deep cycle batteries (1 Viewer)

[Gold Boy]

i'm considering using deep cycle batteries for my main set of batteries. i know that generally speaking this is not recommended, however i once tried this set up in my chev pickup and it to worked well with no battery deterioration.


so what do you think? i'm crazy?

 

[Mountain Goat]

Not crazy at all if the batteries you choose can crank as well. That's what I have (2 Optima Yellow Top D31).

 

[M John Galt]

Tried` OptimaReds, lasted through one winter, then wouldn't hold charge. Replaced with Nautilus marine batteries, never had another problem.

 

[83bj60]

I have two Walmart 31 size marine troll and start that I paid $65 each in the US. They're simply perfect. I've forgotten the lights on a few times for a few hours with no observable effects on starting. This winter at -35C, no block heater, no battery warmer, I don't even notice a difference in cranking and starting.

I believe this type of battery is simply better suited to our diesel trucks.

 

[ohrly?]

I have two Walmart 31 size marine troll and start that I paid $65 each in the US. They're simply perfect. I've forgotten the lights on a few times for a few hours with no observable effects on starting. This winter at -35C, no block heater, no battery warmer, I don't even notice a difference in cranking and starting.

I believe this type of battery is simply better suited to our diesel trucks.

Wow... are you bullshiting us?

Thats crazy good.

 

[Gold Boy]

Wow... are you bullshiting us?

Thats crazy good.

i think i'm becoming a deep cycle battery convert.......

 

[rchalmers3]

My .02 on battery technology:
Deep cycle batteries will work if you purchase and install a batteriy that meets or exceeds the "Cold Cranking Amps" (CCA) and "Ampere Hours" (AH) ratings specified for the vehicle.
These batteries work well for boats, golf carts, motor homes and electric cars. They are more heavily constructed to resist internal damage due to vibration and shock.
Deep cycle batteries are not better than the normal car batteries for delivering power. They are constructed differently and for a different purpose. Deep cycle batteries are made to be drawn way down and replenished without harm to the plates. This is the opposite of how we usually use our diesel batteries. Our usual routine is to start our vehicle and drive it around for awhile, replenishing the battery.
If your diesel is a daily driver, you might as well save your money and continue to use the normal lead/acid battery that you are familiar with. Normal batteries have greater potential to supply full power for cranking or winching.
I only recommend deep cycle batteries where where is a need to use one, as the delivered energy potential is lower in the deep cycle batteries and they are more expensive. If you use your starting circuit battery to operate your camping gear, then it's a good choice.

Rick

 

[Eco 45]

On some deep cycle batteries if they are not drawn way down they can create a memory and will loose a charge faster than normal. As rchalmers3 states they are built for a purpose and not intended for a normal starting circuit. If you are having issues with the life span of a quality battery than it probably has to do with your charging system or a small draw somewhere. I would not spend the extra money on a deep cycle--I would just buy a good quality normal battery.

 

[nathan hj60]

I just put two of the Energizer Marine Starting/Deep Cycle batteries in my HJ60 yesterday. I obviously can't report on the performance too much, but it certainly sparked to life this morning! I intentionally did not plug the truck in tonight to see how things go in the morning! I did a bunch of searching on this forum and it sounded like traditional lead acid batteries were the way to go vs AGM. The group 34 are a perfect fit. The only trouble is that the terminals are too far towards the front. If they were nearer the middle, or reversed, it would be perfect. But, so far, so good.

 

[nathan hj60]

So. It wasn't all that cold this morning, only -10c but there was about 18 inches of snow sitting on my hood! It was some dumping we got. At any rate, with one glow cycle the truck started with no hesitation, it was going after barely turning the key to start. I was used to having to glow 2-3 times and crank a couple seconds with the old can tire batteries. The marine batteries made sense to me primarily because of the enhanced durability and vibration resistance. I also like to the idea of the batteries being able to sustain complete depletion and recharging without any ill effect. I have accidently left the lights on on more than one occasion. I wish there was a headlight buzzer! It's probably what did in my old batteries.

 

[Gold Boy]

So. It wasn't all that cold this morning, only -10c but there was about 18 inches of snow sitting on my hood! It was some dumping we got. At any rate, with one glow cycle the truck started with no hesitation, it was going after barely turning the key to start. I was used to having to glow 2-3 times and crank a couple seconds with the old can tire batteries. The marine batteries made sense to me primarily because of the enhanced durability and vibration resistance. I also like to the idea of the batteries being able to sustain complete depletion and recharging without any ill effect. I have accidently left the lights on on more than one occasion. I wish there was a headlight buzzer! It's probably what did in my old batteries.

feedback

could you please post a link for your batteries.

 

[83bj60]

i think i'm becoming a deep cycle battery convert.......

Here are some further notes concerning these batteries. Do take note I did not read the subsequent posts when I composed this, they are simply based on my personal experience.

Some important facts about these Marine Start and Troll Batteries:

1. They are actually automotive batteries with coarser lead crystals on their plates. Hence, they still have good starting power but are more robust that standard cranking batteries. In other words, they have slightly reduced starting amps but can carry the load slightly longer. What better combo for a diesel?
2. The 'Deep Cycle' means depletion to 50% (instead of about 20% IIRC for starting batteries) before they go flat. True deep cycle of the type used by power companies are way better than that (but have no high current starting ability).

Why am I a Marine Start and Troll Battery Convert:

1. Starting Amps: they are not much lower than starting batteries (25% maybe). However, that has no real effect because when the truck came out, the starting amps specs of the batteries of the time were much lower than what they are now. Also, running a 24V starter does not require as high amps than a 12V. Hence these batteries are perfect for use in a 24V starting setup.
2. Construction: they are supposedly built more robustly for the vibrations and shocks seen in boats, so presumably they will survive better on what passes for roads around here.
3. Cost: they are usually less expensive than similar sized car batteries. Go figure. Probably because car batteries are 'boosted' (or should I say 'hyped') so much. HOWEVER, they have much shorter warranties (presumably because folks forget them for months in their boats without using them and they tend to sulphate).
4. Reserve Capacity: Better than automotive start, granted (leaving parking lights on all night or headlights a couple of hours is OK, been there, done that), but they do not like large loads for long, such as that required by a hair dryer (tried that with my inverter, which quickly drops the voltage below the inverter cut-off (10.5V). Testing on a standard 100A load tester it will drop more than an automotive starting battery of the same size, but remain at that voltage for much longer while the starting battery will drop noticeably in the same time period (say, after 30 second of applying 100A).
5. Battery Connections: allow for much better, positive connections, as they come standard with stud terminals which, I find, are much tougher and probably allow for a better connection. No intermediary connection between a cable and a clamp. The battery cables I simply insert in a copper sheath (piece of 5/16 or 3/8 copper tube) then flatten the end once soldered and drill to the size of the stud. Much tighter fit that won't come off. Allows me to use SS hardware (washers, spring washers and Nylocks), whcihch, as you know, won't corrode in presence of sulphuric acid (316 SS type at least).
6. Size: the 31 size barely fits in the HDJ81 battery compartments (with no battery warmer). The 29 size allows for a battery warmer. I would recommend the 29 size if you have an HDJ81 in Canada and wish to use battery warmers, not that the batteries lacked power at -30°C.
7. About Walmart Marine Batteries: in Canada they cost $99 (Energizer brand) and are made by Johnson Controls, which has an excellent reputation. The ones from the US that I acquired a couple of years later are slightly different (Everstart brand), cost $59 and may be made by Exide (there is no marking on the battery to help identification). Understand though that they tend to change manufacturers.

So here you go, that's my experience, hope this helps.

 

[Gold Boy]

Here are some further notes concerning these batteries. Do take note I did not read the subsequent posts when I composed this, they are simply based on my personal experience.

Some important facts about these Marine Start and Troll Batteries:

1. They are actually automotive batteries with coarser lead crystals on their plates. Hence, they still have good starting power but are more robust that standard cranking batteries. In other words, they have slightly reduced starting amps but can carry the load slightly longer. What better combo for a diesel?
2. The 'Deep Cycle' means depletion to 50% (instead of about 20% IIRC for starting batteries) before they go flat. True deep cycle of the type used by power companies are way better than that (but have no high current starting ability).

Why am I a Marine Start and Troll Battery Convert:

1. Starting Amps: they are not much lower than starting batteries (25% maybe). However, that has no real effect because when the truck came out, the starting amps specs of the batteries of the time were much lower than what they are now. Also, running a 24V starter does not require as high amps than a 12V. Hence these batteries are perfect for use in a 24V starting setup.
2. Construction: they are supposedly built more robustly for the vibrations and shocks seen in boats, so presumably they will survive better on what passes for roads around here.
3. Cost: they are usually less expensive than similar sized car batteries. Go figure. Probably because car batteries are 'boosted' (or should I say 'hyped') so much. HOWEVER, they have much shorter warranties (presumably because folks forget them for months in their boats without using them and they tend to sulphate).
4. Reserve Capacity: Better than automotive start, granted (leaving parking lights on all night or headlights a couple of hours is OK, been there, done that), but they do not like large loads for long, such as that required by a hair dryer (tried that with my inverter, which quickly drops the voltage below the inverter cut-off (10.5V). Testing on a standard 100A load tester it will drop more than an automotive starting battery of the same size, but remain at that voltage for much longer while the starting battery will drop noticeably in the same time period (say, after 30 second of applying 100A).
5. Battery Connections: allow for much better, positive connections, as they come standard with stud terminals which, I find, are much tougher and probably allow for a better connection. No intermediary connection between a cable and a clamp. The battery cables I simply insert in a copper sheath (piece of 5/16 or 3/8 copper tube) then flatten the end once soldered and drill to the size of the stud. Much tighter fit that won't come off. Allows me to use SS hardware (washers, spring washers and Nylocks), whcihch, as you know, won't corrode in presence of sulphuric acid (316 SS type at least).
6. Size: the 31 size barely fits in the HDJ81 battery compartments (with no battery warmer). The 29 size allows for a battery warmer. I would recommend the 29 size if you have an HDJ81 in Canada and wish to use battery warmers, not that the batteries lacked power at -30°C.
7. About Walmart Marine Batteries: in Canada they cost $99 (Energizer brand) and are made by Johnson Controls, which has an excellent reputation. The ones from the US that I acquired a couple of years later are slightly different (Everstart brand), cost $59 and may be made by Exide (there is no marking on the battery to help identification). Understand though that they tend to change manufacturers.

So here you go, that's my experience, hope this helps.

helps big time!

what a gem of a reply....

 

[83bj60]

Normal batteries have greater potential to supply full power for cranking or winching.Rick

Totally wrong from my experience. You will fry a standard battery winching for extended periods (pulling logs off of the bush for example). The plates simply can't take the enormous load and will quickly overheat, warp and short the battery. Been there, seen that (with an 8D large rig battery and 140A alternator feeding a 10,000 lb 12V Ox SuperWinch).

 

[83bj60]

helps big time!

what a gem of a reply....

Thanks, it was my pleasure. It's nice to 'clean the attic' from from time to time and writing is very good as it forces you to gather all that scatter in one concise place

 

[canucksafari]

Costco deep cycle batteries will be on sale in April if I remember right.

 

[83bj60]

On some deep cycle batteries if they are not drawn way down they can create a memory and will loose a charge faster than normal. As rchalmers3 states they are built for a purpose and not intended for a normal starting circuit.

It is true for the type of deep cycle batteries used in standalone power (actually seen that happen), but the marine start and troll batteries we can install in our vehicles are a totally different beast and although they can be successfully used for providing standalone power for much longer than starting bateries they don't like to be 'drawn way down' like the backup power deep cycle batteries. It's all because of the plate microstruture (smooth in backup power deep cycle, composed of fine crystals in automotive batteries and coarse ones in marine start and troll batteries).

However, that 'memory effect' (which is actually caused by a change in surface structure) can be successfully reversed with high frequencey pulse charging.

If you are having issues with the life span of a quality battery than it probably has to do with your charging system or a small draw somewhere.

Agreed, unless you consider using a lot of accessories while the engine is not running, abnormal.

I would not spend the extra money on a deep cycle--I would just buy a good quality normal battery.

Marine Deep Cycle and Starting batteries are actually cheaper, whereas true deep discharge cells tend to be costlier (probably because of lower sales volume due to the specialized market).

 

[83bj60]

Costco deep cycle batteries will be on sale in April if I remember right.

Yep, they usually go on sale right before the summer starts. I prefer to buy them at that time if I can to be sure I have the freshest. Nothing worse than a pre-filled battery forgotten on the shelves and/or inadequately recharged. These big stores are not known to have good recharging procedures, one can wonder if they even recharge the batteries at all sometimes.

 

[prado t]

I use OPTIMA YELLOW TOP deep cycle , I believe the best set of batteries that I have owned, awesome for my WARN 24 volt winch

 

[Tapage]

The best bat that I ever owned it's a AC Delco Mariner .. almost 6 years with me. I've been used it alone, with aux light and winch and now with a second batt .. always be my principal bat in Tencha ..

Anycase just wonder that our best option are the GEL batts .. but I never seen a normal batt GEL .. always GEL batts are Deep Cycle .. so

Due to the dificult to found local AC Delco Mariner batts, I'm still in the idea of an Exide Gel for my next bat ..

Mmm important .. my AC delco have in the record at least 5 - 6 totaly discharges in my Cruiser ( coz are not my DD ) due to the time .. when I say totaly are complete ( no lights, no horn no nothing ) and after a brief charging ( 2 or 3 hours ) there are again in the game ..