Chains on One Axle

[Stealth]

Last weekend here in the NW, Portland we had a serious freezing rain and black ice storm. Which meant you could not walk anywhere nor could you drive without chains. People would drive up a hill then slide back down backwards, it was bad. Anyways I had to drive in it as the fiance' is in the medical field and was "on call" for the weekend. I bought one set of chains and ran them on the front the whole time but not exceeding 25mph. I did some research already but did not find any for sure info on whether this practice is O.K. for the VC. Some say is is fine, other says no??? I do not mind putting on another set for the rear it is just the chains are not cheap.

Kelly

 

[Doc]

with full time 4wd, you should be sending power to which ever wheel has the better grip, so my guess is that it would be OK.

 

[RavenTai]

dont the chains change the effective diameter of the tire?

 

[Doc]

Yes, but my guess is not enough (especially at low speed) to cause havoc in the VC.

 

[aamiggia]

I would think that running the chains on the front will not do anything because the rear wheels will spin with no traction. Unless you use the CDL (if you have one) the chains, at one end, will only prevent you from sliding back down the hill.

In a 4wd truck with 3 open diffs, all of the power will be sent to the wheel with the least amount of traction. The power from the tranny will like to follow the path of least resistance. You can thank a lazy Mother Nature for that

I think there is a document explaining diffs somewhere on an 80's site.

 

[flintknapper]

Won't hurt it.

The difference in tire diameter is negligible, and wouldn't be a concern unless you had the center diff. locked and were on a hard surface with good traction.

Chains on at all four corners of course would be best....and your safety is well worth another $120.00 or so.

My .02

 

[Stealth]

aamiggia, I do not have a CDL but do have low range which does the same, so the front spun the same as the rear which was perfect because I climbed some steep stuff when others were sliding down backwards.

Thanks for the other replys.

 

[thekirk]

The Owner's Manual for my '93 says this about chains and snow tires:
____________________________________________________________
--Snow tires should be installed on all wheels

Installing snow tires on rear wheels only can lead to an excessive difference in road grip capability between the front and the rear tires which could cause loss of vehicle control.

--Chain Installation

Install the chains on the rear wheels. Install the chains as tightly as possible. Re-tighten chains after driving 0.5-1.0 km (1/4-1/2 mile).

CAUTION

Do not exceed 50 kmh (30 mph) or the chain manufacturer's recommended speed limit, whichever is lower.
_______________________________
From that, I'd say that the only thing you might want to re-do is the axle you're putting the chains on. I'm not entirely sure why the manual would tell you to put the chains on the rear axle, but I'm thinking there may be a bias in the design of the differentials that makes it give more power to the rear, or something like that. My preference, without checking the manual, when you're talking an all-wheel drive, would be to chain up the front, for the steering benefit. Which is what you did. However, Mr. Toyota seems to feel differently. Personally, I would say put chains on all four wheels, because it just doesn't make sense not to, in my experience. Most of your vehicle weight should be over the rear axle (if you have any kind of load in there, which I would-sandbags are your friend, in these conditions). Chains in back should reduce any fish-tailing your rear may want to do, while giving you the traction to "go", while the chains in the front will give you enough "bite" to actually steer on ice. I really don't understand why the manual makes a distinction between snow tires and chains, unless they figure that the lower speeds at which you're using chains with won't make enough of a difference between the axle speeds/traction.

Enjoy the ice--if it weren't for the potential of other idiots and the chance of damaging your rig, it's almost fun, seeing whether or not you can maintain control. Saw some video yesterday of the after-effects of some really bad drivers, down there in Portland. Some guy got his Land Rover sandwiched between a couple of US-built SUVs, on a hill, and all three looked to be totalled down at the bottom. Fun stuff, freezing rain...

Makes you really glad you sprung for the comprehensive coverage, when you have to deal with it.

 

[brent]

I'm new to Cruiser but growing up in Alaska we live on a mountain and would have to chain up a few times a year to get up/down, we always had Subarus and Ford trucks and I never saw a problem with a diff because of using chains, I've ran em on the front/ back and once even diagonal, hoenstly for the small amount of time that they are on the vehicle I think you would really have to do something wrong to mess anything up.....just my opinion.......these vehicles are meant to go

 

[Tooth Fairy]

Move 'em to the back. I think you'll notice a big difference on forward progression.

If the roads are that slick having different tire diameters due to the chain effect (hehe ) will be a wash with the tire slippage. Might be why the factory said to run one set. Introduce that slippage on purpose.

$.02. Keep the change.

 

[cruiserdan]

Lock the center and chain the front. this combination mimics conventional 4WD with chains on the front axle. Chain the front first as this gives better steering control. If you still need more traction chain the rear next. I would not chain only the rear unless you are descending a steep incline. In this case it helps to keep you from "swapping ends" in the descent.


D-

 

[sjcruiser]

With slippage on the front, you could always steer; whereas with the rear when it slips, you're hopeless. I think this is the main reason Costco refuses to put new tires in the front (if only a pair is replaced), regardless if the vehicle is a FWD, RWD, or 4WD, but always in the rear.

Frank.

 

[speyrod]

I lived through the ice storm it was not as bad as those in previous years. I just sat it out at home no real need to go out. I would have chained up the front and rear. It just gets too nasty to consider doing anything less. Go to Costco spend the extra $58, if for nothing other than peace of mind. If you only chain one end make it the front as CDan mentions you can still steer.

 

[mabrodis]

The front versus rear debate is a old one. I have always thought putting the best tires on the front, putting chains on the front, etc. Because being able to steer is paramount, even if you're spinning the tires, being able to steer has always be a higher priority. However, now places like Costco (previously mentioned) will not put only new tires on the front, because of the tendency for a car to slide around...even if going slow around a turn with good tires on the front-end the front will turn but the back tires may just slide out and around.

I have always thought Costco's rule was stupid and felt it promoted more people sliding off the road for not being able to turn, but could accellerate (assuming RWD), so you wouldn't spin but would just slide off the road. I guess there is some validity to having a car not spin around, since then you lose complete control whereas just sliding off (but seeing where you're going) is better?

I would still put the best tires/chains, etc on the front. My reasoning is the front tires do so much more than the rears. With the front you can be spinning and turn the wheel back and forth, make them pull in the direction YOU want with only a small regard as to what direction the actual vehicle is pointing. The rears you can not change the direction they are pushing, only by turning the entire vehicle, if you can't get the vehicle turned, then you can never get the rears to push in the direction you want.

About the CDL being locked and the tires being slightly different, that wouldn't matter one bit. We're talking about a slippery road here, VERY slippery where cars are sliding all over. You can even drive with the CDL locked on dry roads, not sposeto, but I have done it, ofcourse it's not 'good', but certainly didn't break anything, so IMO that would not even be an issue at moments like that.

 

[Stealth]

Costco..

$58? What kind are those, not cable are they. I also have 305's, so that may make a difference in pricing. Got mine at Schwabs for $115 and they are Chains not cables, Quick Fits.

 

[NorCalDoug]

I'm thinking about getting a set of these GoClaws from Costco.

I don't need to use chains on a regular basis -- these seem interesting.
On the upside, if they turn out to be crap, I can always return them for a refund.

The easy install (so they state) is a nice bonus as well.

Any thoughts?

 

[Brentbba]

Just picked up a new set of chains at Pep Boys for my new 285's. $104 out the door. Real heavy duty chains. Old, but never used chains from my OEM 275's would not fit.

 

[clownmidget]

Doug, I'd be concerned that the CHiPs wouldn't consider those "chains", so you'd still prevented from going on your way. They might certainly help you out of a pinch but going long distances over all sorts of crap might be too much for them.

I played around with chaining up each axle while in Yosemite over New Years on deep snow covered pavement and on deeper snow covered fire roads. Everything stated by everyone else is right! On the road I preferred to have them on the back due to really needing to control your descent speed since there was often another car in front of you behaving badly. It's also good not to have the CDL engaged as the ABS worked pretty good under these conditions. Only on one occasion did the front totally plow and the tires alone up front weren't able to allow me to steer. I was pretty concerned about the rear coming around during downhill braking on what had become icy, hard snow pack roads.

I think having the real "chain" chains in the rear and the Z-style cables in the front would be the ticket.

Also, now isn't such a great time to be looking for deals on chains. Wait a couple of months then start gleening the classifieds, ebay, etc. So many folks in CA get stuck buying chains when CHiPs mandates them and then get bent over by the hawks in vans along the sides of the highway selling them for well over $100. Once the warm weather hits though they're selling them at an incredible discount. Granted this may be really an LA, SD, OC, SoCal phenomenon but I regularly see very high quality chain sets for 285, 305 and 315 tires for under $50 a pair and only been used once if that.

And if you haven't ever wheeled with chains in deep snow, you'll be pretty amazed.

Mike R.

 

[flintknapper]

Not just deep snow.

We use chains for mud when we elk hunt in Colorado.

Seems the locals are fond of making log bridges over mud holes in the trails and chains are about the only way you're going to get over a mud slick log (with maybe a little snow added).

Helps for stopping too.