CT 26 water cooling flow

[Zekester]

you could answer the question and that is the end of the conversation... boring.

I'd rather have boring, and an answer to the fawking question instead of it being debated to the nth degree...

if I want entertainment, I'll go to chat, here If I post I am looking for answers...or answering some other guys question...

I got an answer, well 3 now, hook up- to tstat, hook up to heater hose, don't hook up at all...

Thanks to those of you that tried to help, sending pics, offering advice, at least to help me make an informed decision.

 

[amaurer]

i am a great guy... ask anyone that really knows me or wheels with me.

... and modest too!

 

[lynchmob]

Maybe a good solution for aftermarket turbos would be some way to continue to circulate the oil after shutdown, without a turbo timer..

I think this has been done before by using a prelube system on a timer after shutdown.

 

[lynchmob]

Using the heater lines is EXACTLY what AXT does and is also what I've been doing on my BJ60 with the AXT kit, on the FJ55 with an aftermarket setup and the FJ45LV with a CT26 setup.

Some might argue that there is risk of thermal shock in this situation. So long as its heated water running through it should work.

 

[Dougal]

I think this has been done before by using a prelube system on a timer after shutdown.

Seems to me like a solution looking for a problem.
Oil coking is not a problem on an engine that's looked after sensibly. I did buy a turbo once that was full of gunge, but it was from an engine that had already died (compressor housing was also full of blowby oil).

If you're doing repeated hot shutdowns (I mean really hot, not just stopping from 60mph) then it's not just the turbo that you need to be worried about. Your cylinder head for instance.

Skifields are great for this. People drive up 2000m vertical, then switch their car off and walk away. 2 minutes later the car starts spitting steam and boiling.

 

[cruiser_guy]

Some might argue that there is risk of thermal shock in this situation. So long as its heated water running through it should work.

They could argue that, but then they'd need to do the same about the head and most any other engine parts!!

Coolant is coolant and the water jacketed bearing section is designed for it, not to mention the contention that gasser turbos get hotter thus then need the water jacket. If anything it would be a thermal shock on the gasser turbos long before it affects the diesel.

If you're doing repeated hot shutdowns (I mean really hot, not just stopping from 60mph) then it's not just the turbo that you need to be worried about. Your cylinder head for instance.

Skifields are great for this. People drive up 2000m vertical, then switch their car off and walk away. 2 minutes later the car starts spitting steam and boiling.

This happens ALL the time! Most folks do not have the patience to allow the vehicle to cool after a hard run. Personally I think this is a large part of the problem with the bad rap on the "L/2L" engine. Here in Central America and also on the west coast of Canada or the US there are hills everywhere. I frequently need to allow a cool down time from 30 seconds up to a minute or two.

 

[jake2far]

They could argue that, but then they'd need to do the same about the head and most any other engine parts!!

I guess the redesigned heads or the high nickel head used on the 3B to help with the cracking is caused by something other than heat?

 

[jake2far]

I'd rather have boring, and an answer to the fawking question instead of it being debated to the nth degree...

if I want entertainment, I'll go to chat, here If I post I am looking for answers...or answering some other guys question...

I got an answer, well 3 now, hook up- to tstat, hook up to heater hose, don't hook up at all...

Thanks to those of you that tried to help, sending pics, offering advice, at least to help me make an informed decision.

Without getting into "if its on the internet it must be true quote"
check out this page half way down it really addresses your question.
TurboByGarrett.com - Turbo System Optimization
The pics and drawings show how and why.
Good luck.
Oh I have a Turbo Glide set up from Austraila that came off my 3B that dropped a precup, it did not have the water passages hooked up, precup failure not related, because of your question and the discussion that followed I called Garrett and talked to them, they are the ones who directed me to the optimazation page and told me they strongly recommend the water passages be hooked up, they stated doing it wrong can (read can not will)cause failure. I asked why the lines weren't hooked up from Turbo Glide but stating what Garrett told me will start a series of comments I just don't want to hear. I am going to install it on my 13BT to replace the CT26 turbo set up. The easy part for me is the lines, thermostat housing with ports already exist so it should be an easy hook up. For those of you who disagree good on you.

Thank you for your comments and good luck with your install.
I figure you can't have to much information.
Your question was great for me as I was at the point of turbo install where I had the exact questions and was trying to work out Toyota CT26 or Turbo Glide, water lines hooked up or not, the lively debate that followed got me to investigate the issue and I think for my rig I have found a good answer.


Jim

 

[cruiser_guy]

I guess the redesigned heads or the high nickel head used on the 3B to help with the cracking is caused by something other than heat?

I'm talking about circulating coolant through parts of ANY engine (not just the 3B). If circulating coolant through the bearing housing will cause cracking (which is what "lynchmob" is saying) what about other parts of the engine, any water cooled engine!

 

[jake2far]

I'm talking about circulating coolant through parts of ANY engine (not just the 3B). If circulating coolant through the bearing housing will cause cracking (which is what "lynchmob" is saying) what about other parts of the engine, any water cooled engine!

My question is what causes the cracking in the 3B head and why change the metal if all that is needed is coolant? Since it is a diesel it should be less likely to crack, right?
Stress cracking is exactly what is going on in the 3B head and it does happen in other parts of engines. The stress is caused by what?

Jim

 

[cruiser_guy]

My question is what causes the cracking in the 3B head and why change the metal if all that is needed is coolant? Since it is a diesel it should be less likely to crack, right?
Stress cracking is exactly what is going on in the 3B head and it does happen in other parts of engines. The stress is caused by what?

Jim

That's not what I've said. The newer 3B heads, even OEM, apparently have a different metallurgy to help avoid cracking. Lack of coolant is never a good thing in the engine, at least in my book, which is why I use the water cooling jacket on my turbos.

Remember, I'm NOT arguing to not use water lines on the turbo.

 

[Dougal]

To throw some more petrol on the flames. Here is a Garrett GT2052 which was supplied specifically for fitment to a 3B by one of the members here.

No water jacket.

 

[jake2far]

To throw some more petrol on the flames. Here is a Garrett GT2052 which was supplied specifically for fitment to a 3B by one of the members here.

No water jacket.

That is a nice turbo, are the water ports there but plugged? I purchased a turbo kit from Turbo Glide it to came without water tubes hooked up, I pulled the plugs made some tubes and hooked em up. This next statement is from garrett.
Water Lines
" Water cooling is a key design feature for improved durability and we recommend that if your turbo has an allowance for watercooling, hook up the water lines. Water cooling eliminates the destructive occurrence of oil coking by utilizing the Thermal Siphon Effect to reduce the Peak Heat Soak Back Temperature on the turbine side piston after shut-down. In order to get the greatest benefit from your watercooling system, avoid undulations in the water lines to maximize the Thermal Siphon Effect. "

 

[Dougal]

That is a nice turbo, are the water ports there but plugged?

No, there is no water jacket on this turbo and no ports to plug or unplug.

Are you ever going to stop quoting petrol turbo literature on a diesel site?

 

[jake2far]

No, there is no water jacket on this turbo and no ports to plug or unplug.

Are you ever going to stop quoting petrol turbo literature on a diesel site?

.

Your question is not relivent as the literature is not specific to petrol use.
If the literature does not explain this(look at the pics) please step up and explain it. 1987 BJ74 13B-T engine.
When are you going to quit attacking people who give information explaining something which you disagree with and actually explain your position and provide the data used to arrive at your conclusion?
Why don't you call Garrett and ask them if this literature is only to be used for petrol, maybe they should include a warning "for petrol use only does not apply to diesel engines" they probably have just over looked this detail and would really like to hear from you?


Jim

 

[jake2far]

Just don't shut it down when it's red hot. Fit an EGT probe in the exhaust manifold and don't shut it down until it's down to 200C or thereabouts.
You'll find that idling it down is only necessary when you've just driven quickly to the top of a hill.

If the literature I post is for petrol not diesel why do you do this?

Originally Posted by Dougal
No, there is no water jacket on this turbo and no ports to plug or unplug.

Are you ever going to stop quoting petrol turbo literature on a diesel site?


Jim

 

[Otterav]

My diesel has done over 400,000km. It is factory turbocharged and has never had a turbo with water lines connected. There have been no related turbocharger or oil problems. I change my oil at 10,000km intervals.
Garrett's diesel-only turbochargers (their entire VNT lines) do not have water cooled housings.
Holsets diesel-only turbochargers do not have water cooled housings.

This wasn't the motor you rebuilt 3 times is it?
eric

 

[Otterav]

If the literature I post is for petrol not diesel why do you do this?

Originally Posted by Dougal
No, there is no water jacket on this turbo and no ports to plug or unplug.

Are you ever going to stop quoting petrol turbo literature on a diesel site?


Jim

To quote an old Arkansas pig farmer, "Never wrestle with a pig, you will get muddy and he will like it". Mr D will argue double negatives until you are blue in the fingers and frustrated. Use the ignore function in your head and enjoy the rest of the "information". There is a wealth of information here as well as a load of dross, you just have to sift carefully.
One of 2 hillbillies
eric
P.S. My sig line shows my build, try page 2 or 3 for the water hook up

 

[Dougal]

If the literature I post is for petrol not diesel why do you do this?

Originally Posted by Dougal
No, there is no water jacket on this turbo and no ports to plug or unplug.

Are you ever going to stop quoting petrol turbo literature on a diesel site?


Jim

You do that because very hot shutdowns are bad for every type of engine whether petrol, diesel, turbo or non-turbo.

The garrett aftermarket literature is aimed at the ricer market, diesels are such a small fraction of that that it almost avoids mention.
Most ricers are turned cold by the notion that garrett also make turbochargers for diesel engines and that most diesels are now turbocharged.

Here's a garrett GT2052V turbocharger which is designed solely for a diesel application. No water jacket. I've owned two of these.

Here's a GT2256V, again a turbo designed solely for a diesel engine. No water jacket. I have one of these in my spares box if you'd like some more photos.

Here's a holset HX35, again a turbo designed solely for use on a diesel engine. No water jacket. They are used by some ricers on petrol engines and survive fine.

Here is a garrett GT1749V. Again a turbo designed solely for use on a diesel engine and again no water jacket.

Maybe next time you're talking to your garrett contact, ask them why they make turbos without water jackets?

 

[cruiser_guy]

To quote an old Arkansas pig farmer, "Never wrestle with a pig, you will get muddy and he will like it". Mr D will argue double negatives until you are blue in the fingers and frustrated. Use the ignore function in your head and enjoy the rest of the "information". There is a wealth of information here as well as a load of dross, you just have to sift carefully.
One of 2 hillbillies
eric
P.S. My sig line shows my build, try page 2 or 3 for the water hook up

Be nice!! Argue, but be nice!!