synthetic winch rope - recommended?

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gaylon

gaylon

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Hello all,

I am getting ready to put a M12K Warn on my 60. It has an old style ARB Bumper with connected sliders. A lot of weight already. Adding the 125# winch is just that much more weight. I am thinking of putting on a synthetic winch rope for a few reason - no corrosion, safer to use, lighter, easier to work with, ability to put 150 ft on the winch. Any concerns running a synthetic winch rope versus a steel cable?
 
those are great. Safer. Expensive.

Only issue in my mind being using them where they hit the ground. Could get damaged easily.
 
They are pricey, Rockstomper.com has 5/16 x 150 ft. for $235. Rated for 13700#. I will keep the cable that comes with the winch to use as an extension, I think.
 
gaylon said:
They are pricey, Rockstomper.com has 5/16 x 150 ft. for $235. Rated for 13700#. I will keep the cable that comes with the winch to use as an extension, I think.
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Yup, can do that. Kind of heavy and unwieldy to carry around all the time, though.
 
As a wheeler I think I would want the synthetic rope. As an "expedition" vehicle, the section your asking in, I would use a wire rope. It's tougher and can be replaced or shortened easy when out in the world or far flung places. Going into a repair shop in central america is going to have cable and ability to deal with it. As I have seen cables on the front of trucks in winter for years not corrode badly. Still serviceable even when old. Just as long as it's inspected for flaws and kept clean.

If I'm pulling thru the jungle with a winch I want a steel cable.
 
well, one advantage of synth is that it should be pretty easy to splice the cable with minimal practice, so repairs should not be too bad. And I imagine it doesn't get damaged on the spool by crushing etc as readily as wire rope.
 
e9999 said:
well, one advantage of synth is that it should be pretty easy to splice the cable with minimal practice, so repairs should not be too bad. And I imagine it doesn't get damaged on the spool by crushing etc as readily as wire rope.
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In fact the current issue of 4WD Toyota Owner magazine has an article on splicing a line with pictures.
 
I wouldn't run anything less than 3/8 inch rope. I run 100 feet on my 9.5 ti which normally can carry 125 feet of 5/16 wire. Less line yes, but my breaking strength is around 19.5 or 22K. I like rope and it's easy to splice if necessary. I carry some extension pieces I'm made from an old rope that I broke too many times to be useable.

It is definitely safer for most recoveries, but if I were hanging off the side of cliff, I'd want to be hanging from wire. I've broken my old x-line rope numberous times, but haven't broken the amsteel blue line I'm currently using yet. If it is a life and death recovery, I'd prefer to use steel wire if possible.

You do need to be a little more careful with how you handle the rope and keep it from rubbing on stuff/keep it clean, but the pluses outweight the minuses in most cases.

Adam R.
 
Darby Darrow said:
In fact the current issue of 4WD Toyota Owner magazine has an article on splicing a line with pictures.
Click to expand...
I was just going to mention that.

Isn't that magazine awesome?!
 
I use synthetic. In the jungle.

As others have mentioned: synth is more prone to wear on sharp/rough surfaces, but much, much easier to field fix it (you can literally tie a knot if you really have to- it won't lay straight later, but it'll pull you out).

I'd say that for expedition use, the weight reduction outweighs all other considerations. Depending on where you go, there are other big plusses-- synth floats, which is fantastic when doing water recovery vs. a wire that is who-knows-where under water. Synth is also safer- so if you are out far far away, it is nice to have that additional safety margin. Synth is also more multi-purpose. If you know some knots and hitches, you can use it as a very strong (though slippery) line. Wire cable doesn't do that.

Something else that has occured to me: in a heavy rainstorm, with lightning about, I think I would rather be working with my truck tied to a tree via synthetic line than steel cable. Probably wet synthetic will conduct lightning too, but it can't be a better conductor than steel.

The only time I might prefer wire rope would be if I was doing a lot of rocks and/or anything with lava. Synthetic just won't hold up as well.

Finally: to keep your synthetic line less damaged, get something to slide over it. I've seen climbing webbing (use it myself) but the real deal would be something tougher, maybe some old fire hose or something like that.
 
Needing some feedback on my winch rope.

My synthetic cable has been on for about 2 years. It's great to work with, but for the price I'm not pleased with how it holds up.

Right now I have 100' of 5/16" rope I bought from rockstomper for $210. I think the ideal solution is the Master-Pull Superline with the full abrasion cover on it, but damn that junk is expensive.

There are sections of the rope that are more ridged than when I bought it. I think this may be from the combonation of heat and preasure under load. Any thoughts?

I also have a small abrasion at about the 50' mark. That's probably my fault for not paying attention and letting it rub. I've started carrying an old Carhart jacket to throw on rocks if I need to protect the rope.

Has anyone found a cheaper solution for abrasion resistance for the entire lenth of a rope? I'd even be willing to step down to an 80' rope as I'm going to carry my old rope as spare.
 
Personally, I wouldn't want to cover up the entire length of the rope. I want to know beforehand that a rope might be wearing or about to fail. Also, it would be harder to clean if fully covered. For abrasion resistance, I used 3 - two foot pieces of double thickness 1 inch nylon webbing. It's hollow and slides fairly tightly over my 3/8 inch rope. You can get it at camping and outdoor stores. I've never had to use more than two sections over rub areas along a pull and the rope slides through the webbing very easily. At a $1 a foot, it makes for a very inexpensive and excellent abrasion guard.

Adam
 
3/8'' x 90' viking trail line blue $185 /winch safety thimbled eye $52 / viking delrin roller $70
trail line2.webp
trail line3.webp
trail line4.webp
 
I'm old fashioned on this issue, but I like wire rope. I have seen synthetic part several times, and I've never seen wire rope part, but obviously it can. The synthetic stuff always seems to get abraded in the Sierra granite where I go.

Wire rope is tough, abrasion resistant, cheap and available anywhere. With careful use and line weights it's reasonably safe as long as you don't use it casually. It lasts for years on the drum and is highly reliable.

Most synthetic lines I've seen look bleached out and questionable after just a season or two, and I certainly would not leave it on a truck that lives outside.

On the M12000, the wire rope weighs about 30 pounds vs synthetic at about 2 pounds, but the 30 pounds isn't what is overloading the front of a 60!


For the price of 1 length of synthetic rope, you can replace your wire rope 4 times. I would use synthetic in winching competitions just because of the safety factor and the fact it likely gets replaced every season. That's not the reality most of us live in, though.
 
another thought: I plan to make a winch extension out of my old wire rope. I hope that if I have a high-abrasion situation, the wire will be what is getting worked out.

w/regards to durability: I'm as worried about rust on the steel line as I am about sun damage to the synth. So I call it a wash.

FWIW: If I rolled through the Rubicon instead of through musky jungle goo, I'd probably stick with steel. A) because someone is always coming up within an hour. B) because the granite is rough stuff and C) because flotation is a non-issue in 99% of Rubicon recoveries.

But for me, in mud and rivers, the synthetic is better.
 
my opinion:

if your winch holds 125' of 5/16 wire rope, install 60% of that as 3/8" synthetic and carry the balance as an extension line. (125' to 80', 100' to 60', etc)

Winches are designed to be used on the bottom layer for maximum load....running a shorter line allows you to pull less line and get to that bottom layer....carrying an extension, or two, covers the additional possibilities for length. Learn to 'braid' synthetic line to shorten it as needed....VERY useful method. If you are at SnT, I can demonstrate ;)

My winches both run 80' or less of 3/8" synth from Winchline.com......my 'good' one has the aluminum thimble, and three 5' oversleeves for placement as needed for abrasion protection.

ALSO, remember...if you are stuck, the line NEVER MOVES....since you are winching towards a fixed object. If you are spending your time winching your cheap-ass buddies out who didn't bother to purchase a winch, then you might keep the wire since the line is moving (dragging) towards your rig.
 
I've seen folks talk about knotting poly line, but I wonder if they've tried it? I have and without exception every knot that I was taught in rock climbing plus those that I've picked up along the way was a failure in my Amsteel sample. A simple cross-weave semi-splice would fail the line outside of the spliced zone, but knots always failed somewhere in the knot itself. Characteristically all of the failed sections looked like someone had applied a propane torch to the line at the parting point. A short section of the line from the parting point back was melted looking and stiff. Different knots resulted in different lengths of the "melted" zone, but they all did it to some degree or other.

From that my thinking is that if a section of poly line shows a melted looking stiff section that it is time to retire that line or shorten it by cutting that section off.
Since most or all of the synthetic lines share similar chemistry I'm personally applying my results to all brands, but that doesn't mean that some particular brand might behave different, so YMMV.

My thot on an abrasion sleave is that it or they should be permanently on the line and long enough to completely cover the top wrap when the line is fully spooled onto the drum. Length beyond that is personal preference.
 
I haven't tried to tie line, but would probably use a double fisherman's knot, cinching the hell out of it by hand before applying strain.

For those of you who have contact with suppliers, maybe you can get them demonstrate the best way to splice a broken synthetic line (for temporary, emergency use).
 
FWIW I was interested in using 1/4" poly on my M8 as a way to both spool more line in the drum (w/o stretching it) and increase the pull per wrap. In looking at the specs it seemed an iffy idea, but the mfg was sort of wishy-washy about the breaking strength so I devised a test. Wasn't super scientific, but it was informative. Since we were rigged up to break samples of 1/4" Amsteel I figured to try out the most likely knots for field fixing a break. If I recall correctly a double fisherman is the knot that I know as the "Grapevine" knot, the knot that I had the most hope for. It is stated to be something like 90% of the strength of the rope that it is tied in. It, along with every other knot tried, failed in the knot.

It was not the knot's fault, it is the line's fault. It does not like to be bent in sharp turns as all knots do, and then put under a large load. The separations always occurred where the first tight wrap wound around either end. Either the line would part in the tight turn or it would part where the tight turn cinched down on it. Every failure looked like someone had passed a propane torch over the line while it was under tension. The parted ends looked and felt like they'd been over heated.

The quick semi-splice solution that I found to work well is almost as fast as tying a knot. Picture both ends of the parted line laying next to each other and over lapped by about 8-12 inches. Take something like a pencil and worm a hole from one side to the other of one of the lines an inch or so from the parted end and feed the other end through the hole. Repeat from the other side up the 'holed' end another inch or two. Continue until there is an inch or so of line left. The result is a simple series of 'S' curves fed through holes in the other end and it worked and held. Testing it resulted in parting the line elsewhere.
 
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