Type T-IV ATF

[bulldog-yota]

I have used Amsoil Syn ATF for almost 30K miles in my 03 5spd box, which included some pretty good wheeling, hard racing on the dunes, long and hard mountain roads with a fully loaded truck. No ill effect adn actually shifted better than the ATF Type-IV.

Teh big ballbreaker is the 03+ trannies which takes Toyota WS fluid (which is full synthetic), no replacement available for that AFAIK. Just get the Toyota fluid. It willprobably be a good idea to swap it at 60K if you work the tranny hard anyway, maybe I'm old school but there is no such thing as a life time fluid (unless you want to reduce the lifetime of the component ).

Your owners manual should state what to use.

 

[NMuzj100]

The Specs for T-IV and Dexron are entirely different, one oil does not meet both. DO NOT USE ANY OIL WHERE T-IV IS CALLED FOR EXCEPT FOR T-IV. The price the dealer charges for the T-IV is reasonable.

Are you sure ? The T-IV is no longer an unknown and the major blenders are recommending their "Multi-vehicle" fluids for T-IV applications. These fluids all exceed the Dexron III standard and most meet the Mercon V standard with it's tougher base oil requirements.

Valvoline

Valvoline Maxlife
- Suitable for T-IV
- "Exceeds Dex III-H"​

Pennzoil

PENNZOIL MULTI-VEHICLE ATF is Suitable for use in applications requiring:
• DEXRON®, DEXRON®-II, DEXRON®-III
• MERCON®, MERCON® V
• Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/Plymouth except NAG1 that requires Shell 3403 ATF
• Toyota T, T-III, T-IV​

Castrol

CASTROL IMPORT MULTIVEHICLE AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID IS FOR USE IN MOST HONDA, TOYOTA, NISSAN AND OTHER IMPORTED VEHICLES.
* Premium Synthetic Blend formula
* Recommended for use in vehicles that require:
o Honda, Acura — ATF–Z1 (except in CVTs)
o Toyota, Lexus — Type T, T–III, T–IV
o Nissan, Infiniti — Matic–D, Matic–J
o BMW — LA2634, LT71141
o Mitsubishi — Diamond SP–II, SP–III
* Also meets requirements of
o Ford MERCON®, MERCON® V
o General Motors DEXRON®–III H ​

Chevron

Chevron Multi-Vehicle ATF
Can be used in
- Dexron III
- Mercon V
- Toyota JWS 3309/T-IV
- Mercon SP
- Toyota WS (I'm surprised at this one.)
​

The Mercon SP and WS recommendations for the Chevron fluid both surprised me, probably a sign of a very good fluid.
https://www.cbest.chevron.com/generated/MSDS/PDS27291637.PDF

Several companies (ConocoPhillips, Quaker State, Havoline) don't list T-IV directly but say for use in all Toyotas except WS models.

The only major without a Multi-Vehicle fluid recommended for T-IV is Mobil. They make 3309 for these applications and probably for Toyota.

The after market blenders are becoming increasingly sophisticated and it is hard for the OEMs to keep their hold on the service fill market with inferior products or ones with only minor differences from well known standards. This is why GM moved away from a performance based standard to a formula based standard for Dexron-VI.

 

[9toys]

I replaced the atf in my 99 with valvoline dexron 111/mercon about 10K ago. shifts perfectly. i just did a drain and fill. I had the dealer do it about 60K ago and they used dexron 111 also.

 

[cary]

Are you sure ? The T-IV is no longer an unknown and the major blenders are recommending their "Multi-vehicle" fluids for T-IV applications. These fluids all exceed the Dexron III standard and most meet the Mercon V standard with it's tougher base oil requirements.

That's new from the last time I checked. If the majors are listing their oils as compatible, go for it, just make sure the bottle you buy says so, so if you have an oil related problem down the road you can go back to them.

 

[e9999]

the problem is that if oil manufacturer XXX says their stuff is compatible with Toy XYZ, that really doesn't mean too much. I mean how are you going to prove that the trans failed because you used XXX? I suspect their marketing guys drive the lists as much as the tech ones.

OTOH, sadly, if truck manuf YYY says to use only theirs it will indeed likely be optimal but will likely also be overpriced.

What's a DIYer to do...?

When I read about replacing the ATF in our 03, I did quite a bit of reading about the different types, and ended up telling my wife to get some ATF at the Toy dealer (it about killed me... ).

 

[cary]

the problem is that if oil manufacturer XXX says their stuff is compatible with Toy XYZ, that really doesn't mean too much. I mean how are you going to prove that the trans failed because you used XXX? I suspect their marketing guys drive the lists as much as the tech ones.

OTOH, sadly, if truck manuf YYY says to use only theirs it will indeed likely be optimal but will likely also be overpriced.

What's a DIYer to do...?

When I read about replacing the ATF in our 03, I did quite a bit of reading about the different types, and ended up telling my wife to get some ATF at the Toy dealer (it about killed me... ).

The only reason I am somewhat okay with it is because generally the major manufactures will not say it meets the standard if it doesn't. I have to wonder if Toyota is charging for the certification for T-IV. If it were me, I would run the Mobil 3309, which clearly states is the meets the specifications. Interestingly, the 3309 appears to be formulated with special friction modifiers as they refer to the transmission as a slip controlled design.

Product Description

Mobil ATF 3309 is an exceptionally high performance lubricant that meets original equipment manufacturers’ specifications for use in certain slip-controlled lock-up automatic transmissions. Mobil ATF 3309 is recommended for use in transmissions made by Aisin-Warner requiring a fluid approved against Type T-IV, JWS 3309, GM 9986195 and VW/Audi G-055-025-A2. These Aisin-Warner transmissions are used in CERTAIN domestic and foreign vehicles, including Toyota, Lexus, Audi, Saturn, Ford, Volvo, Volkswagen, Saab, Porsche and Mitsubishi.


Features and Benefits

The unique formulation of Mobil ATF 3309 is designed to provide excellent lubrication of transmissions in specified Aisin-Warner slip-controlled lock-up automatic transmissions. These outstanding performance capabilities translate into significant operational benefits, including:


* Excellent lubricating characteristics for quiet operation and smooth shifting in approved transmissions
* Controlled friction properties for smooth and efficient transmission of power across all normal temperature ranges
* Helps to control transmission shudder and provide excellent vehicle driveability
* Helps to extend transmission life based on excellent wear control
* Long fluid life based on excellent oxidation resistance
* Excellent viscosity stability (high viscosity index) to help assure adequate lubrication without excessive thinning in severe high-temperature service or thickening at low starting temperatures
* Resistance to foaming
* Superb protection against rusting and corrosion
* Compatibility with synthetic rubber seal materials


Applications

Mobil ATF 3309 is recommended for use in transmissions made by Aisin-Warner requiring fluids approved against JWS 3309 or GM 9986195. It is also recommended for service fill applications where Toyota T-IV, T4, T-III or T3 are called for. Please refer to the owners’ manual for proper fluid requirements.

 

[e9999]

all boils down to $$, I guess. If one could use a cheap but good major line ATF, that would give pause, but if the alternative to the Toy stuff is a fancy synthetic that's just about as expensive, then one can't go too much wrong with the Toy stuff and it's a no brainer. How much do the fancy synths cost?

 

[NMuzj100]

What fancy expensive synthetic is in the list of major producer's "Multi-vehicle fluids" that I posted ?

T-IV is a conventional fluid so there are lots of alternatives that are probably as good. Remember, the Aisin-Warner transmissions are not exclusive to Toyota so Toyota has no "special knowledge" with which to create their transmission fluid.

 

[pulse98]

http://www.redlineoil.com/pdf/3.pdf

Redline's "Synthetic D4" and "Synthetic High Temp ATF" are now Toyota Type-IV rated, see above.

 

[njpaguy]

Mobil 1 ATF

2001 TLC. Drained/replaced tranny fluid every 30,000 miles w/Mobil 1 ATF. Truck now has 165,000 mi and counting. No issues.

 

[cary]

2001 TLC. Drained/replaced tranny fluid every 30,000 miles w/Mobil 1 ATF. Truck now has 165,000 mi and counting. No issues.

I believe the 2001 still calls for Dexron II/III, so that would be the proper oil.

 

[cpcc]

Dealer wont even change the fluid in an 04, they say it is life long. So after you slip the Lead tech $50 he is able to find the drain and fill nuts. Go figure.

BMW used to have life long ATF fluid, the only problem is that you would have to change the transmission at 60-80k. Is toyota going down the same path!??

 

[viper501]

Dealer wont even change the fluid in an 04, they say it is life long. So after you slip the Lead tech $50 he is able to find the drain and fill nuts. Go figure.

BMW used to have life long ATF fluid, the only problem is that you would have to change the transmission at 60-80k. Is toyota going down the same path!??

yep. By having 'lifetime' fluids, the manufacturers have better ratings on cost of ownership statistics. You started seeing these lifetime fills from MB and BMW about the same time they were getting dinged by JD power for maintenance expenses and about the same time they started providing 'free' maintenance.

It also increases their profit margins by being able to charge the second owner in most cases for a 3 to 4 grand transmission.

 

[cary]

BMW used to have life long ATF fluid, the only problem is that you would have to change the transmission at 60-80k. Is toyota going down the same path!??

BMW has since stepped back from the lifetime interval to 100k. They should probably do 60k intervals, I know when I had the fluid done on my wife's X5 at 90k (we bought it at 89k), my mechanic said it looked used up, and said that the other x5s he did looked the same.

 

[NMuzj100]

100k is past the initial lease time frame and when most first owners will have traded up. For those who plan to keep them longer a shorter interval may be wise.

In the 100 the fluid cooling is good and there are few reports of bad looking fluid so I doubt there is any reason to panic. A few UOAs for the "Lifetime" fluid when it's changed out would be great info for the board.

 

[LandCruisers4Life]

Anyone heard of oil manufacturers making WS ATF yet???

I'd like to switch to Royal Purple or Redline if they put it out.

 

[100 TD]

Not sure if it is mentioned in this thread but (IIRC) at least one manufacturer said their oil meets WS standard, however, I personally would pay the premium and stick with Toyota WS

 

[LandCruisers4Life]

Royal Purple got back with me on this quickly, and stated that it wasn't feasable to research it because manufacturers keep changing things around too quickly. They recommended staying with the Toyota WS ATF.

 

[NMuzj100]

Redline is recommending their new D6 formulation for Toyota WS.

Recommended where the latest Dexron-VI is required, as well as where Ford Mercon SP, Toyota WS and Mercedes Benz NAG-2 fluids are specified​

Red Line Oil: Gear Lubricants

The WS is no longer new and Toyota is generally conservative with fluids so I imagine this is up to snuff. Is it cheaper than the dealer though ?

Also notice that the Chevron Multi-vehicle ATF in my post above (from 2 years ago!) was claiming Toyota WS and still is. This fluid meets a lot of tough standards (Mercon V, ect...) and is probably good stuff.
Chevron Multi-vehicle ATF - Product Datasheet

Castrol is still claiming T-IV but no WS as yet.
Castrol Import Multi-vehicle ATF - Product Data

They are all claiming to meet "JASO A1" as well which may be a "roll up" standard for the Japanese that will include T-IV.

Google provided this nice translation from a Japanese Castrol site -

"JASO 1A" is the property of AT domestic cars to pull up the Japan Automobile Engineering Society of Japan (JSAE: Society of Automotive Engineers of Japan) will set standards and butter domestic automobile. 尚、JASOはJapanese Automobile Standards Organizationの略です。 Also, the Japanese Automobile Standards Organization JASO stands.​

Penrite from Austrailia is a little clearer -

here are no API standards for automatic
transmission fluids. Indeed, it is only in recent
times that the Japanese have released a draft
general industry standard that stands alongside
their individual requirements. (JASO M315-1998,
now called JASO-1A).​

 

[LandCruisers4Life]

Thanks, I must have missed that on Redline. I go there occasionally to check on things to see if they change but I must have missed that about D6. I might point that out to the Royal Purple guys.... lol

I just want a heavy duty replacement when the time comes. I'm getting ready to change all fluids now, except the transmission. I want the dealership to do that as I want the torque converter evacuated of all old fluid as well.

I can just ask that they put the Redline in there (Take the fluid with me to the dealership).