What is a good "off leash" dog

[wob]

this just strikes me as disturbing. you have millions in 3rd world countries starving, and we're feeding our dogs diet dog food due to them overeating???

So, you think we should sent excess dog food to starving folks?

 

[bad_religion_au]

So, you think we should sent excess dog food to starving folks?

that's a great idea

 

[wob]

that's a great idea

lol

 

[my64fj40]

this just strikes me as disturbing. you have millions in 3rd world countries starving, and we're feeding our dogs diet dog food due to them overeating???

Lean dog food disturbs you??

 

[dingdong]

I have 2 weimeraners.
They are well behaved off leash but I would never even dream of having them in an unfenced yard.
My cousing has an Akita. He is off leash on the acreage. He never stepped foot off that acreage for 5 years. And it seamed he didn't want to. Then the neighbors got some cattle, and the cattle started gong missing...
Your asking for trouble with a dog in an unfenced yard.
Here is a pic I have lying around on the computer. These dogs will not let anything happen to my kids.

 

[-Spike-]

So, you think we should sent excess dog food to starving folks?

Actually, we could just send the excess dogs...

-Spike

 

[The Griswolds]

Dont take this the wrong way Gris, but if you have to use a device to train a dog, then your doing something wrong. There are dogs that have A.D.D type personality, it may take triple the hours to get them to look at you as "the lead pack dog" but any dog will listen and respect you if the proper steps are taken, wich can be many long and tedious hours of showing them that your boss, and at the same time, gaining your trust and respect....just my 2 cents

Okay, now that I got some shut eye, I can respond and make things a little more coherent.

First off, I think we should define a training device. I would assume that we are talking collars here as your voice, a clicker, a whistle even your guiding hand could also be described as a training device. For the sake of arguement, I will use the term training device to mean a collar of some sort.

I think our differences in training philosophies/ methods comes from the fact that we are dealing with two different breeds of dogs with entirely different temperaments.

As an example, we had a border collie/lab cross and she could have been described as a soft, submissive dog. Most likey, she was similar in temperament to your Labs(s). She knew who her pack leader was and she was very compliant to commands given to her. In this case, she could be trained to do a task without the use of a collar. Positive reinforcement methods worked well.

I believe that, generally speaking, Labs, by nature and breeding, fall into this "submissive" category. This is by no means a slight to the breed because that is why Labs make such great family pets. They have those playful personalities and are so willing to please.

BTW, I almost picked up a PB chocolate Lab but passed and am kicking my self for it!!

Now, with our GSD Riddick, it is a whole 'nother kettle of fish.

Riddick is a hard, dominant working line shepherd. He knows who the top dog is and that's me. But because he is a dominant dog, every once in a while, he will challenge my authority by not obeying a command or being slow to react etc. It has nothing to do with him knowing the command and what is required. He knows the command and what he is supposed to do but he chooses not to comply thereby testing my authority.

This can be termed "pack drive" and all dogs have it. It just means they strive to find their place in the pack (family) where they are comfortable. Some dogs like to lead and some like to follow.

Anyway, if he chooses to "test my authority" sometimes an authoritative "No" works but sometimes it doesn't. At that point, he is given a physical correction by way of prong collar, e-collar etc. Then, when he complies, he is immediately praised for doing so.

In any event, I would challenge anyone to train a truly dominant dog, not just shepherds, by using purely positive methods of training. I say it can't be done and this is why you see so many (not all) so-called "problem dogs" ending up in a shelter.

The POs have tried using strictly positive methods of training and/or give their dogs incorrect levels of corrections etc. and when their dog gives them the ole they just let it go. Well, letting a dog disobey a command is the first step to losing your dominance as a leader and that's when the real problems start such as getting bit etc.

I guess what I am trying to say is that strictly motivational training may work for soft, submissive dogs but it will not work with dominant dogs so it all depends on the breed and the individual dog's temperament. Yes, there are shepherds that are considered soft and will comply with motivational techniques but, again, there are others that will just give you the

.....it may take triple the hours to get them to look at you as "the lead pack dog" but any dog will listen and respect you if the proper steps are taken, wich can be many long and tedious hours of showing them that your boss

I agree. Although with some dogs, especially ones with rank issues, these proper steps you mentioned have to be practised on a daily basis for the life of the dog.

Edit: sp

 

[The Griswolds]

Whether your dog obeys you off leash is not a reflection of the dog's breed in any way, shape, or form. This is entirely a "human" issue. Rephrase the question -- "What can I do as an owner to train a dog to be obedient off leash?"

It takes time, effort, and consistency. You will get out of it exactly what you put into it.

Ed

I agree whole heartedly. There's no such thing as a bad dog, only bad owners!!

 

[lunyou]

There's no dog that is "naturally" good at being off leash.

I will argue with this statement. I have a Min Pin/Chihuahua mix and she hates the leash, like most dogs. I never put her on one and when i go out for a short walk she stays right with me and if she starts straying its usually because she has to do her business.

lunyou

 

[tcb]

Min Pin/Chihuahua mix

That's pretty liberal use of the word "dog".....

 

[srplus]

the question was...

I have to comment on your situation 74fj40... I take it that Colorado has deer where you live - I would think twice about getting a dog that you think can just be outside on your property without supervision.

You can have a perfectly trained dog and even one who 'all the time' even lives within the confines of an invisible fence. However, dogs as pack animals and hunters are subject to all kinds of temptations that make it best for them not to be left to their own devices.

I knew of one dog that had an invisible fence installed around his property. He knew that if he approached the invisible fence that his collar would issue warning beeps and that if it continued to beep he would get a shock through his collar. It was not long before he figured out how long he could stay within the vicinity of the underground wire before he got zapped. Somehow he also learned that he could run the battery down by hanging around the perimeter and backing off before he got nailed. The thing would then stop beeping when he approached the wire and if there was no beeping there would be no shock. He would then leave the property after he had run the battery down. This was not a case of his owner not charging the collar, but a dog who was very smart.

Do you really want any dog that is out of your voice command? I would say that if you are not going to leave the dog to its own devices then any trained dog will be wonderful off leash. If you expect a dog to follow society’s arbitrary rules and others that you have laid down that might go against its nature, then that is another story.

 

[Epic Ed]

I will argue with this statement. I have a Min Pin/Chihuahua mix and she hates the leash, like most dogs. I never put her on one and when i go out for a short walk she stays right with me and if she starts straying its usually because she has to do her business.

lunyou

That's because this is the behavior she has learned is acceptible. Fight and pull and eventually my owner will give in. It's great if you have been able to trainer her to heel off leash, but if she's simply doing this of her own volition, she will also break away from you of her own choice if the circumstance warrants in her mind -- chasing a squirrel, a cat, or a rabbit for example. Just because they are doing what you want doesn't mean they are well trained. For most pet owners, this kind of relationship with their pet works just fine and is perfectly acceptible -- I'm not trying to bash you -- but, for dog owners who truely want to have control off their dogs behavior it requires a lot of time, effort, and consistency.

BTW, I don't necessairly believe all dogs are good dogs -- I've met some real f uck ers through the years. Some just needed a lot of TLC and firm obedience training. Others needed a bullet. The vast majority of bad behaviors issues can be over come with a strong relationship between dog & owner and some proper training. That's not to say it always the owners fault for bad pooch conduct, but most of the time this is true.

Ed

 

[rabid]

My golden was rescued from a backyard breeders barn stall -after being there for 9 months, never being let outside. Since the day we got him home, he has never wanted to be more than 15 feet from us. Ever. We leash him if he is going into public, but really don't have to.

We also have a saint bernard, who is very bull headed. Got her at 10 weeks, did puppy training and class with her. Lots of time and effort later, she is OK at best off leash. She does well while hiking on trail, but is very curious by nature, and wants to inspect and say hello to everything and everyone. After some little girls shrieked and cried while their parents swept them up screaming at me (imagine a happy 130 pound drooling mess running at your kids) we do not let her off leash anymore unless we are on private land.

 

[rabid]

the golden

 

[The Griswolds]

Do you really want any dog that is out of your voice command? I would say that if you are not going to leave the dog to its own devices then any trained dog will be wonderful off leash.

This is where e-collars have been a great addition to dog training. Most can reach at least a mile and are great for training a recall when the dog is out of voice range and/or near something that makes voice commands impractical i.e. waterfalls etc.

 

[The Griswolds]

BTW, I don't necessairly believe all dogs are good dogs -- I've met some real f uck ers through the years. Some just needed a lot of TLC and firm obedience training. Others needed a bullet. The vast majority of bad behaviors issues can be over come with a strong relationship between dog & owner and some proper training. That's not to say it always the owners fault for bad pooch conduct, but most of the time this is true.

Ed

You have a point there Ed, there are the odd ones that are so far gone, whether it be from years of abuse, bad wiring etc., that any rehab is impossible and the only option is to euthanize.

 

[rusty_tlc]

When I read the title I thought this was going to be about dogs that are trained for off leash. Any dog can be trained to stay around the house/yard. It could be tougher with some breeds than others. I wouldn't leave any dog in an un-fenced urban yard without supervision, that just isn't responsible.

Jake won't go off the front yard, most of the time. He is still pretty young and will bolt to play with the neighbors Labs if I don't tell him to stay before he starts running. I can usually anticipate this in time.

He is also trained for off leash, vocal and hand signals only. Hand signals are great, he can be out of earshot for a voice command and still runs back as soon as he sees the re-call signal. It's nice to have a dog you can take to the lake and let run as far as he wants. I always know I can give a sharp whistle to get his attention then give the re-call and he will be right back.

 

[dingdong]

BTW, I don't necessairly believe all dogs are good dogs -- I've met some real f uck ers through the years. Some just needed a lot of TLC and firm obedience training. Others needed a bullet. The vast majority of bad behaviors issues can be over come with a strong relationship between dog & owner and some proper training. That's not to say it always the owners fault for bad pooch conduct, but most of the time this is true.


You have a point there Ed, there are the odd ones that are so far gone, whether it be from years of abuse, bad wiring etc., that any rehab is impossible and the only option is to euthanize.

Same goes for humans.

 

[Hot_Eighty_Chick]

Such adorable pics of everyone's buddies! I love these threads!!!

 

[freightdog]

im getting another dog, and as much as i would LOVE a Siberian Husky, i have heard that they are not good dogs to allow off leash. which is something that i cant do especially with not having a complete fence in the back yard. what do you think?

Hoss - is 1/2 Chow 1/2 Lab and I really think the lab portion of him shines thru...so i say Lab - but so much is reflected in the owner and his/her personality...my dog is really lazy...