Diff differences
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theferg
SILVER Star
Welcome Noobie! 
You could use the
button up there and it will give ya quite a bit of info. 
As to 60 and 80 diffs being compatible... The REAR of an 80 series has the same size ring gear and such and housing size, but the FRONT of an 80 is smaller--no good for older cruisers. A non-locking REAR diff from an 80 series will fit right in the front or rear of a 60 series. A locking REAR from an 80 is also the same size and such and will drop right in the FRONT of a 60 with the exception of needing to have the diff LOCKED first, and a couple longer diff studs. But to get the thing to work, you gotta get a new long side inner axle shaft up in the front 'cause the shafts inner splines need to be longer. To put an 80 series REAR locking diff in the REAR of a 60 is a different story. The rear MUST be a "full float" acle assembly. And ALL USA model 60's and 62's got semi float rear ends. But, some other countries got full floats so you can get them. Again, some longer diff studs are needed and you have to again get a new shaft, though for the rear you need the short side with longer splines. I think that about covers it... Any other questions or clarifications?
P.S. I've got a electric locking diff from the REAR of an 80 in the FRONT of my 60 right now, and I'm waiting fot my rear FF axle assembly to get here so I can install my other e-lock diff into it and kick some A$$.
Honestly though, if you search you'll come up with a lot of good info on this...
-Ferg-
You could use the
As to 60 and 80 diffs being compatible... The REAR of an 80 series has the same size ring gear and such and housing size, but the FRONT of an 80 is smaller--no good for older cruisers. A non-locking REAR diff from an 80 series will fit right in the front or rear of a 60 series. A locking REAR from an 80 is also the same size and such and will drop right in the FRONT of a 60 with the exception of needing to have the diff LOCKED first, and a couple longer diff studs. But to get the thing to work, you gotta get a new long side inner axle shaft up in the front 'cause the shafts inner splines need to be longer. To put an 80 series REAR locking diff in the REAR of a 60 is a different story. The rear MUST be a "full float" acle assembly. And ALL USA model 60's and 62's got semi float rear ends. But, some other countries got full floats so you can get them. Again, some longer diff studs are needed and you have to again get a new shaft, though for the rear you need the short side with longer splines. I think that about covers it... Any other questions or clarifications?P.S. I've got a electric locking diff from the REAR of an 80 in the FRONT of my 60 right now, and I'm waiting fot my rear FF axle assembly to get here so I can install my other e-lock diff into it and kick some A$$.
Honestly though, if you search you'll come up with a lot of good info on this...
-Ferg-
theferg
SILVER Star
I don't have access to a stock short splined one (nor a pic of it) at the moment, but here's a pic of the front long splined one. IIRC, it's about 2.5 inches longer of splines. FWIW, you can get the shafts new from Toyota Dealers (mine are both OEM Toyota shafts). My front one came out of an HJ60...but I don't know whether or not it was equipped with the lockers or not...and my rear one I got from a Toy dealership.
P.S. You lucky bastid. The swap should be cake for you with your FF already...
-Ferg-
P.S. You lucky bastid.
The swap should be cake for you with your FF already...-Ferg-
- Thread starter
- #5
I am from Australia and it is really hard to find an e-locker over here, does anyone know of somewhere i could order one from overseas and then get it shipped to me.
Just to make sure, the longer splined axle i need to get, the total length of the axle is still the same right, the spline just extends onto it further not the other way around.
Thanks guys
Just to make sure, the longer splined axle i need to get, the total length of the axle is still the same right, the spline just extends onto it further not the other way around.
Thanks guys
theferg
SILVER Star
Correct. The shafts are the same length, just the splines extend further onto it.
The only Cruiser places I could think of that could ship e-lock diffs for ya would be Spectre, Man-a-Fre or TLC or something big like that. But, they are usually more $$ than can be found elsewhere (wrecking yards) and they like to add on "handling fees" with their shipping :-\ . Probably be a lot. You'd be beter off findin' some cable lock axles outta Japan I'd bet... Anways, that being said, I'd be willing to help ya out finding some if you're serious about it. Good prices on used, functioning ones run $300 to $600 USD. PM me if you're interested and I'll see what I can come up with. If you can't find the shafts either, I can get them too. Hell, you find me a FF 60 series rear, and I'll trade you a good e-lock diff. Let me know wha you think.
-Ferg-
Oh ya, and you could get them new from a dealer as well. Cruiserdan on this BB works at a dealership, but i'm not sure if he could ship it over seas or not from his dealership, but if ya wanted new, we could work that out too. I think new ones are around $1000 USD.
And did I mention these suckers are DAMN heavy? I'd be willing to bet atleast $100 USD for shipping.
And if you felt better working through a Cruiser shop, there's a local one that I could get in touch with and see what they could do.
The only Cruiser places I could think of that could ship e-lock diffs for ya would be Spectre, Man-a-Fre or TLC or something big like that. But, they are usually more $$ than can be found elsewhere (wrecking yards) and they like to add on "handling fees" with their shipping :-\ . Probably be a lot. You'd be beter off findin' some cable lock axles outta Japan I'd bet... Anways, that being said, I'd be willing to help ya out finding some if you're serious about it. Good prices on used, functioning ones run $300 to $600 USD. PM me if you're interested and I'll see what I can come up with. If you can't find the shafts either, I can get them too. Hell, you find me a FF 60 series rear, and I'll trade you a good e-lock diff.
Let me know wha you think.-Ferg-
Oh ya, and you could get them new from a dealer as well. Cruiserdan on this BB works at a dealership, but i'm not sure if he could ship it over seas or not from his dealership, but if ya wanted new, we could work that out too. I think new ones are around $1000 USD.
And did I mention these suckers are DAMN heavy? I'd be willing to bet atleast $100 USD for shipping.
And if you felt better working through a Cruiser shop, there's a local one that I could get in touch with and see what they could do.
Ferg- Is the same true for 80-40 series diffs? I thought 40 series thirds were the same as 60's. Does this mean that 80 e-lockers could go in a 40 axle? Its worth it for even $600 vs ARB.
theferg
SILVER Star
Yup. Same thing for 40s and 45s and 55s and 62s and... It's been done numerous times in 40s and 55s already. I think it's worth it if you get the e-locker for a decent price. Cause the axle shaft is anywhere from $100-250. But you gotta remember that with ARB you have to pay for the locker, the air supply and the setup (if you can't do it yourself). I have heard the the general price on install of ARBs front and rear with air is ~$2000 USD. I'm around $1400 for all my e-lock stuff including a FF rear axle assembly...
-Ferg-
-Ferg-
what/ where do you get these extended shafts? does it work on the front lockers?
Thats the thing, I already have a good air source (york) and could probably install the ARB myself, or know people that I could get/give beers to to help me do it. If I can find a steal like Brad, $1050 will buy me the lockers and that would be all I need. Its a throwup. All depends on if I run across some good e-lockers. Let me know if you see some, Ferg. Thanks.
theferg
SILVER Star
[quote author=bad_religion_au link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg58808#msg58808 date=1067938882]what/ where do you get these extended shafts?[/quote]
There's several places in the states that will make custom shafts and they run $200-$350 USD. But I got mine from Toyota for $175 USD
[quote author=bad_religion_au link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg58808#msg58808 date=1067938882]does it work on the front lockers?[/quote]
Not sure what you are askin' here... Maybe you are wonderin' if the front locker from an 80 will fit in the front of a 40 or 60 or? If that's it, then no, the front diff in an 80 is smaller (Hilux/mini truck size). BUT, the rear locker from an 80 will work in both rear AND front of 40s/60s etc.
-Ferg-
There's several places in the states that will make custom shafts and they run $200-$350 USD. But I got mine from Toyota for $175 USD
[quote author=bad_religion_au link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg58808#msg58808 date=1067938882]does it work on the front lockers?[/quote]
Not sure what you are askin' here... Maybe you are wonderin' if the front locker from an 80 will fit in the front of a 40 or 60 or? If that's it, then no, the front diff in an 80 is smaller (Hilux/mini truck size). BUT, the rear locker from an 80 will work in both rear AND front of 40s/60s etc.
-Ferg-
theferg
SILVER Star
[quote author=CruisinGA link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg59434#msg59434 date=1068075888]
Thats the thing, I already have a good air source (york) and could probably install the ARB myself, or know people that I could get/give beers to to help me do it. If I can find a steal like Brad, $1050 will buy me the lockers and that would be all I need. Its a throwup. All depends on if I run across some good e-lockers. Let me know if you see some, Ferg. Thanks.
[/quote]
I definitey see your point. One other thing that can sort of be a money saver is that if your rig is a 60 series or a 79 or newer 40, you hve 3.70 diff gears and the e-lockers have 4.10 diff gears so you will get lower gears while you're at it. So you can kind of say you saved money on new diff gears as well...
Anyway, I'll keep my eye out for cheap ones and if I find any, I'll post up here and see if anybody's lookin'...
-Ferg-
Thats the thing, I already have a good air source (york) and could probably install the ARB myself, or know people that I could get/give beers to to help me do it. If I can find a steal like Brad, $1050 will buy me the lockers and that would be all I need. Its a throwup. All depends on if I run across some good e-lockers. Let me know if you see some, Ferg. Thanks.
[/quote]
I definitey see your point. One other thing that can sort of be a money saver is that if your rig is a 60 series or a 79 or newer 40, you hve 3.70 diff gears and the e-lockers have 4.10 diff gears so you will get lower gears while you're at it. So you can kind of say you saved money on new diff gears as well...
Anyway, I'll keep my eye out for cheap ones and if I find any, I'll post up here and see if anybody's lookin'...
-Ferg-
thanks ferg. i was asking if the rear of a 80 would work in the front of a 40.. sorry for the confusion. i would have thought that e- lockers would have been easy to find down under, my mates dad's 80 has them (will he notice a rear 3rd and locker assembly/ wiring missing?)
and ordering the longer splined inner from toyota, what do you order. obviously not a stock inner for a 60 FF axle.
and ordering the longer splined inner from toyota, what do you order. obviously not a stock inner for a 60 FF axle.
theferg
SILVER Star
This is the part number for the rear one. It's short side, long splined FF rear axle shaft for a 60 series equipped with cable locking diffs. It's also the same part number for 70 series vehicles with electric lockers. I know you guys down under got 70 series with electric lockers, so you should be able to find it. Hey that just made me think a bit. Supposedly, there are some years of the heavy duty model 70s/73s/74s/75s/79s also had the same size ring gear in the front and rear, but there was a change at some point and now the front diffs are smaller like the 80 series. Not sure what years...I'd be willing to wager that the change was around the year that the 80 series was introduced. Anyway, maybe you'd have better luck finding an electric locker out of the rear of a 70 series (or if it's old possibly the front one)? If you did, you would have your rear axle shaft as well. FYI, the short side rear axle shafts are the same length for 4X's, 5X's, 6X's, and 7X's. And the long sides from 4X's, 5X's, and 7X's are the same lengths... So if you found an older 70 series with lockers with the larger ring gear up front, you would be set. Hell if you have a 40/50 series, you could just swap the axles under. They're the same widths (but the spring perch positions are a wee bit different--but it wouldn't take much work to fix that). Sheesh. I think I have made this clear as mud...
Here's the part number for the rear short side with long splines. I'll try to find the front shaft part number:
42311-60081
-Ferg-
FYI, the short side rear axle shafts are the same length for 4X's, 5X's, 6X's, and 7X's. And the long sides from 4X's, 5X's, and 7X's are the same lengths... So if you found an older 70 series with lockers with the larger ring gear up front, you would be set. Hell if you have a 40/50 series, you could just swap the axles under. They're the same widths (but the spring perch positions are a wee bit different--but it wouldn't take much work to fix that). Sheesh. I think I have made this clear as mud...Here's the part number for the rear short side with long splines. I'll try to find the front shaft part number:
42311-60081
-Ferg-
thanks. don't worry about the part numbers, i'll find them if i need them. 1990 was when 70's went to pissy diffs (i am 99% sure). thanks heaps. i always thought that 70's came with air lockers from toyota (not electric lockers) but could be wrong.
ohh and according to toyota FAQ "70 Series axles are 20mm wider than 40 series"
which means i gotta find a locking 40 or 55. would cable locked 40's have the longer splined axles?
ohh and according to toyota FAQ "70 Series axles are 20mm wider than 40 series"
which means i gotta find a locking 40 or 55. would cable locked 40's have the longer splined axles?
theferg
SILVER Star
[quote author=bad_religion_au link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg60101#msg60101 date=1068175105]ohh and according to toyota FAQ "70 Series axles are 20mm wider than 40 series"[/quote]
I read that too, but was later told differently when I was conversing with some one about it. In the LCML archives, the long splined shafts people were using in their 40s were the ones from the 70s. ???
[quote author=bad_religion_au link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg60101#msg60101 date=1068175105]which means i gotta find a locking 40 or 55. would cable locked 40's have the longer splined axles?[/quote]
They would, but is there such a thing? I've never heard of it...
-Ferg-
I read that too, but was later told differently when I was conversing with some one about it. In the LCML archives, the long splined shafts people were using in their 40s were the ones from the 70s. ???
[quote author=bad_religion_au link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg60101#msg60101 date=1068175105]which means i gotta find a locking 40 or 55. would cable locked 40's have the longer splined axles?[/quote]
They would, but is there such a thing? I've never heard of it...
-Ferg-
Jonathan_Ferguson
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The Pissy Diff is the 8" for the Front?
If so that is for the front of Full Time 4WD's, Not Part time 80 and 105. - Remember the 78/79 is also part time.
If so that is for the front of Full Time 4WD's, Not Part time 80 and 105. - Remember the 78/79 is also part time.
[quote author=Jonathan_Ferguson link=board=1;threadid=7028;start=msg60180#msg60180 date=1068191753]
The Pissy Diff is the 8" for the Front?
If so that is for the front of Full Time 4WD's, Not Part time 80 and 105. - Remember the 78/79 is also part time.
[/quote]
fraid not johnferg, ALL solid axle cruisers post feb 1990 had the 8 inch reverse cut diff out of the hilux in the front. i know this because tlc faq says so, and my friends 92 75 series tray (with part time) has the 8 inch diff (we know this because he breaks this, and part numbers are different, unlike 40 diffs which are interchangeable front to rear). also 4x4 monthly always moan about having the weaker diff in the front of the new 78/79. sad but true so you can take back the , feel like a 
:
, and buy me a 
, but i don't drink 
.
i'll believe you about the 75 rear long side axle ferg. i was quoting TLC FAQ. may have to get to a junk yard and have a measure, or get dan to pull his long side axle out when he does my diff, and measure both when their out.
some 40's had lockers, don't know on their application method, probably cable. but i'll see how the 75 measures up, and then see. probably way too rare to get a cable locked 40 for parts anyway...
The Pissy Diff is the 8" for the Front?
If so that is for the front of Full Time 4WD's, Not Part time 80 and 105. - Remember the 78/79 is also part time.
[/quote]
fraid not johnferg, ALL solid axle cruisers post feb 1990 had the 8 inch reverse cut diff out of the hilux in the front. i know this because tlc faq says so, and my friends 92 75 series tray (with part time) has the 8 inch diff (we know this because he breaks this, and part numbers are different, unlike 40 diffs which are interchangeable front to rear). also 4x4 monthly always moan about having the weaker diff in the front of the new 78/79. sad but true so you can take back the
, feel like a : , and buy me a , but i don't drink .i'll believe you about the 75 rear long side axle ferg. i was quoting TLC FAQ. may have to get to a junk yard and have a measure, or get dan to pull his long side axle out when he does my diff, and measure both when their out.
some 40's had lockers, don't know on their application method, probably cable. but i'll see how the 75 measures up, and then see. probably way too rare to get a cable locked 40 for parts anyway...
