Split case 4:1, are these output shaft gears bearing supported?

[fromme]

Decided it was time to install the seal for the high/low speed selector.

Earlier I installed the idler shaft, bearings, and thrust washer. Now slide the idler gear cluster on the idler shaft. Slide the input gear on and then the spacer.

Slide the PTO gear on, taking note of its orientation. Then drive the bearing on the shaft. Again, I have no special service tools and used an appropriate sized socket. Then torque the nut to 94 ft/lbs and stake it (which I haven't done yet).

 

[fromme]

Set the output cluster with shift fork in place. I found it is easier to have the front output slide ring engaged. It keeps the ring centered and makes it easier to get the output cluster lined up.

Next, slide the rear half of the case on and torque the bolts to spec. Then slide the spacer and speedometer gear on to the output shaft. It's too hard to photograph, but you will drop the ball, spring, and "hollow" retaining bolt on the top of the case. Also, don't forget to install the shift fork lever into the rear case through the seal on the top. It is also important to install the second thrust washer on the rear case. Use grease to hold it in place. If you are using the factory linkage, bolt the linkage clamp to it. I am using a twin stick set up for Valley Hybrids so I tied a zip tie around the top the lever to keep it from falling down. It will fall down in to the case if you let it.
Put the o-ring on the idler shaft and drive it home, then install the retainer. The FSM didn't call for it, but I put a little loc-tite on the retainer bolt. Now I had enough leverage to hold things and torqued the input shaft nut to 94 ft/lbs and staked the nut.

 

[fromme]

I pretty much stopped taking pictures at this point. The rest is the opposite of disassembly. You should have a FSM when doing this, and it will guide you. I checked the preload on the output bearing and it was within spec. As an FYI, the original shims is what I reused and all is good.

VERY IMPORTANT!
The rear output seal in the rebuild kit is not correct if you are using a t-case mounted parking brake. I found out the hard way. The one in the kit looked identical in size. I should have slid it on the drum, but I assumed it was the same. I found out after I filled the t-case and it began dripping out between the drum and backing plate. I instantly knew what it was.
Finding one local was impossible. So I reused the old seal. This makes some of you gasp I'm sure. But it wasn't leaking before and I was careful when I removed it. Make sure you get the right seal before you start the job.

On a side note, my parking brake works now. Some of the parts are very worn and I need a rebuild kit. No one has any in stock, they are backordered. This made my decision to reuse the old seal easy. It's not a bad job to remove that drum, so later on I'll replace that seal and rebuild the parking brake.

Sorry, I still haven't driven it. Frustration set in with having to do that parking brake and rear d/s twice, and my back starting hurting. I didn't want to throw it out. So maybe tomorrow I can get the skid on and then it will be ready to drive.

 

[fromme]

I tend to ramble as you can see, so I'll keep it short. Got it all buttoned up and drove it this afternoon. It works! No leaks and no strange noises. The low range is awesome, but obviously won't be appreciated until I get in in the rocks.
I cannot tell if the high range is 10% underdriven as noted on AA's website. If it is, it is not noticeable to me, but keep in mind I'm running 5.29s so my speedometer is not accurate.
It is has noticeably more gear noise. From what I have read, it is no where near the amount of the Marks gearset, but you can hear it. If you're a touchy person about this kind of thing you won't like it. I'm not, and I expected more noise. I don't consider it excessive or loud, just noticeable.
On another good note, my parking brake now works great!

HTH if you were following. I guess the real test will be when I get it in the rocks and hammer on it.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

fromme, can you confirm what your kit from Advance Adapters came with. Any gaskets? Any seals or bearings?

As for gear ratios, too late now but you could count them and figure out your gearing

PonyBoy, if your reading this... would you count the number of teeth on each gear, input (splines on the inside) both gears on the idler and both the high speed and low speed output. Thanks!

 

[fromme]

The gears came with just that, gears. Nothing else. I bought a rebuild kit for a split case from them which was extra.
Now that you mention it the number of teeth was stamped on each gear. I didn't write them down. One could probably count the teeth from my pics.

 

[fromme]

Actually I just remembered the boxes had labels with the tooth count.

Looks like low speed gear - 46T
High speed gear - 28T
Idler gear - 20 and 45 teeth
Input gear - 26T

So this looks like it is underdriven with a 1.076 ratio right? So less than 8%. I would think that's minimal and not worth worrying about. For those that haven't regeared that will help a slight bit. I probably would have went with 4.88s or maybe kept the 4.10s and saved that money if I knew I'd end up here.

 

[twistedspline]

Kurt looks like I got beat to counting the teeth lol.... Ill do my ghetto fab write up in the 60 section when we find an appropriate 38mm case instead of the 34mm somebody swapped behind a spaced 4 speed tranny.... DOH guess we should have measured lol...
Oh and Im running 33" tires with 3.73 gears so im hoping that the under drive makes a bit of a difference in the power raito. I don't want to regear my axles until im ready to run 38" or so tires.

 

[fromme]

With 33" tars and the little underdrive it provides, I would find a couple centers with the factory 4.10s, or since you don't have an OD gear you might like it as is.
If you find you need an output shaft for a 60 case I have one I won't be using. I also have the old 38mm idler shaft, although the rebuild kit comes with a new one if get a rebuild. Just offering it up.

 

[twistedspline]

With my 4 speed I don't mind a little rubber overdrive considering I still daily drive the ol gal. Im figuring ill be in about the same torque band as when I was running 31" tires with the slightly lower underdrive. That will make me as happy as one can be who hasn't converted over to a 5 speed.
Fromme if I need any of that stuff I will keep you in mind Thanks! Still need to track down and appropriate case me and Kurt goofed and grabbed a 34mm one. Being the stellar good soul that he is Kurt is going to see if there is another one in his shop so I can start a new tear down next week after the holiday. Guess this 34mm case was good practice considering I've never been inside a split case before... To tell you the truth after rebuilding and regearing several dana 20's and 300's im digging the simplicity of these split cases.

 

[fromme]

An update to this... I have three wheeling trips on this, two of them hard wheeling trips with me hammering on it; and one 6 hour round trip highway drive.
I have had zero issues. The gearset is louder and I hear more whine. It is not unbearable and is tolerable. It has not increased or decreased. On the street the underdrive is noticeable. It is ok with me as I'm running the Chevy 350 so I can handle the increased rpm.
The low range is a game changer. So much more control. I'd do it again, even considering the high cost.

 

[NoeyR]

Hey fromme, any new updates/feedback on the AA 4:1 gear set? Still holding strong? Any issues?

Can anyone else comment on the increased RPM due to the under drive for an application in a diesel 3B motor without turbo, mated to an H41 trans? Would I be frustrated with the on pavement ride or would it be tolerable?

My rig is not a daily driver, it's mostly a 2 times per month wheeler spring to fall but does get driven to the trails.

 

[NoeyR]

Fromme, I pulled the trigger on these gears and will be doing the install soon. Thanks for the write up on this. Any chance you can put up the pics again? That would really help a lot.