89' FJ62 Paint Restoration Question

[cwilliams]

My 1989 FJ62 is showing a few rust spots that are forcing me to seek out a new paint job. I'm looking for feedback/opinion...

1. I've been told to go out of California for a better paint job. Is this true and is it worth it?

2. I was quoted at least $10,000.00 from a reputable company here in San Diego and that it would take 3 months. Anyone had theirs painted and what was the cost in comparison?

3. Does anyone know of a reputable "mom/pop" shop that does excellent work at a fair price?

Any input is appreciated. Thanks!

 

[g-man]

Ok. Here are some basics about paint jobs.

1.Everybody and their brother knows someone who paints. So what! EDIT: my point here is that if you ask around say at an informal gathering, here's what you're going to get: "my friends uncle so and so paints cars, I'm sure I can get you a deal!" Unfortunately your friend knows nothing about paint jobs, and his friend knows nothing about paint jobs and his uncle probably doesn't like him or his friend (the one giving you the low down) and could care less about giving you a "deal". Anddddd...we still know nothing about his talent or lack thereof. My advice is don't ask around at informal gatherings. You may feel obligated in some way to your friend to give his friends uncle your business.

2. Painting cars is an art with great detail and tons of prep work. There is no such thing as perfect.

3. Collision shops like to get you in and out and are best at collision work and don't want to paint a whole car with all the detail of disassembling parts etc. That said some will entertain the thought and do the work for the right money esp if things are slow. I'd avoid a collision shop.

4. Getting involved with a mom/pop shop can be good if they do good work (and many do) and you have an excellent understanding of what is expected and for how much. It also can be a disaster for the car owner and possibly bad for the guy painting the car. He expects to be paid on time and for you to not hold him up by not having funds to move forward. Also can be frustrating if you are changing your mind on colors/paint/materials involved and the level of work done. He wants his work to be quality and doesn't want you to decide to side step certain aspects in the middle of the work. You don't want him to push your vehicle to a corner while he picks up other jobs either. Lots of trust is involved and like I said a very good understanding ...I'd get it all in writing first. Right down to the details. Will the bumpers come off? What else, doors? Will the fender wells and firewall be painted? Will side mirrors and door handles be removed?. How will the old paint will be stripped? ,materials...what kind of paint; primer; and clear coat; how many coats; wet sanding steps; buffing steps ..etc.

Even after having a written understanding things will come up that are not covered...like finding a bad fill of old Bondo in a quarter panel that should be removed ...and what do you want to do about that? Will you source another quarter panel patch? Will he weld in a patch from sheet metal? Now you see how you have got to feel good about getting along with this guy.

5. Go to Cruise-ins and car shows. Ask people who painted their car. You will get names and numbers. Go by their shop and talk to them about painting. Ask them how many cars they paint. How many did they paint this year. Do they have a paint booth?

6. Automotive paint and supplies are getting VERY expensive. Don't be alarmed to find out it will be over $2000 in supplies and quality paints. Most paint jobs will NOT pay for themselves if you are thinking about building equity and re-selling at some point. The exception to this is high value vehicles.

7. Know what you want. Are you OK with a little poly filler to fill out the dings and imperfections before priming? Or must you have metal filler like non-toxic lead? Are you good with a Dual Action sander aka D/A? for taking it down to metal or are you insisting on a chemical strip? Will you want basecoat/clearcoat or urethane? Do you want high solids clearcoat?

 

[gregnash]

As I am going through this particular process with the intent on painting myself, everything that @g-man said above is spot on. With painting, literally the devil is in the details. It all comes down to what your expectations are for the job and result. The $10k number is realistic but that is probably for the shop to do everything, pull all emblems, sand down to a good base, reprime, block, paint everything and door jambs, multiple layers and then bake with a base-clear combo. That may or may not include any body work that would need to be done for those items found after the paint has been striped down to a reasonable surface for the new primer to adhere to.

MAACO is an alternative where people are starting to show where they have produced "decent" results on the cheap. However, that changes based on the shop (as they are independently owned and operated as a franchise) and the talent within the shop. Go into something like that knowing that you are getting a cheap paint job that could wow you or completely underwhelm you.

Here is what prices I have calculated so far for myself to do in my garage.
- HVLP guns (HF special "Pro" grade Kit) $50 comes with a small detail gun and main gun with two tip sizes (1.4 for base/clear and 1.7 for primer)
- Air regulator for compressor to keep HVLP pressures in check $25
- Inline dissecant filter (filters out moisture and some oil from compressor) ~$7-$15ea
- DA Palm sander (to sand down body panels) ~$50 for a cheaper one, can be found at HF currently for ~$20
- Sanding discs (for DA) ~$25-$50 for multiple grits to get that High Build Primer to a nice-ish flat panel (At least have 240grit and 320grit for this)
- Sand Paper (2.75"W by X long) for block, ~$50-$100 for multiple grits. This will be needed to get you a nice finish for everything from 500grit to 2k grit
- Sanding Blocks (actual foam blocks that the paper attaches to) ~$50 (can get a kit with multiple block sizes on Amazon)
- Bondo/Body Filler (needed to fill in those sections that cannot be pulled out, etc.) ~$25 and really depends on how bad your body is and what is "acceptable" to you (Looks good from 20', 10', 5'???)
- Glazing putty (needed to fill small chips and other sections that body filler didn't take care of) $20

So just in THOSE items right there you are looking at almost $400 in materials and you haven't even gotten to painting yet.
From there paint/primer/clear really depends on brand and what not you go with. I talked to a local auto paint supply house and they gave me two top/base coat brands to work with... Nason Enamel Farm Implement paint (only comes in basic colors) and then their house brand (can't remember the name, wasn't a huge brand like PPG though) and the Nason ended up being ~$60/gallon for the color I wanted or the house brand was about 2x that. Both were single-stage enamels. Add to that the fact that you will more than likely want to go with a 2k Urethane primer/surfacer or high-build primer to bring the body panels "straight" then you are talking about another $60+ there for that alone..

So all in all, not cheap to do. Yes you can cut some corners (and I am sure I am forgetting a lot of stuff) and you can make some compromises but still will not be cheap or easy when you are looking at AT LEAST a full weekend to prep, prime, paint yourself.

 

[Prairie Swamp]

On top of all that - quality supplies including tape, masking paper, plastic sheeting, thinking solvents, cleanup solvents, more $$$ abrasives if you are to color sand and buff.... It adds up fast. It's just an expensive process.

 

[JTU]

I just had my 60 repainted by a local shop here in Mississippi. I completely stripped the vehicle and brought it to them and still it took 4 weeks of body work and 120 hours of labor. Painting a whole vehicle the size of a 60/62 series is a big task. Don’t skimp on it but most shops will knock off a big chunk if you do the disassembly and reassembly and pay in $100 bills vs credit cards. Like was stated in a previous post, I would avoid a shop that is strictly an insurance collision shop, but at the same time a collision shop’s painter is pretty experienced and they usually have good booths and equipment. The shop that painted mine is about 75% collision and 25% custom work, their painter is meticulously OCD about his work. Whatever shop you visit ask to meet the painter to see who will be doing to work.

 

[Wayne Jacobs]

I. You can get a great paint job done in California.

2. I'm in Florida, and for a panel-off, bare-metal job on my FJ 62, I was quoted $6500-$8500, if there are no surprises. A recent job had surprises and ended up costing $3000 over the estimate. This would cover removal & replacement of all trim pieces, but not purchase of any that are not serviceable. I was also told that it would take 2-6 months depending upon weather and how much other business (collision) they had come in.

3. Since I'm in Florida, I have no comment, other than by a "fair price" I hope you don't mean a very low one. I got a low-price paint job 15 years ago when I was in Colorado. That paint is now in worse shape than the original Toyota paint on the vehicle. Doing this is a whole lot less expensive than purchasing a new car.

My first goal is to not only stop a few rust areas from progressing, but also to get my vehicle looking good and have it stay that way. I chose the shop for this job based upon the work they've done for others, and their reputation for standing behind their work. I plan on having a "way-out" paint job done, where you are afterwards compelled to park "way out" in the lot so that no one is likely to park right next to you.

 

[LCnAZ]

I just had my 60 repainted by a local shop here in Mississippi. I completely stripped the vehicle and brought it to them and still it took 4 weeks of body work and 120 hours of labor. Painting a whole vehicle the size of a 60/62 series is a big task. Don’t skimp on it but most shops will knock off a big chunk if you do the disassembly and reassembly and pay in $100 bills vs credit cards. Like was stated in a previous post, I would avoid a shop that is strictly an insurance collision shop, but at the same time a collision shop’s painter is pretty experienced and they usually have good booths and equipment. The shop that painted mine is about 75% collision and 25% custom work, their painter is meticulously OCD about his work. Whatever shop you visit ask to meet the painter to see who will be doing to work.

That's pretty much the route I'm going. I'm removing the grille/bezels, mud flaps, lights, wiper arms, wiper covers, vents, etc.. He'll just have to drop the stock bumpers and put them back on after complete. He can remove the emblems because I have replacements for all those. I restored the mud flaps, and will refinish the wiper arms and rear vents. I'll install all the replaced/restored items myself. Not removing glass for the job. All Arizona, so no rust or body work. Just sun and years.

Sometimes really good shops allow a tech who's been with them a long time to do jobs on the side. Of course, that will not come with the big money lifetime warranty, but if you know the shop's work and the tech, you're likely to get a good job and a great price. That's the way I'm going. Of course, I confirmed all the expectations after he inspected the vehicle.

 

[87CRUSR]

I received quotes up to $8k including some body work. Several quotes were in the $4k range. I ended up paying $2.5k plus some tips. I removed all body hardware including grill, light buckets, side markers, logos, vents...etc. shop removed doors, hood, tail and lift gates. I did concede an extended timeline so they could work on my truck in between jobs. It took about 3 months. I did get lucky as it seemed the owner was gone most of the time and the lead painter thought he was doing an $8k job. I gave him a couple Jacksons for his troubles and the owner a few as well. Pleased with the outcome but warranty is invalid as the shop was shut down and sold.

 

[SteveH]

He'll just have to drop the stock bumpers and put them back on after complete.

Slight tangent - I would do this yourself. Most shops will put an impact wrench on the nuts of the chrome bumper bolts, and right after they loosen, they will spin in the square holes and chew up the chrome. I clamped the chrome (exposed) bolts down with c-clamps, protected by blocks of wood, and then loosened the nuts after soaking with PB Blaster.

There was a Mud thread on this, and the takeaway is that it's very easy to damage the bumper chrome and screw up a good bumper, and no shop will care as much as you do. They may also assign 'bumper removal' to the trainee, who isn't likely to know or care how it should be done. Save yourself some heartache and DIY beforehand.