Dreaded Puddle of Oil!! (2 Viewers)

[Daneshavis]

I just purchased a 2009 LC200 70k miles one month ago. It was a single owner with all the service records (including water pump change). I came out to my garage this morning and found a puddle of oil (1pint) on the garage floor. I took it to a trusted mechanic and he is telling me the front crank case seal is seeping and spraying oil on the engine. I am working with the people I bought the vehicle from and they seem willing to make it right but here are my concerns.

1. Is this the sign of trouble to come. I have owned many Toyotas and reliability is one of the reasons I keep coming back.

2. Any idea what could have caused it? The pressure valve was checked and seems to be working properly but maybe the oil filter?

I appreciate any feedback.

Cheers,

 

[Daneshavis]

Well, not a lot of responses but I thought I would update the story for potential future use. I had the crank case seal replaced and have continually gotten the "this is extremely rare" comments. I picked the vehicle up and drove 35 miles to work and found...wait for it... another 1/2 quart of oil under the vehicle. I then took it to the closes Toyota dealership and had them diagnose the issue, again. 4 hours later the tech calls me and says there is too much oil sprayed around the front of the engine and they will need to charge me $250 to begin taking the vehicle apart. They suggested I take it back to the original shop for repair.

The original shop is now telling me that, having spoken with a close friend at Toyota to confirm, even if the pressure valve is working there is a small vent leading to the pressure valve that can get stuck which prevents the pressure valve from operating properly and then the seal will blow. They are replacing the seal again and correcting this opening to the pressure valve and will be getting me the vehicle later today.

I have had several used and new vehicles in my life and this is a first. I purchased the LC for the tremendous reliability they are predicted to have and either I am the unluckiest bastard on the planet to get the only one to have this issue at 70k miles or there is something else going on.

Any feedback from the group would be appreciated.

Cheers,

 

[chimyz]

Due to a lack of responses, I will add my $0.02...

I think your rig is messed!!! I have only had this happen to one vehicle and owned and operated many used and new. My outcome was to eventually sell it back to the dealership I bought it from after hours and hours of repair. Their outcome was to replace the motor and transmission with a comets new one (this was after they had it out on 4 separate occasions). I know this is extremely frustrating and annoying. Sorry I couldn't offer more than sympathy.

 

[bjowett]

Thanks for the update. From what I can gather, your problem is either very rare or unreported. I can't recall or find anyone asking about this on the Tundra Forums.... and there are hundreds of thousands of those running around... they have the same engine.

 

[THEROK]

Sucks man. I'm suspecting something happened prior to your ownership. Even with service records you just never know what exactly went on.

And I believe the 5.7 in the lc is made in japan. I certainly feels diff than the 5.7 tundra edition. Much smoother in my rig. Lexus.

 

[Daneshavis]

I did quite a few searches on the Tundra forums and came up empty. The broker I am working with has so far been pretty good about covering any costs since it is so new however that is really secondary to me at this point. I do not want a LC with problems, otherwise I would have just gotten an damn Land Rover or Jeep, ha.

He sold to this rig to the original buyer and also got them a 2013 for this one and he swears up an down that they were not the "type" to mod or drive the vehicle hard. I have a 3000/3month "warranty" on the vehicle but I am wondering if that includes returns.

I will keep everyone updated as the plot unfolds.

 

[THEROK]

I've never heard of a state or fed law that allows for returns outside of the Lemon Law. Once you sign, it's yours.

That dude can swear all he wants, but unless he's backing up the talk with money, it's worth nothing to you. Unless that guy was living in your LC 24/7 like the black box on the PanAM, he doesn't know what may or may not have happened and that's a fact.

If I were in your shoes, I'd find a way to cut my losses and get rid of the truck. If the "shop" that's working on it isn't a Toyota dealership, then I'd look to get the work done by Toyota service and have the seller pay for it as they have done via the "shop".

 

[Daneshavis]

Update (soft of). Just in case anyone was curious as to what happened next. The tech called me and said it was fixed (including the mysterious flap) and it was running fine on the rack without incident. He was just going to take it for a quick highway run to confirm it was done. 2 hours later I called and he said there was so much oil from the previous leak he "thinks" it is fixed but wants to power wash it and try it again for a longer run.

He sounded very confident during my first call but he was definitely hiding something on the second but we shall see tomorrow. He said by tomorrow mid-morning he will have it done and fixed.

Update soon to come I suppose.

I appreciate all the responses (even the "your screwed" ones). While I have not posted much I have been lurking for a quite a while and have appreciated all the information. A while back I was debating between a 4Runner Trail and a 100 and this site was great. Bought the Trail and regretted it within a couple of months but strangely after this experience with my first LC (Dream Car BTW) I have to say I miss it a bit, ha.

Cheers,

 

[taccruiser97]

Have you tried contacting the previous owner and asking if they had any oil leak problems?

 

[re_guderian]

... I have a 3000/3month "warranty" on the vehicle but I am wondering if that includes returns...

Does it cover a new engine if yours should just "happen" to keep leaking after a looooooong drive?

 

[Daneshavis]

You will never guess how the conversation went today. Something along the lines of "huh, it is still leaking when we get it under load". 2 Toyota OEM seals later and they cannot determine the issue. Fortunately they won't charge for the service since they didn't correct the issue.

I am going to ask the broker if he can reach out to the previous owners to see if any "work" had been done to the vehicle or any previous oil leaks (thanks taccruiser97). He says he still knows them so they might actually tell him but I won't hold my breathe.

While this is a bit disappointing, I hope it is making the forums a bit more interesting. Everyone loves a mystery.

Cheers,

 

[SWUtah]

I would document all this with the broker and ask for the car to be fixed under the warranty.

 

[Junglejack]

Hello,
This is a terrible thing to read. Considering how relatively overengineered these mills are I am quite curious to read what the culprit is. On the plus side, these are hearty engines so it should be able to withstand it. That being said. I am sure you are fighting the desire not to beat it on down the line...

 

[re_guderian]

Not sure the broker or the previous owner have any real motivation to disclose the truth. I'd be more worried about them band-aiding it until the warranty is over. Hence a long freeway drive without looking at the dash...

 

[THEROK]

Sorry if you've already mentioned, but again, who is the "original shop" working on your LC? Toyota dealership or an independent shop?

My speculation

Without Toyota's deep pockets supporting your effort, you're going to be at the whim of the small time bit players who want to cut their losses (at your expense) as quickly as possible. I'd figure out a way to get your LC in the hands of Toyota official and have the warrantor agree to cover the costs via the Toyota official service technicians at your behest.

Should they refuse, you can weigh the cost/benefits of pursuing legal action against the warrantor or cut YOUR losses and pay out of pocket to get a pristine engine replacement given that it is a 200 series with a lot of life left in it yet. Might be worth the stress/time save from dealing with dishonorable/powerless parties involved. It'll be the least circuitous route to making your LC whole.

Keep us posted - thanks.

P.S. Your scenario has zero bearing on the 200's reliability record as a make/model (i.e. 1-off)

 

[Michael Hanson]

This can't be that hard to fix, I'm surprised they tried to fix it without power washing it first. Mike

 

[SWUtah]

This can't be that hard to fix, I'm surprised they tried to fix it without power washing it first. Mike

Agreed, get a new wrench!

 

[Daneshavis]

The shop I took it to was an independent that has worked on my family's vehicles for 30 years (when we weren't doing it ourselves) so I trust them but I decided that in order to remove as many variables as possible with the Broker I asked for the vehicle back. I spoke with the broker and he came to pick the vehicle up within the hour, offered a loaner vehicle, said they would begin work this afternoon and over the weekend, and swore to me up and down he would make this right. Unfortunately at this point he wants his shop to check it first and if there is any problem diagnosing the root cause he will take to the dealer of my choice for the final fix. He is a LC enthusiast himself (owns 2 currently) so you know he is a good guy, right?

While I feel the policy of "trust but verify" is best practice, he seems to be helping me out more than I expected. I went into this with the battle armor on, expecting to fight and have been pleasantly surprised. Of course, it isn't fixed yet so I would say the war is far from over.

THEROK - While personal experience is valid, I trust the data that says the LC is an incredibly reliable vehicle. I don't think this episode represents the model reliability anymore than the guy that says "I have 200k miles on this Chrysler(Fiat) and have never had a problem" represents that brand's reliability. I just got unlucky on this one, but if truth be told I am still way ahead of the game when it comes to being lucky in life. Hell, I own a LC for crying out loud, how much better can it get!

I will update when I get some news.

 

[THEROK]

http://youtu.be/wOO9ur8HcX4

 

[Daneshavis]

Well, the broker had his guy take a look and they changed out the oil/filter, checked the pressure valve, and of course changed the crank case seal and once they took it on the highway, bang, oil leak. The broker finally said "we are stumped" and has taken it to the Toyota dealership. The Toyota Tech he had working on it is stupefied and continued with the. I have never seen this happen on this engine. I have now been through 4 seals and a couple of filters in 2 weeks.

Despite the constant disappointment so far, the broker has been really great. He dropped off a new F150 and told me to keep it until he gets my vehicle straightened out. While it is definitely not a Land Cruiser, it is better than a Focus as a rental car and nowhere does it state in the agreement they need to provide a loaner.

I know, this is an update without any real update but trust me, I wish I could say it was fixed and I was once again loving my Cruiser.

Hopefully sometime next week I should be hearing back. Hopefully not the "we changed the seal and it blew again" but rather the "we found the cause of the high oil pressure that was blowing the seal".

Go Broncos!