, and Texas, and only along two specific rivers.
Big Ed
SILVER Star
Wow, nasty stuff. Reminds me of white thorn we have in the Sierra Nevada here, it’s just brush though. I’ve opened up hiking trails with it interlocked all the way across. A lot of it you had to cut all sides of a square shape to get a chunk of it out, or you could try pulling one piece out at a time. That would often catch on something and you’d have to make another cut.
It's here by me , but few and far between. Have any of you guys heard that Hedge Apples will keep spiders away if you put them in your house, etc. My kids would like to collect them and use them like softballs, smacking them with a bat.
pb4ugo
SILVER Star
I know folks who have put them in the corners of rooms to repell spiders. Idk, know if it works or not. It maybe an old wives tale. After a while they deteriorate into a gooey sticky mess. The "apples" are a ball of seeds, it's why the tree grows in rows or groups/clumps. One tree might be a several trees packed tight together. They'll roll down a hill and stop in the same place. They are heavy, maybe a couple of pounds each. They make a big thud when they drop. It's a little startling when you're deer hunting. It makes you look up to make sure none are over your head.
when i was actively building acoustic guitars Osage orange is actually a tonewood that was not your typical guitar wood. It is not uncommon but but not widely used and there is not that much of it available for commercial uses. The average guitar body requires two bookmatched pieces of at least 8-9 inches wide each so that the guitar body can have a fuller size which, of course increases tone.
I have also heard of hedge apple, which I believe is Osage orange. This was another crazy idea that I was into about 15 years ago. My grandmother always said Jack of all trades, but master of none. That mandolin was started almost 18 years ago and is still not finished.
Let it be noted that the BTU rating of different species is in BTU/volume. All species have essentially the same BTU/mass. So when it comes to firewood, the denser the better. I am currently burning ash, thanks to the emerald ash borer. We usually burn several species of hickory, oak, etc. I feel sorry for the members who have nothing but evergreen varieties.
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For what it is worth, this was my experience ...
At the start of the '70s, Osage Orange/Hedge trees were very common on the farms near where I grew up in Illinois. It was my understanding from my dad that they were planted specifically to serve as natural fence and to produce fence posts (i.e., added crop). First, a fence line of hedge was an effective boundary for keeping cows and horses from crossing plus it would provide shade in the summer and wind shelter in the winter. Second as previously mentioned, a fence built using hedge posts would last decades.
Where I grew up, the '70s was a time when a lot of farmers started to transition to grain only production so they no longer needed fences. Due to this they ripped out the fences and cut down the hedge trees. By the end of the '70s, there were very few hedge growing near by.
I do not know if my experience is an indicator of a local change or broader scope, this what I observed on the demise of hedge trees.
Finally, I appreciate hedge as a nemesis. I recall my dad mentioning that in '50 or '51, he was cutting hedge to harvest a supply of posts for new fences that were going to be built. During the cutting/stacking, his right calf was speared by a thorn. The wound festered and was slow to heal. Over the next few years, the old wound site would re-open/fester and then heal again. Fast forwarding a few years... after he returned from Korea and mustered out of the Army, he returned to farming with his father. Soon after, the old wound re-opened and this time my grandmother took an added interest. She actively pushed and poked his calf (despite his objections is my projection) to work the puss/infection out. It also yielded the tip of the thorn popping out where she was able to pull it free.
So dad had a thorn buried in his calf muscle for over 4 years. Due to this, he would probably considered hedge his nemesis too.