Builds 86 Xtra Cab Build (4Wheelunderground 3 link front, 4 link rear and 3.4 swap) (6 Viewers)

[aztoyman]

Hmm.........I'll go stare at it for a while and decide I guess. I have to make a decision before I notch the frame. I'd like to eventually get some bead locks and 37's so.........

 

[aztoyman]

The more I look at this, the more I'm starting to understand. I just realized that since my frame height right now is 30" (For set-up purposes) And at full stuff (both sides) with my wheels up on a 10" high stand, puts my frame height at 20" at full stuff if my wheels were on the ground. So.....a 24" ride height only gives me 4" of up travel.

The ONLY way I can get more up travel is to cut my frame in a spot I shouldn't be cutting my frame. Right in front of my cab mount is where the lower links contact the frame. So it is what it is using my IFS frame. Cutting the front frame off and fabbing one up is not in my plan. I don't know if bending lower links is a good idea. So I'll probably have a ride height of 24" to 26". My 88 is 27" and a bit higher than I like but, I've been driving it for years.

 

[peacesells63]

I can’t remember what frame height my 87 4runner came out at, but it was level with 4” rear leafs. That truck was on 37’s and sat about the same as a typical leaf spring truck. I would not have liked the truck if I did not do the frame notch for more uptravel, it hit bumps quite a bit as it was.

On all of the minis I had, I moved the front axle at least 2” forward to keep the tire out of the firewall and improve approach. Do you plan on always running 35’s?

 

[peacesells63]

Here are a few pictures of that truck. I built it in 2 weeks, so I did not take many pictures during the build.

I believe I ended up right where you are, the most uptravel I could get without lower links hitting the frame. The truck rode and drove really nice, I believe I ended up shortening to bumps to 2” of travel. On the Tacoma a friend and I did more recently the bumps are destroked to 1.75” and it rides nice.

 

[aztoyman]

Thanks for the info. This is a first for me so I definitely appreciate it.

I'm going to try cycling the suspension at this point and see how it goes.

Here's a pic of "simulated" ride height of 26". Ground to bottom of the frame below the doors. I put 4" of spacers under the tires. Safer than me trying to raise and lower the entire truck on stands.

Brian said it looks a little too far forward but might be perfect for 37's. I do want to go to 37's so I might leave it. As mentioned, it definitely improves approach angle.

 

[aztoyman]

What do you mean "destroked" the bumps and the advantage?

I bought the air bumps and I'd like to get them right the first time.

Scott

 

[peacesells63]

What do you mean "destroked" the bumps and the advantage?

I bought the air bumps and I'd like to get them right the first time.

Scott

You can pull the bump stop apart and add spacers to shorten the stroke. I believe Bryan’s are already 2.5” if you ordered through him.

My buddies Tacoma only has about 3.5” of uptravel and actually rides really nice. It took a lot of playing with spring rates and rate stops and valving, but these were off the shelf fox coilovers. The ones Brian supplies are already valved for the kit, so you probably won’t have to touch them. I think his primary spring rates will be a bit light with the 3.4, but you really won’t know until you drive it and play with the stops. The Tacoma is 200/350, but that’s a quad cab 3.4 with a supercharger and less uptravel than you have. If you did want a lower ride height you have options and can still get the truck to ride great at higher speeds.

 

[peacesells63]

The advantage to shortening the bump stroke is that you won’t be hitting bumps as much.

 

[peacesells63]

The lx470 I’m building sits around 5.5-6” uptravel with 2.5” stroke bumps, but it’s a much heavier truck and I plan on really beating on it.

 

[aztoyman]

Thanks. I hope I get my springs soon. I filled out a form Brian sent asking what engine, bumper, winch, etc. Obviously I haven't put it on scales but it sounds like Brian has done enough of these to get pretty close to start.

 

[peacesells63]

And definitely don’t run bent lower links, they won’t hold up and you will lose adjustability. I think your ride height will be good, you should have plenty of room to play with. If you add any more uptravel than I did you will have to trim a lot of sheet metal.

The way I do it is get everything tacked together, then set it on the ground at full bump level front to rear. If you don’t want to tack the cans in (I don’t) make a spacer and tack it onto the frame. From there, raise the body and cycle the suspension with tires on and see how for your tires are getting into sheet metal, firewall clearance etc.

 

[peacesells63]

Thanks. I hope I get my springs soon. I filled out a form Brian sent asking what engine, bumper, winch, etc. Obviously I haven't put it on scales but it sounds like Brian has enough of these to get pretty close to start.

Brians spring rates are usually on the lighter side, but they will ride nice with his valving. The geometry of his kit addresses the stability and body roll issues that people try to correct with heavier spring rates. We had to go heavier on the primary rate with my buddies Tacoma because of the lower ride height and limited uptravel. Not that you will have to, but just so you know there are options if you want a lower ride height.

 

[aztoyman]

Ok, I think I have a much better understanding of this install and I definitely made some progress today. At least I have most of it tacked in place. No more heavy parts flopping around or hanging precariously overhead.

I had to get the upper link cut to length and mounted up so the axle wouldn't rotate over as I moved it. To do this the truck needs to be at ride height. So I put 4" of blocks under the tires. With the frame at 30" this makes my ride height 26".

I made sure the axle was centered and used my angle finder to set caster at 6 degrees. Caster needs to be set or you won't have the correct length. The axle housing rotates forward or backward changing the length. It also has to be done at ride height. Then I measured between the upper link brackets with the rod ends in place. Cut the tube to length and tacked it position.

I also needed to cut the pan hard tubing to length. Once I get the pan hard in the axle will stay centered side to side. The passenger side bracket was in place but the driver side was not. Now that the upper and lower links are in place I could safely raise the axle.

I raised it to max up position. Lower links hitting the frame. Then I positioned the driver side bump stop/ pan hard bracket and tacked so it was aligned for the bump stop. Should get me close.

Next I lowered the axle down to ride height again. On the 4" blocks and
re centered the axle since it shifted a bit without the bar in place yet. I installed the rod ends in the brackets and measured. Cut the tube to length and tacked it up.

I raised the axle up and down, articulated it and rechecked center. Right on.

I did notice that the pan hard bar is not exactly parallel with the tie rod. Close but it's off enough that I'm going to cut the tacks on the driver side bracket and move it forward a bit.

The axle side pan hard bracket ended up 90 degrees to the frame. Damn, got lucky.

To center everything I ran a string from the center of the T-case mount to the center of the crank bolt and hung a plumb bob. I measured and marked the center of the axle. There's a soap stone line but, it's covered by the string. The engine and T-case are centered in the frame so this gets me as close as possible.
Here's some pics.

 

[aztoyman]

It's very slight but you can see the panhard bar is not parallel to the tie rod. Looking up from underneath. Here's the bracket I need to move just a little forward.

 

[aztoyman]

I'm going to cut tack welds on the upper link brackets and tweak them just a tiny bit to give me a little more room for the slave cylinder. It looks like it's touching the bolts but it's not. I still want a little more clearance here.

 

[aztoyman]

I might not have to raise the engine. I wont know for sure until I notch the frame and recheck clearance. I need to get the high pinion bolted up as well as the slave cylinder and starter before that recheck though.

I got the FJ 80 tie rod reamer in the mail today so now I can hopefully get my tie rod flipped under the steering arms properly.

 

[aztoyman]

Before I took the steering arms off to ream them I articulated the axle up with just one tire on. I saw this and it "seems" clear that I need to move the axle back an inch or two.
Max stuff one side only.

 

[aztoyman]

Then I went full turn and it "seems" I don't have to move the axle back.

 

[aztoyman]

Then full steer the other way. And yep, it looks like it needs to go back a bit.
Hits the battery box and front sheet metal. And it's not full up.

 

[aztoyman]

Stepped back to look at the whole picture.

There's no way this is how much it will droop. Before I move anything I need to get the shocks mocked up to see actual travel.

I better stick to working on the steering arms today.