2005 LC Rough Suspension and Baseline (1 Viewer)

[lcnj]

Hello everyone!

I am the lucky buyer of a new-to-me 2005 Land Cruiser with 230k miles. She is a clean beauty with no accidents, one previous owner, and 30+ regular visits to the Toyota dealer over her life. No AHC.

I've had this truck for a couple of weeks now, and I'm about to take it in to my mechanic for some work. He will hopefully fix the AC, which is the only thing broken. Otherwise, I pretty much just want to baseline everything.

The one thing I would really like to improve is the suspension. It's not exactly bad, but it does feel kind of harsh to me when going over bumps, expansion joints, holes, etc. I have never driven a brand-new or perfect 100-series cruiser, but it seems to me that the a factory-fresh vehicle must have been cushier, softer than what I am experiencing. It also seems like maybe the car sits unevenly across all four wheels. All four shocks were replaced 50k miles ago.

I would like to do whatever I can for a reasonable investment to really improve comfort, smoothness, isolation from imperfect roads, and (perhaps) handling. In retrospect, it seems like I would have really appreciated AHC, but too late for that now!

My mechanic is not a cruiser guy, but he is very skilled and experienced. He regularly works on Ferraris, Rolls, Porsche, etc, and will do whatever I ask him to do. He even has a former Toyota tech working at his shop.

How can I get my truck to be as close to new, or better than new, luxury-feeling suspension? What should I ask my mechanic to do? I spoke with him briefly on the phone today, and he said he's happy to replace the shocks, but if the ones on there are fine, I might not notice any difference.

Is there a complete evaluation and check-up procedure from the FSM I can have them use to go over everything? Is that a waste of time?

Most of my driving is on-road. I do not want to lift the vehicle and generally prefer a stock setup.

What do all of you think?

Thank you in advance!!

Brian

 

[OEMGUY0720]

I’d start with the suspension bushings, suspension links, upper and lower ball joints and steering rack bushings to improve handling. Next would be the struts. Oem struts are still the better option of restoring back that comfortable ride feel of your cruiser since just leaving it stock height is your preference.

 

[lcnj]

Thank you! Do you think I should replace all of those items no matter what, or check them to consider replacing? Do you think that there will definitely be a noticeable improvement? It sounds like you are confirming my gut feeling that a new or restored cruiser should be cushier than what I am experiencing!

 

[kevin2i]

Any slop in suspension will cause harshness. I would replace all the sway bar bushings/links (cheap and easy DIY) and test tie rods/ball joints. Steering rack bushings are a pain, but you can see if your rack moves. You can check this yourself, easier with 2 people, or ask your mechanic to inspect. Don’t have to replace everything. At that mileage, my (inner) tie rods and steering rack bushings (and sway bar bushings) had significant movement, once replaced drove much better for another 90k. Recently replaced ball joints and steering rack. Steering rack made huge difference.

 

[lcnj]

Thank you, this is great info! I am eager to make some modest investments to make this truck as great as possible for the next 100k. I am very technical but have never done work under the hood of a car, have no tools or even basic knowledge, so I will let the mechanics handle this.

I do interior work, however, and have already installed the VAIS system. The install came out perfect and it works fantastically. I also bought the parts to convert my LC to accommodate cabin air filters, and will install that myself. Planning to replace the speakers and some interior trim items, as well. The inside looks and feels really, really great, almost appears new.

But driving it, while pretty good, does not feel new, and I really want to restore that as much as possible. Should this thing feel smooth and cushy even without the AHC?

I have read some threads on here from people who have replaced a lot of stuff and think the ride is still harsh -- I would be pretty bummed to spend the money and feel no difference.

 

[GTV]

I know you said you prefer stock but a tall tire, with bigger sidewalls will make a big difference in ride quality. 275/70's in standard load range will make a huge difference in comfort.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Brian, if new feeling is the goal, start attacking the rubber. Replace the bushings - all of em. There are many. The top ones to check, IMO:

• Rear control arms and panhard bar
• Front Diff
• Front control arms and ball joints (you can replace bushings alone, but if the ball joints and a bushing or two are toast, I'd just replace the arm)
• Engine mounts (also called "isolators")
• Trans mount

There are also body mounts. I'm unsure how those contribute to harshness.

I second @GTV on tire sidewall. a C load 33" would help give you a soft feel.

You won't get to AHC-level cushiness, but you can get it feeling soft and confident just by replacing all the compliant joints (bushings). Some will be toast, but not visibly torn in situ.

 

[lcnj]

This is awesome, thank you!!

The larger sidewall tires sound like a great idea, but I will probably wait until replacing the current ones because they only have 25k miles on them now and look ok.

Any ideas on the cost of replacing all the bushings and rubber components? If it's reasonable, then I will just do all of them as suggested because I can see how that would make a big difference after 15 years on the originals.

I will also ask the mechanic to inspect / test all of the metal parts, joints, links, etc while disassembling and advise on anything that should be addressed. For those, we will just replace whatever seems to need it, as I imagine those parts could get very pricey?

Is it possible that the OEM shocks are fine after 50k miles? Should I definitely replace those too, or leave them if the mechanic says they are not leaking and look fine?

What about review and adjustments to the suspension and steering systems? Should I have the mechanic go over all height adjustments?

 

[ramangain]

This is awesome, thank you!!

The larger sidewall tires sound like a great idea, but I will probably wait until replacing the current ones because they only have 25k miles on them now and look ok.

Any ideas on the cost of replacing all the bushings and rubber components? If it's reasonable, then I will just do all of them as suggested because I can see how that would make a big difference after 15 years on the originals.

I will also ask the mechanic to inspect / test all of the metal parts, joints, links, etc while disassembling and advise on anything that should be addressed. For those, we will just replace whatever seems to need it, as I imagine those parts could get very pricey?

Is it possible that the OEM shocks are fine after 50k miles? Should I definitely replace those too, or leave them if the mechanic says they are not leaking and look fine?

What about review and adjustments to the suspension and steering systems? Should I have the mechanic go over all height adjustments?

I'd suggest before making a super long list of stuff to replace, find a local rig that has known good suspension and take a ride. No good trying to put lipstick on a pig.

 

[lcnj]

I'd suggest before making a super long list of stuff to replace, find a local rig that has known good suspension and take a ride. No good trying to put lipstick on a pig.

Are you saying you are skeptical that replacing all the bushings and rubber parts will make an improvement?

How would I find a local rig to drive, and what will that do to help me?

 

[ramangain]

Well, have you ridden in a known-good-suspension Hundy w/o AHC, or not?

Hundys w/o AHC will never ride as cushy as a Cadillac or Buick, or even a modern day typical sedan.

It's all about proper expectations when it comes to ride quality.

There is a pulldown menu up top labeled Clubhouse. Check it out.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Well, have you ridden in a known-good-suspension Hundy w/o AHC, or not?

Hundys w/o AHC will never ride as cushy as a Cadillac or Buick, or even a modern day typical sedan.

It's all about proper expectations when it comes to ride quality.

There is a pulldown menu up top labeled Clubhouse. Check it out.

Agreed here. If you're at a "3" and you expect to get to a "10", but the 100 suspension is at best only a "6" in perfect shape, you might not want to spend thousands chasing that score of 10.

Bushing replacement is not necessarily cheap - especially if you're paying someone labor.

 

[Pucker5]

Well, have you ridden in a known-good-suspension Hundy w/o AHC, or not?

Hundys w/o AHC will never ride as cushy as a Cadillac or Buick, or even a modern day typical sedan.

It's all about proper expectations when it comes to ride quality.

There is a pulldown menu up top labeled Clubhouse. Check it out.

Yeah I am a bit confused as to your benchmark. A lx or
Ahc lc should not be tHat benchmark. I needed pretty much all the things on my cruiser , ball joints, sway bay bushings, all front control arm bushings, new rear shocks and honestly For road driving I felt like Tires, shocks, sway bushings, ans rear coils made the biggest impact to the “ride”. I mean none of the replaced stuff was shaking lose when I drove but that doesn’t seem to be the case with your ride. I was also looking for a bit firmer ride and not a Cadillac float so it’s all about goals I guess. New shocks and new larger tires did a lot for the ride while new sway bushings, sway bar link bushings, and new rear coils significantly improved body roll. I say all this becuase I did the upgrades in those phases

 

[OEMGUY0720]

Thank you! Do you think I should replace all of those items no matter what, or check them to consider replacing? Do you think that there will definitely be a noticeable improvement? It sounds like you are confirming my gut feeling that a new or restored cruiser should be cushier than what I am experiencing!

Practicality wise, I’d say just go for all of the things I mentioned, get them all done and over with if budget permits, plus it won’t be cheaper if you go back and forth to your mechanic to get one component serviced at a time. At that mileage I have a feeling that most if not all of these items are still original and has seen better days. And I think that’s the main point of baseline maintenance, which is to ensure all wear and tear parts are replaced and ready for another 230k miles.

 

[ramangain]

Yeah I am a bit confused as to your benchmark. A lx or
Ahc lc should not be tHat benchmark. I needed pretty much all the things on my cruiser , ball joints, sway bay bushings, all front control arm bushings, new rear shocks and honestly For road driving I felt like Tires, shocks, sway bushings, ans rear coils made the biggest impact to the “ride”. I mean none of the replaced stuff was shaking lose when I drove but that doesn’t seem to be the case with your ride. I was also looking for a bit firmer ride and not a Cadillac float so it’s all about goals I guess. New shocks and new larger tires did a lot for the ride while new sway bushings, sway bar link bushings, and new rear coils significantly improved body roll. I say all this becuase I did the upgrades in those phases

I think my benchmark is accurate to get a known baseline of ride quality akin to OEM from the factory. Improvements can be sought from there. Without a known baseline though, is the desired target even attainable?

 

[lcnj]

I see what you are saying, but I'm not sure how realistic it is for me to find a stock 100 cruiser with totally restored suspension to go experience.

Based on the feedback in this thread, I gather that replacing all of the rubber items at once, and anything else that is really bad on inspection, will make a definitely noticeable, perhaps dramatic difference. Is that a reasonable expectation?

Also, if my goal is to drive this thing for another 100k+, that might be a good idea anyway?

Do you think it will really cost thousands of dollars if done at once?

I do not want to waste money, but would love to make a successful investment in comfort, performance, and longevity of this vehicle!

 

[suprarx7nut]

Do you think it will really cost thousands of dollars if done at once?

Yes. Each bushing costs $20-100 and there are dozens of the commonly worn ones. Labor for each one is probably an average of $100 per. The R&R on the front control arms is significant. Don't forget an alignment when it's all done.

I would start with an inspection of the bushings. See if you can spot any obviously worn rubber.

 

[Pucker5]

I think my benchmark is accurate to get a known baseline of ride quality akin to OEM from the factory. Improvements can be sought from there. Without a known baseline though, is the desired target even attainable?

I was citing op. Just meant that a factory lc vs factory lx isn’t really apples to apples. leveraging traditional spring and shock he won’t likely get to the ahc level.

 

[Patron100LC]

I also got an 05 LC that I bought about 2-3 yrs ago, first thing that bothered me was the rough ride over small bumps, large bump felt fine, but I can feel every little crack on the asphalt at low speeds.
Spent the first few months of ownership replacing bushings and shocks. All oem.
still feeling the shutter every time..
got to the point where the only thing between the road and the truck that I didn’t replaced or checked is the tires.
Riding on stock size 18” Bridgestone alenzas, probably over 40k miles on them since I put about 10k and they still look the same as the day I’ve got it 2.5 yrs ago. By power of deduction that will be my next move, new tires. I didn’t replace them because it’s a shame getting rid of an expensive tire that’s holding up so well and it’s a very quiet tire, on highway it’s supremely smooth, but I’m guessing they’re just old and stiff.
I think the stock size is just a bit wrong for this truck, I’m contemplating going for a narrower tire with a bit taller side wall, even if at the end it’s the same diameter. That, together with a new rubber might smooth things out. My personal opinion, change the tires first before anything else..
It’s nice knowing that your suspension components are new, but if the reason for their replacement still persist, then it’s frustrating and expensive.
Considering Michelin defenders ltx, and maybe getting 255/70 or 255/75 on the 18s.. whatever is more available and closer to the stock diameter.
If you do change tires please let us know if you felt the difference, since at this rate it will take me years to wear the Bridgestone down..

 

[lcnj]

Wow, that is extremely useful to hear, Patron!! Thank you. Can I ask what it has cost you in parts and labor to replace all of that?

If replacing those items were less than, say, $1k, I might just take the gamble. But given the high cost, I am very reluctant, especially given your feedback and the skepticism expressed by others. I was driving yesterday afternoon and thinking that the truck actually drives very well. It's just not as plush as I would like on bumps, and it seems to roll a lot around the turns. Maybe I should have bought a truck with AHC. But I'm ok with this one... it's not bad, and it seems there are still adjustments I can make.

In particular, it does sound like bigger-sidewall tires are definitely worth trying first! Do I need to make any adjustments to the vehicle when switching to a larger diameter?

Does anyone have any thoughts on what I should ask my mechanic to look over on the vehicle for baselining and finding any major issues underneath? Should I consider replacing the shocks now that they are 50k miles old? Are there steering or suspension components I should replace no matter what, even if I'm not going to do everything?