Tire Questions - Width? Toyo MT v Dura Tracs?

[yotasavg]

Sorry for the double post - can't figure out how to edit? I must be mildly slow today...

Anyway, after reading the thread linked above, why is it that so many 80's rigs run the 255/85, but it is not generally a choice on our 100's? Is it a looks preference, like mentioned in this thread? Or is there something else we should be aware of?

 

[VidereStudios]

VS, if you don't mind what is Les Shwab in your area quoting you for 4 M55s mounted?

Got a price today from a Eugene Les Schwab...$1,387.04 for four tires mounted with new stems. Ouch...of course, the price is the only weakness of the M-55's...well, maybe mud bogging as well.

Anyway, after reading the thread linked above, why is it that so many 80's rigs run the 255/85, but it is not generally a choice on our 100's? Is it a looks preference, like mentioned in this thread? Or is there something else we should be aware of?

I think it may partially be a looks preference. I readily admit that a fatter tire looks much better. However, there are so many more advantages for the narrower tire.

It may also be that most people are trying to get to 34 or as close to 35 inch tires as they can get...and you really can't get there with the narrow tire widths. It seems that is the most common consensus on the tire threads that I have read...the bigger tires (in diameter) help a little bit in offsetting the lower amount of clearance and travel due to the IFS front.

 

[MrGreenJeans]

@ VidereStudios - is your rig stock height, or do you have a lift?

 

[yotasavg]

I think it may partially be a looks preference. I readily admit that a fatter tire looks much better. However, there are so many more advantages for the narrower tire.

Thanks for the reply. I really wanted to make sure that there are no issues with a large heavy rig on the tall skinnies. I personally like the look of the skinnies, and I don't have plans for a lift right now but I do need new tires. I'd love to go a little big larger in diameter to fill the wheel well without running into rubbing issues, which I think is more likely with extra width. Similarly, I'd lean towards a set of 275/70/r18's if I could find some nice 18" wheels first. I'm really trying to get tires that will be great for trips up to Tahoe this winter and I have a feeling taller skinny tires will fit my needs well. Any further advice is appreciated

 

[VidereStudios]

@ VidereStudios - is your rig stock height, or do you have a lift?

My rig is almost entirely stock. Plus I have the AHC in my LX470, so I am either stuck at moving the sensors / adjusting torsion bars to get a little bit higher, or pulling out the AHC and going with heavy duty springs and shocks. My understanding is that 255/85R16's don't have any issues with stock rigs because they are so narrow. My decision to purchase M-55's is because I don't gravitate towards mud and I love backcountry roads. I need something that wears like iron and won't start chunking once I get in some rocks. Plus the aired down performance is amazing.

Thanks for the reply. I really wanted to make sure that there are no issues with a large heavy rig on the tall skinnies. I personally like the look of the skinnies, and I don't have plans for a lift right now but I do need new tires. I'd love to go a little big larger in diameter to fill the wheel well without running into rubbing issues, which I think is more likely with extra width. Similarly, I'd lean towards a set of 275/70/r18's if I could find some nice 18" wheels first. I'm really trying to get tires that will be great for trips up to Tahoe this winter and I have a feeling taller skinny tires will fit my needs well. Any further advice is appreciated

The only issue I have heard of with the narrow M-55's is that it doesn't seem quite as planted in hard, faster corners on pavement. However, I drive on the slower side of the spectrum, so that isn't a detriment to me. The performance aired down and the overall strength and toughness of the M-55 is what really drew me to them. I will most likely be getting new tires in September or October, so I will look forward to testing them in the snow this winter. I haven't driven in lots of snow, but my understanding is that there are really only two ways to go about it. Dig in through the snow with a narrow tire and grab the road surface or use flotation to your advantage to stay on top if you can't reach.

 

[yotasavg]

Well obviously since the LC is new to me I don't quite know yet, but in my old 2nd gen 4Runner my narrow tires did great in snow where as my wider but same diameter tires did not. Both were bfg km2. I think the floatation really applies on a 38x14.50 or larger... Also thanks for confirming what I was trying to get at in my post

 

[BBQ BOY]

I'm reviving this thread. I am in the market SOON for some new tires for my 100 series. I was liking the GY DuraTracs, but I hear of a lot of side wall issues, and where I wheel, that could be a problem. i am really not excited about having to throw on loud and heavy tires, but I am thinking I may need MT's since I am in the Southeast and there's always the risk of me getting stuck on my hunting lease with AT's.
I am surprised to hear about those hating the Toyo MT's. i have heard nothing but great things about them. It's between those and Trail Grapplers in 275/70/18. then again, I really want AT's too!!!!

 

[yotasavg]

Well, since it's alive I'll say that I think I'm leaning toward Treadwrights now, in the 285/75/16 flavor... this is mostly due to cost, but I've shy'd away from the 255/85 idea due to potential lowered on-road handling.

 

[re_guderian]

Question on the Toyo M55's in 255/85/16... they only come with a speed rating of M, or 81 mph. Big deal? In my 80, I had 255/85 BFG's, but never did 80MPH. in the 100 80-85 MPH can be common on the rural interstates out west. Many places in UT where the posted limit is 80, and the hundred is just so at home going fast on the freeway as bombing down forest roads...

 

[VidereStudios]

Question on the Toyo M55's in 255/85/16... they only come with a speed rating of M, or 81 mph. Big deal? In my 80, I had 255/85 BFG's, but never did 80MPH. in the 100 80-85 MPH can be common on the rural interstates out west. Many places in UT where the posted limit is 80, and the hundred is just so at home going fast on the freeway as bombing down forest roads...

It may or may not, depending on your usage. If you find yourself doing the 80mph thing quite often, you may want to look at a higher speed rated tire. If it is just occasionally, I would think you would be fine.

I tend to default to the slower speeds. I just got back from a trip to BC and did the entire trip without driving on I-5 (from Eugene, OR). Drove all secondary highways and surface roads. Probably hit 65 a couple of times, but most of the time was in the 40's and 50's. A side benefit? Best gas mileage I have ever gotten out of the 100...consistently 19mph.

 

[mcgaskins]

I like tall and skinny tires on rigs like Tacomas, but I've found that wider tires are far more useful on 100s. Here's one obstacle I did that I didn't even realize how little tire I had on the rock until I saw the picture afterwards. I was probably over-inflated which is why it's not bulging more, but I have a feeling if I was on a skinnier tire I would have either slipped off this rock or had to take a different line.

 

[REDrum]

I know this thread is a little old, but since I have or currently run most of the tires discussed, I'll chime in.

Here is my first hand experience, FWIW...
While KM2 are poor in snow tires, Duratracs are only slight better. Oh sure lots of great press on DTs being great in the snow, but, for the most part, that is from people who don't (or have not) run snow tires. I thought DT would be a great all season option but after half way thru the winter I went out and bought a set of FS winterforce and used rims for my UZJ100. Life behind the wheel was then much safer. That said I am on my second of DTs, they are great 3 season AT tires. KM2s do not perform well in snow because of their durometer when cold, this is also the reason why they DO hold up well off road while aired down: (This goes for the Toyo M55 too.)

If someone is looking for one tire to seriously off road with (as in an MT class tires) and contend with a little snow, I would direct them to either a Firestone MT or Interco Truxus. However, unfortunately, the FS MT doesn't come in 255/85, the closest would be 285/75; sorry.

For occasional dirt roads, light wheeling, and slight shoulder season snow, I'd advise an (AT class) Duratrac or Nokian Rotiiva (or Vatiiva if you can still find'm) The Nokians will far out perform the DTs in snow, but the DTs will out perform while aired down. KM2s are fantastic on and off road, not too loud on tarmac but hold up well aired down to 18psi. I run 255/85/16 KM2s on trucks in US and Costa Rica. But, again, they are unsafe in snow. I'll be swapping to snowtires after Thanksgiving, and back in April.

Tall & skinnys' are much better geometry for snow conditions than a customary wide sand/mud bugger. The narrower footprint doesn't float and plunges down through slush and mud. Rally guys, like myself, run tall and skinny (175/70/15) sizes for snow events, on cars with stock width is 215 to 225

Also, anyone who claims you don't need snow tires or snow bias tires with AWD or TC is flat out wrong, drive has nothing to do with traction. If that were the case, MT tires, and snow tires, would not exist. Snow, and snow biased all seasons (like Nokian makes), tires formulate rubber that is highly pliable at very low temperatures. That characteristic (plus sipping) helps it to maintain grip in snow and on ice when most tire compounds get hard and start skating. This becomes evident when approaching a red light and the sound and feel of ABS kicks in, yet you are not stopping.... For me, in winter, braking threshold is paramount. With so few people running good winter tires, I need to know I can stop when I have to.

 

[mcgaskins]

I disagree completely on Duratracs being poor in the snow. I have been running them for almost exclusively winter duty to go up and down I70 to the ski resorts and they've performed flawlessly. All the CDOT trucks up on the top of Vail pass which gets battered all winter long with snow and ice run DTs as their fleet tire and most of the plow trucks (pickups) I've seen operating in the parking lots of ski resorts run DTs. The only car I've owned that compares to the 100 with DTs in the snow was my Audi TT with Blizzaks and I'd still take the 100.

 

[snobdds]

I also disagree on the snow part. They work great on the snow. I run them all winter long going over rabbit ears pass going to and from Steamboat. Only tire I will trust to pull out and pass when it's a blizzard out.

Do you not know how to drive on snow...?

 

[REDrum]

The only car I've owned that compares to the 100 with DTs in the snow was my Audi TT with Blizzaks and I'd still take the 100.

Really, you'd pick an all season tire over a dedicated snow tire? Ok....

 

[REDrum]

Do you not know how to drive on snow...?

Yes, I race and instruct on snow.

 

[mcgaskins]

Really, you'd pick an all season tire over a dedicated snow tire? Ok....

I would because I also wheel whenever I can and don't want to have a dedicated snow tire that can't handle rocks. The marginal increase in snow performance from a dedicated snow is not worth the extra cost weighed against the performance penalty in all other categories - treadware, dry handling, road noise, etc. Even though I'm stuck in this pic (lol) I also winter wheel in the snow and the DTs do quite well there too. This particular section was about 40" deep of snow that had crusted over and as each vehicle sank they got stuck. The only guy that made it through without a winch had 38" tires and showed up on a trailer to the trail.

 

[snobdds]

Yes, I race and instruct on snow.

Then why in the hell would you make such a broad and generalized statement.

Your comparing snow tires to everything else, thus everything that is not a snow tire is sub par. Not everyone needs a dedicated snow tire and most realize that the performance will not be equal to that of a true snow tire...

 

[REDrum]

Then why in the hell would you make such a broad and generalized statement.

Really, my bad, I thought I was being very specific in my first paragraph

Your comparing snow tires to everything else, thus everything that is not a snow tire is sub par

No I was offering my experience on how certain tires perform on snow. There are 4 season tires out there that perform well in snow, (some ATs and MTs) but, in my experience, the Duratrac is not one of them.

All season are not for everyone, nor are snow tires.... And one is not a substitute for the other. If I had to buy new set of tires tomorrow for mud and snow it would be Interco Truxus, but they are pretty loud when going for groceries.....

 

[snobdds]

Did not mean to come off as a dick...

I just have found I do not need to get a set of dedicated snow tires when I can run the duratrac all year round. They have done everything I need them to do as far as snow / ice goes, and I drive in a lot of it. The good thing about the duratrac is when the high mountain passes have chain laws in effect. I show the Highway Patrol the little snowflake on the tire and away I go with no need to chain up...