These are parallel to the ground direction measurements? Stock suspension?
SPC UCA's - Tire Rub
- Thread starter Cruiserhead05
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afgman786
SILVER Star
Correct, parallel to ground. No, I have OME lift with SPC uppers. Along with front strut spacer (but that shouldn't matter)
edit: running same size tires as you and the only issue I have is full lock reverse I slightly rub the front fender liner where I can push forward and retap.
afgman786
SILVER Star
What is it to the rear of the fender? Can't change that, unless you've chopped your wheel well to be larger. I can check the SPC setting tomorrow
The red line measurement is around 19"
Hard to see behind the mud flap, but I'd guess it's about 19 3/4" to the fender. Maybe a touch less,
What was your failure mode when your axles seized up?
It does look like mine are pretty far forward.
afgman786
SILVER Star
So I watched the video for the settings... I took some pictures from up top and side, hopefully that will help with giving you an idea of which setting I'm running. These are all driver side since the way sunlight was hitting it came out clearer.
Going between the pictures of each setting and mine. I'm almost positive its on E
It looks like we're on a similar setting. I'm surprised you're rubbing at all. I have about 1" of clearance to the mud flap.
Because I can't find a shop in the area that has any f&^%ing clue how to handle the SPC UCA, I'm thinking of aligning it myself the best I can and then taking it in for a final alignment. The plan would be to index the UCA back towards the rear of the vehicle, then roll the LCA back the same amount. This should get the axle more centered. Then I'd adjust camber and toe. Am I crazy?
Because I can't find a shop in the area that has any f&^%ing clue how to handle the SPC UCA, I'm thinking of aligning it myself the best I can and then taking it in for a final alignment. The plan would be to index the UCA back towards the rear of the vehicle, then roll the LCA back the same amount. This should get the axle more centered. Then I'd adjust camber and toe. Am I crazy?
Update: Okay I need some help on how I can address my alignment issues. Here's a recap:
1. I installed SPC UCAs, set them at +1 and then went in for an alignment. The alignment resulted in the tires (285/70/17) rubbing against the mudflaps. The alignment shop did not touch the UCA despite me discussing the protocol on how to adjust.
2. Took the truck to another shop for alignment and they moved the SPC UCA to -0.75 and maxed out the LCAs for clearance. This resulted in the axles being at an extreme angle, plus they sheared off the alignment tabs from not not tightening to bolt to anywhere close to 207 ft lbs.
3. I adjusted the SPC UCAs to 0 degrees and took the truck to a frame welding shop to put on the total chaos beefy alignment tabs. They installed them, performed an alignment and now my passenger side tire sits 5/8" more forward than my drivers side. Again they didn't touch the SPC UCA. The passenger side adjusters look to maxed out for wheel clearance and the tie rod shows 3 threads. The drivers side looks more neutral and shows 8 threads on the tie rod. I know originally the tie roads showed equal threads.
So I'm pretty frustrated at the moment. Hind sight these SPC UCAs have been a nightmare because I can't find a shop that knows WTF they're doing.
Here's what I'm thinking:
Option 1:
I adjust the the passenger side to balance out the tie rod threads, move the LCA adjusters to get wheel spacing equal on both sides, then adjust the UCA camber to get it close to zero degrees. At that point I would bring it to alignment shop to "dial it in".
Option 2: Take it to a shop as it sits and tell them I want the wheel spacing to match and mandate they use the UCA to adjust camber.
Thanks for listening. Pictures to follow.
1. I installed SPC UCAs, set them at +1 and then went in for an alignment. The alignment resulted in the tires (285/70/17) rubbing against the mudflaps. The alignment shop did not touch the UCA despite me discussing the protocol on how to adjust.
2. Took the truck to another shop for alignment and they moved the SPC UCA to -0.75 and maxed out the LCAs for clearance. This resulted in the axles being at an extreme angle, plus they sheared off the alignment tabs from not not tightening to bolt to anywhere close to 207 ft lbs.
3. I adjusted the SPC UCAs to 0 degrees and took the truck to a frame welding shop to put on the total chaos beefy alignment tabs. They installed them, performed an alignment and now my passenger side tire sits 5/8" more forward than my drivers side. Again they didn't touch the SPC UCA. The passenger side adjusters look to maxed out for wheel clearance and the tie rod shows 3 threads. The drivers side looks more neutral and shows 8 threads on the tie rod. I know originally the tie roads showed equal threads.
So I'm pretty frustrated at the moment. Hind sight these SPC UCAs have been a nightmare because I can't find a shop that knows WTF they're doing.
Here's what I'm thinking:
Option 1:
I adjust the the passenger side to balance out the tie rod threads, move the LCA adjusters to get wheel spacing equal on both sides, then adjust the UCA camber to get it close to zero degrees. At that point I would bring it to alignment shop to "dial it in".
Option 2: Take it to a shop as it sits and tell them I want the wheel spacing to match and mandate they use the UCA to adjust camber.
Thanks for listening. Pictures to follow.
TexAZ
NEW???? It's BETTER than new!!!
Check the lower control arms. All the way out in the back and in on the front will move the wheel about an inch. Per SPC guidance, they NEVER ran beyond 3/4". I blew up three axles before learning that little nugget. I run front neutral and rear out to push the wheel about 5/8" forward. ( with tundra control arms) I can clear 35s with 18mm or higher offset wheels.
Is there a spec sheet/diagram to describe the adjustments on the LCA's and what that looks like? I have very little knowledge about IFS alignment.
TexAZ
NEW???? It's BETTER than new!!!
when I went to 35s I asked the alignment shop to push the wheels forward by dialing the lower control arms full inward in the front and full outbound in the rear. (with the Tundra upper/lower arms) this moved the wheel about an inch forward. cleared the rear mud flap and body mount easily. However, it did bind the inner CV cup, eventually causing overheating, and a sheared axle shaft in Moab. I spoke to one of the engineers with SPC and he said they NEVER went beyond 3/4" forward. I pulled the coilovers out and cycled the suspension with the wheel turned to the worst position for contact and cycled the wheel up and down. I did this with the worst case adjusment, neutral, and mild forward push. the image below are my results. taken with a grain of salt, and the conditions listed above.
TexAZ
NEW???? It's BETTER than new!!!
I ran front neutral, rear adjustment out for three years, with no issues. I was running BBS Tundra 20's with 50mm backspacing, cleared everything. One of my SPC arms broke. the pipe split and the arm broke. Mine were older, had over 200k on them, been through 3 ball joints and replaced the completely worn out bushings, but they finally quit.
when i replaced them, the newer arms rubbed on the tires. i pushed the lower arms full out, still cleared the body mount, but the drivers side still rubbed and droop.
i could have gotten a 10 mm spacer, but instead went with higher offset wheels.
i'm running Walker Evans racing wheels, 18mm offset. pushes the tires outside the fenders and has a slight rub on the body mount in reverse with the wheel turned just right.
if i had to do it all over again, i'd probably have gotten the 10mm spacer and longer wheel studs. i wound up having to get longer studs from Japan to run the aftermarket wheels anyway.
when i replaced them, the newer arms rubbed on the tires. i pushed the lower arms full out, still cleared the body mount, but the drivers side still rubbed and droop.
i could have gotten a 10 mm spacer, but instead went with higher offset wheels.
i'm running Walker Evans racing wheels, 18mm offset. pushes the tires outside the fenders and has a slight rub on the body mount in reverse with the wheel turned just right.
if i had to do it all over again, i'd probably have gotten the 10mm spacer and longer wheel studs. i wound up having to get longer studs from Japan to run the aftermarket wheels anyway.
TexAZ
NEW???? It's BETTER than new!!!
the passenger side is neutral/neutral. the drivers side has the front pushed in. probably moved the wheel forward half inch or so. no problems with axle bind.
odd way to set it up. probably the easiest way for the alignment shop to dial it in without having to adjust the upper arm ball joint rotation.
my alignment guy hates SPC for the work it takes to dial it in first time.
odd way to set it up. probably the easiest way for the alignment shop to dial it in without having to adjust the upper arm ball joint rotation.
my alignment guy hates SPC for the work it takes to dial it in first time.
I will let the shop tomorrow see if they want to mess with it further, but I definitely need the steering reset to center. It feels slightly stiffer to the left when steering, maybe that's the alignment or maybe that's just the new CV on that side, either way it tracks straight down the road when driving and under braking and it's not pulling.
TexAZ
NEW???? It's BETTER than new!!!
here are the alignment specs I request when taking in my truck. since these are all wheel drive the castor affects steering more than a typical car/truck.
all these specs are within the toyota specs, just points to how they work together. I pulled these off a lifted Tundra forum years ago and it's worked pretty well so far.
STOCK TRUCKS:
Camber: +.1 degree camber on both sides.
Caster: As much as possible without sacrificing +.1 degree camber or causing a cross caster pull.
Toe: +.12 degrees per side for a total toe of +.24 degrees. (some guys have had to drop toe to +.04 to +.5 per side/+.08 to +.10 total toe)
LIFTED TRUCKS:
Same As Above ... BUT if you have wheels that have more negative offset than foctory wheels, increase the camber to +.2 degrees. (or even +.3 degrees if they just can't get there with the amount of adjustment allowed by the eccentrics) Adjustable upper control arms are available for cases where there just isn't enough adjustment left in the eccentrics to get a decent alignment. Although they are expensive, most guys with lifts have a lot of $$$ invested in tires so you need to make a judgement call
all these specs are within the toyota specs, just points to how they work together. I pulled these off a lifted Tundra forum years ago and it's worked pretty well so far.
STOCK TRUCKS:
Camber: +.1 degree camber on both sides.
Caster: As much as possible without sacrificing +.1 degree camber or causing a cross caster pull.
Toe: +.12 degrees per side for a total toe of +.24 degrees. (some guys have had to drop toe to +.04 to +.5 per side/+.08 to +.10 total toe)
LIFTED TRUCKS:
Same As Above ... BUT if you have wheels that have more negative offset than foctory wheels, increase the camber to +.2 degrees. (or even +.3 degrees if they just can't get there with the amount of adjustment allowed by the eccentrics) Adjustable upper control arms are available for cases where there just isn't enough adjustment left in the eccentrics to get a decent alignment. Although they are expensive, most guys with lifts have a lot of $$$ invested in tires so you need to make a judgement call
