Coil Spring Conversion - Sanity Check (1 Viewer)

[missouristig]

Hey guys,

Me again. So it appears that my stock airbags may be on the way out on my 2009 GX470. I drove the truck on Monday (and a lot this last weekend, including about 200 mile round trip) and it rides great, and the height control seems to work (it will go up and down) but I noticed last night after not driving it for a few days, i've got a sag. The bags have deflated all the way down to the bump stops and the passenger side is lower than the driver's side. So i'm looking at doing a coil spring conversion. At 168k, I don't feel like investing money into the air setup is a good idea. Sure I can replace the air bags but then what happens if the height sensors go out, and then the compressor goes out? It just seems like a rabbit hole I don't want to go down, and i'd rather stick a piece of metal in there that I don't have to worry about. I'm taking it on a 500 mile round trip this weekend and I feel OK that they'll hold up for the length of the trip, but I know that time may be coming to an end.

I don't want to lift the truck. I want to maintain stock height. Also my shocks appear to be in great shape, and the adjustable ride still works great (comfort makes me sick, sport is rough. About 3/4 to sport is just right for me). So from everything i've read, it seems like a pretty easy job, but I want to make sure i'm going about this right. Here is what I've come up with:
Metal Tech Stage 1 lower mount: Metal Tech GX470 Rear Coil Conversion Kit Stage 1
FJ Cruiser Springs Moog 81081: More Information for MOOG 81081
Moog Upper Isolator: More Information for MOOG K160061

All this for less than $180 shipped (Rock Auto is great if you are ok with waiting a week for shipping....)

I looked at the Metal Tech Stage 2 kit with the upper isolators and it seems like I really don't need them? For the price it seems like a lot, even if I spend $120 on the stock Toyota ones from Amazon, it seems like the only purpose they really service is putting a piece of rubber between the springs and the metal of the frame, and people have used the Moog ones before.

Does this seem like a legit setup? Since i'm keeping stock height, I don't need to do anything to the shocks right? That's not really in the budget right now. Yes I know there is a search feature and thousands of guys have done this before, but it almost always seems like lifts are involved and new shocks, and that's not what i'm after.

 

[470SNC]

The rubber isolator is actually a secondary bump stop sitting inside the spring, it doesnt seem necessary but it is there for a reason.

 

[joabmc]

I’ll second that. Coil isolators are a necessity. I ordered the MT stage 2 because I couldn’t get a better deal locally. They actually gave me the part # and said if I could get them for less than $80, to buy them independently but I couldn’t.

 

[missouristig]

Thanks for the second (and third) opinion. I was able to find them cheaper on eBay ($110 for the set w/ free shipping) so I bought those just now.

 

[470SNC]

Yeah I think I bought mine on Amazon with free shipping and saved like 10-20 bucks.

 

[missouristig]

Yeah I think I bought mine on Amazon with free shipping and saved like 10-20 bucks.

Amazon wants $80 a piece for them on Prime. Considering I don't need them in 2 days, I can wait about a week for the free eBay shipping. The FJ Springs were $1 cheaper on shipping on eBay (via Summit Racing apparently) than Rock Auto so I went ahead and got those. Not really any room for pricing on the Metal Tech kit, so i'll have to just pay full price for that....

 

[GXMac]

Not really any room for pricing on the Metal Tech kit, so i'll have to just pay full price for that

If you have the time and a drill press, you can put a kit together for less than ~$30- you just need a couple pieces of 3" x 1"+ bar stock (any metal but aluminum is easier to drill), the 15.6103 isolators from energy suspension and a couple 3/8" or 1/2" diameter bolts to bolt the assembly to the axle.

 

[missouristig]

If you have the time and a drill press, you can put a kit together for less than ~$30- you just need a couple pieces of 3" x 1"+ bar stock (any metal but aluminum is easier to drill), the 15.6103 isolators from energy suspension and a couple 3/8" or 1/2" diameter bolts to bolt the assembly to the axle.

Interesting idea. I'll keep that in mind

 

[missouristig]

So as an update to my original quandry, tonight I got home around 4:45 (not driving the GX) and i started it up in the garage (door open obviously) and it lifted the rear end up to "normal". 3 hours later at around 7:45, it was sitting about 1/2" on the driver's side from the bump stops, and the passenger side was definitely on the stops. So it seems like one side is definitely leaking more than the other, but slow leaks for sure. So definitely glad i'm doing the coil upgrade, but it doesn't seem like it's a terrible situation...... yet

 

[theferg]

If you have the time and a drill press, you can put a kit together for less than ~$30- you just need a couple pieces of 3" x 1"+ bar stock (any metal but aluminum is easier to drill), the 15.6103 isolators from energy suspension and a couple 3/8" or 1/2" diameter bolts to bolt the assembly to the axle.

I've seen caster wheels used as well and after I just got my (2nd) Metaltech kit, I would have preferred doing the caster wheel. The MetalTech kit I got uses a metal "cup" placed upside down on the stock spring "perch" (I swear my first kit a couple years ago was a solid piece...) ....made for an interesting install as the cup kept wanted to go off on one side or another as it tightened down. I am still waiting for my upper isolators to arrive as i bought them separately, so when I do those, I'm planning to swap to the caster wheel setup.

Seems the lower caster wheel or bar stock needs to be a bit thicker (taller) than a 3"x1" from looking at the "cups" on mine. More like 3"x2" or so. I'll try and measure them. Edit: dont really see a reason it has to be that thick. 3"×1" would suffice. Size of a a hockey puck. Theyd prob work just fine. Just drill a hole in the center.

If I were doing it again, I'd try get two hockey pucks plus two of these for the bottom: FJ-RCSI - Urethane Coil Spring Isolator Pad and then find the cheapest place to get the top coil isolators ($30 ea from UAE plus shipping might be the cheapest, but shipping could kill the deal for ya, depending).

 

[missouristig]

Got the Metaltech kit in the mail yesterday, as well as the FJ Springs. Definitely looks like a pretty beefy setup. Looking like i'll probably be installing it on Black Friday.

I do have another question that is suspension related, but on the front. So when I got the GX, the front fender aprons were disinegrated. There were lots of pins that were just in the frame with no apron attached. Some pieces had a tiny piece of apron left that was brittle plastic. So anyway, I jacked the front up a wheel at a time and took the wheels off. I noticed when I put the new aprons on (from eBay) and put the wheel back down on the ground, that the front bump stop seems pretty close to the control arm. I never really looked before I took the wheel off. There's some grease/dirt on the control arms, but where the bump stop would meet the control arm, it's much cleaner in a perfect circle. Both sides are the same height. The front seems to have a proper ride height, but it seems like the distance to the bump stop isn't very much. It looks like on the back side (closest to the frame) maybe 3/8 of an inch, then maybe closer to 3/4-1" on the outside. I didn't grab a pic, but again, both sides are the same. Is that OK? I tried to find some information on ride heights and such for stock but didn't find much. It rides fine, not rough or anything, so i'm not sure...

 

[GXO]

It's fine. Should have gotten rad rubber aprons. They last longer.

 

[missouristig]

It's fine. Should have gotten rad rubber aprons. They last longer.

Thanks for the confirmation on the bump stops. I guess if i'm still worried I could stick my Go-Pro down there and drive around, but I guess as long as it's riding fine and not bottoming out, then I don't know why i'm worrying.

These seem to be rubber. They are pretty darn thick, they definitely don't "tear" like the old paperish crap. I replaced them on my old Tundra because they started to rip and I had the old ones to template, and used a rubber "carpet runner" from Ace Hardware to make thicker ones and it worked great. In this case I couldn't make my own since there were none left.... there are what I got Apron for Toyota 4Runner GX470 FJ Cruiser Apron Fender Liner Seal Splash Shield 713289474232 | eBay

 

[missouristig]

Ok so another question regarding the Coil Spring setup. After dumping the airbags, how much will towing capacity be effected? My old Tahoe was just coil springs and I was able to tow 3000lbs or so with some squat but not too bad. Will I see similar with the conversion on the GX? Or will it completely destroy towing and i'd need to install a set of Firestone airbags inside the spring? I don't tow a lot, but I like being able to if I need to.

 

[GXO]

Depends on the weight rating of the spring. Airbags will help a lot. I have some VERY big springs in back with my aux tank and travel trailer so I haven't lost any.

 

[FurleyRosa]

Looking forward to hearing how u like the setup, planning on doing the same soon

 

[TahoeLX450]

FYI. My bags went quickly. I noticed a slight lean one day and two days latter I was sitting on the bump stops. Had the springs and conversion sitting in the garage so was no biggie...but if you are starting to sag they could go at any time.

 

[missouristig]

FYI. My bags went quickly. I noticed a slight lean one day and two days latter I was sitting on the bump stops. Had the springs and conversion sitting in the garage so was no biggie...but if you are starting to sag they could go at any time.

So far so good! I've been running on leaking bags for a couple weeks now and i've not had an issue. They still inflate/deflate just fine and it rides great, just doesn't stay level in the garage over time. Wasn't able to get them installed Black Friday like I planned, but I am going to this weekend.

 

[oemoilleaks]

So far so good! I've been running on leaking bags for a couple weeks now and i've not had an issue. They still inflate/deflate just fine and it rides great, just doesn't stay level in the garage over time. Wasn't able to get them installed Black Friday like I planned, but I am going to this weekend.

Be careful, you'll burn out your compressor pretty quickly. As your bags deflate while driving, the system will constantly refill them which will put extra wear on the compressor.

 

[missouristig]

So I got the bags replaced today. Pretty happy with the setup so far. The install as actually a bit of a PITA. We pulled the airbags and I ended up cutting the lines since I don't plan on replacing the bags at any point just to make it easier to pull out. We put the Metal Tech spring perches on the axle and then attempted to put the springs on with a compressor. No dice. Even with taking the shock lower bolts out, we couldn't get the axle down enough to get the springs in even compressed. Getting that spring up and over the middle of the MetalTech perch was difficult since it was about an inch higher than where the spring actually rests. So we took the Spring perches off and then put the perches in the bottom of the spring and then slid it into place and that worked. We used a socket through the coils to tighten everything down at that point. Given how much of a PITA it was to get the OEM FJ spring in there i'm not even sure how you would manage to get a taller, lifted spring in that same spot, maybe have to detach the sway bar to get more flex.

The truck sits at the same level as the "Normal" height and it rides no different than the airbags. So i'm definitely happy with this setup, and it was well worth the ~$250 it cost. Pulled the compressor relay and the TENS fuse and no lights on the dash or anything.