Warn M8000 + heavy 100 = ?

[Captramrod01]

So normally when one is looking for a winch everybody states the 1.5x rule off the weight of your rig. I get that, I followed it on my last rig (engo 9k on a 3rd gen 4runner) and never had a problem in the couple times I actually had to use it.

The m8000 almost seems to be held to a different standard though. I'm seeing several guys using these on their built 80's and 100's and from what I can tell nobody has had any issues. Lots of these rigs are easily creeping up on 4 tons when loaded. I really want to go this route since I rarely use a winch. I love that it's USA made, around $500 and most of all: LIGHT!

So I guess my question is, has anyone had an m8000 break on them when using it on a rig that weighs 6.5-7.5k pounds? Is this just a bad idea because it breaks the 1.5x rule?

 

[subzali]

I think it depends on the scenario. Winching over rocks you might be ok with 8k lbs, but buried to the axles in mud or snow you'd better have something bigger. JMHO

 

[ferg]

Did you present your question to the WARN guy?

 

[tplane2]

Two words: Snatch Block

I run an M8000 and its worked well over the years.

Doubt you will run into any issues unless you're frame deep in the sticky mud.

 

[Captramrod01]

Did you present your question to the WARN guy?

I didn't but I doubt he's going to say anything other than it doesn't adhere to the 1.5x rule.

Two words: Snatch Block

I run an M8000 and its worked well over the years.

Doubt you will run into any issues unless you're frame deep in the sticky mud.

Would definitely run a snatch block whenever possible. We usually don't have to deal with mud out here. Just sand and rocks.

Thanks for the input fellas.

 

[half k cruiser]

Just be smart about your pull angles and use as much mechanical advantage as possible. For $500 i'm assuming your getting the one with the synthetic line already installed ? Another thought is pay $399 for the steel cable model and immediately upgrade to a short synthetic cable and extension. Then you could definitely work the mechanical advantages.

 

[BadReligion]

I tried pulling my 100 out of a snow bank with a M8000 on my 80 and while it did work, it took forever and the winch really struggled. My 80 now has a 12000 up front. For a 100, minimum should be a 9500.

 

[Captramrod01]

Just be smart about your pull angles and use as much mechanical advantage as possible. For $500 i'm assuming your getting the one with the synthetic line already installed ? Another thought is pay $399 for the steel cable model and immediately upgrade to a short synthetic cable and extension. Then you could definitely work the mechanical advantages.

I'm guessing that was the vr8000 for 399. If it was the m8000 a link would be great. Yes, I will be rewinding with synthetic as the cheapest m8000s seems to be around $800.

I tried pulling my 100 out of a snow bank with a M8000 on my 80 and while it did work, it took forever and the winch really struggled. My 80 now has a 12000 up front. For a 100, minimum should be a 9500.

Good to know. First post I've seen on one struggling with the heavier rigs. I take it this was without a snatch block?

 

[tplane2]

Also have to remember that the 8000 lb rating is based of the last "wind" of line on the drum. Significantly less on the first half of line.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

I've seen lots of M8000s on heavy rigs, and they are fine as long as you respect what they can do. Use a snatch block basically every time you winch. This lowers the electrical load and does not cut the speed as much as you might think.

Read this:
Winch efficiency: line speed, amperage, and heat factor - Expedition Portal

Very interesting discussion of what winches can do, and how much current they draw. It takes some careful reading, but, almost any winch in normal use will benefit from using a snatch block. And using a snatch block, does not cut the speed in half. like you might expect, but it does cut the electrical lad in half (roughly).

 

[half k cruiser]

Very interesting discussion of what winches can do, and how much current they draw. It takes some careful reading, but, almost any winch in normal use will benefit from using a snatch block. And using a snatch block, does not cut the speed in half. like you might expect, but it does cut the electrical lad in half (roughly).

I'm not sure how it wouldn't cut the speed in half. The mechanical principals are the same as what they would be with a rope system. If you are running a 2:1 mechanical advantage then your speed will be halved. I always found it easiest to imagine that for every foot I pull of the rope, the pulley only comes 6 inches closer to me.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Yep, but the motor is running half the load, so it isn't a linear response. Read through the calculations. I thought this was one of the few interesting discussions on EP ever. Otherwise it's all about buying overpriced car camping gear.

 

[half k cruiser]

Yep, but the motor is running half the load, so it isn't a linear response. Read through the calculations. I thought this was one of the few interesting discussions on EP ever. Otherwise it's all about buying overpriced car camping gear.

I'm not good with numbers. But I think I get what your saying. Line speed is dependent on load and since your sharing 1/2 the load with your anchor point your line speed will not remain constant like in the scenario I mentioned. That's a pretty interesting concept, I will have to read through the link you posted when I get some more time. Thank you

 

[Warn Industries]

While we generally do want people to adhere to the 1.5 x GVWR = minimum pulling capacity, what works is what counts, right?

Anyhow, I would personally recommend carrying a snatch block and a winch line extension. As someone else already mentioned, if you can get the winch line to that last layer, that's where your maximum pulling capacity will be.

Andy

 

[Captramrod01]

Thanks for the response Andy.

I have decided on the m8000 as it seems to be adequate for my needs. I will have two snatch blocks and an additional 75ft of synthetic winch line.

 

[4Beast]

wouldn't a VR10 be a better choice, and with synthetic it's still relatively light and retails for about $850? That's the one I'm leaning toward, which is why I bring it up. As near as I can calculate, I'm probably pretty close to the 6800# GVWR of my rig. I'd feel much better with a 10k winch...

 

[Captramrod01]

That's the predicament. Go 8k premium American made or go 10k Chinese.

 

[4Beast]

That's the predicament. Go 8k premium American made or go 10k Chinese.

Well ,as far as I can tell, the 8k is assembled in the US but with Chinese parts anyway, so not necessarily substantially more premium. Probably not an issue for me, as I'm likely not going to put an 8k# winch on a 7k# cruiser.

 

[Captramrod01]

I've read that as well. On another forum a Warn rep clarified that it contains mostly US made parts but does source others from "around the world". What gets sourced from where? I don't know.

 

[4Beast]

I'm leaning toward an Engo 12k right now. Another American company making winches in China (Same as the Warn VR series). Lifetime warranty mechanical and IP67 waterproof for $500 including a cover and block.