SOA vs. SUA

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GLTHFJ60

GLTHFJ60

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Now that I have my 60 running, it's time for a suspension upgrade. I have researched the different options, beteween getting my springs rearched, buying new springs, or buying a kit. I have come to the conclusion that my wallet is not as deep as I thought that it would be this time of year.

Then it occurred to me that going SOA was an option, giving me lift, which is what I want, and then also keeping the cost down. What I was thinking that I would do is get my springs rearched through my uncle's connections, and then go SOA. I do not want my truck to handle much differently, but I do want to be able to do some mudding. What are your thoughts?

:beer:
 
What size tire you plan on running? That would be the deciding factor on your plans.

Going bigger than 33's ?, then a SOA would be an option. But going bigger than 33's might have you looking at a gear ratio change too.

SOA with arched springs? You need to put on some big tires so it won't look goofy meaning a definite gear change will be needed. Handling would change for sure I would think
 
I was thinking going 36" on stock rims.

I know that a while back, there was a really informative thread on the suspension engineering of a 60 and how going SOA changes that. I can't find it though. Help?

:beer:
 
36" tall tires will be too wide for stock 6 inch rims. Width is all that matters, but basically all 36 inch tires are wider than 11.5.
To fix the suspension geometry changes use shims. The third member needs to be taken out of the front diff so you can cut and retack a weld that changes stuff too. I've never done it so someone else could elaborate im sure.
Hildy
 
From what I've heard just doing the SOA on stock springs will give you about 6" lift. Do the SOA first, then worry about a re-arch. It might be too much lift to combine the two of them.
 
A SOA on stock height springs *without* rotating the front axle is possible if you have a 5 speed or a long 4 speed (i.e., the spacer to make it the same length as a 5 speed). You need to ensure there is a double cardan on the t-case side of the front drive shaft, and you'll need to trim about 1" of the tranny cross member to make room for the drive shaft at full droop, but it works adequately. The only significant cost (other than the double cardan if you don't already have one) would be the cross over steering arm and longer brake lines, breathers and shocks (assuming you want to maximize the performance of the new suspension design), assuming you weld/fab everything yourself. With significant advanced planning and pre-work on all the parts that can be pre-worked (i.e. making spring perches ahead of time, having the new front drive shaft ready, etc.) I did mine on my own, in a weekend. The result is that you can fit 35-36" tires with ease.

If you SOA on lifted springs, then you need to rotate the front housing. Again, I've done this too. The result is that you can easily fit 38" tires.

Any time you lift a truck with old tired drive shafts, you'll get driveline vibration. Include in your budget a handful of new u-joints and some drive shaft work. The shafts will be working at higher angles than they've ever done before, and will dramatically amplify any balance or u-joint problems in the existing shafts.

Peter Straub
 
My rear springs have started to invert just parked. I figured that as purely a saftey concern, I should get them rearched. I thought that stock springs were the best to do an SOA conversion with anyway?

A long 4-speed would be an '87 stocker, right? From what I have come to know, the '87 4-speed was made to be just as long as the five speed.

What I have never heard is the necessity for a double cardan joint on the front axle. I did not think that one was needed unless extreme driveshaft angles were achieved, therefore not with a long 4-speed. Am I wrong?

:beer:
 
I did an OME Dakkar 2" lift (new springs, greasable HD shackles, bushings, shocks) and 15x8 powdercoated steel rims with 33x12.5" tires. It was $1900 in parts which was costly... but OME was written up as the best ride/quality when doing a lift. I wanted both and splurged as I plan to keep the truck for a long time.

The ride is better than it was stock (130K miles on stock suspension was very bouncy/loose) riding on 31's. I kept it SUA and did it myself in the driveway in about 1 1/2 days taking my time. The truck looks great, I retained the stock gears (not a powerhouse... but goes well), it cruises better on the highway at speed which is what it does 80% of its life (stock non OD 4spd), but does suffer from a stand still in 2H/4H from lack of gear when trying to climb a steep hill. Need to slip the clutch a little to get going. Once in 4L I don't notice the 3:70 gears and it wheels great even at 6,000ft+ altitude.

Your choice of SUA/SOA should be based on tire size. If you go larger than 33's you need gears $$$. You definately need new rims as the stockers simply won't work.

You need to decide if you want to keep this truck for a long time. If so... splurge on redoing the suspension. The rest of the truck is pretty bulletproof.

-Mark
 
Handling will be affected with a SO.

RE arched springs are a waste of time. The springs have a memory, typically the rearch will not last long.

Think of your costs. How much fab work can you do???

If you have someone do a SO for you it will be expensive. If you can do it yourself then it does not cost as much.

double cardan is not necessary in the front. Most of the time you will never be going fst enough in 4wd to notice the vibrations.

Double cardan in the rear is important if the diff is turned up towards the tcase (which I reccomend)


First question.
How good are you at welding??
 
i did my own soa, no cut & turn,no cutting of the x-member.
you use a 85 newer mini truck rear d-shaft,cut down to size.
no cardon in the rear.
stock springs with full length add-a-leafs.
dont forget to do a anti-wrap bar in the rear.
runnin 35's with stock power train and 4.88's
love it!
i even like it when you lean it in a turn ;) ;)

sway bars? we dont need no stink'n sway bars! :D
 
Mace said:
double cardan is not necessary in the front. Most of the time you will never be going fst enough in 4wd to notice the vibrations.

Double cardan in the rear is important if the diff is turned up towards the tcase (which I reccomend)QUOTE]

I agree. But I ran my 40 with no CV rear until I snapped it on a trail. Noticed minor vibes at speed, but not too bad. CV made it nice.
Click to expand...
 
Mace,

I personally do not have a welder, but I know a lot of people that have major experience with welders that are more than willing to help.

Also, I have connections with Superior Spring in Connecticut, which is the best spring joint in the northeast. What if I got them rearched and then put in long add-a-leafs? They would last longer that way. Also, has anyone here gotten their springs rearched with less than expected results? If so, chime in.

As for costs, at this point, I'm not sure if I'm going to have enough money to get the OME kit that I want, so I'm just evaluating my options. I'm confident that I could do it myself, I just need time to do it.

I am definately going to keep the rig for a very long time, very long. It only has 92k on it!! It's just about broken in!

Another thing that I have to consider is spring capacity. How well does a SOA rig tow?



:beer:
 
Okay, as long as you have friends that you trust you are a lot better off.

Springovers are not parts expensive. Labor is..

SOA on stock springs rides nice, but sacks springs out quick.

What do you want to tow??
 
I got the man-a-fre HABU shackle reversal kit, it got enough clearence out of that to run 35's with no rubbing, just for another reference of something you can do to clear 35's without going with a SOA. I was debating over to do SOA or the shackle reversal on mine, and i am really happy with my decision.
 
fsusteve said:
I think lowtide did his for like $70 or so. He did not cut and turn and has had no issues, in fact I drove it and it steered quite straight. I believe he did shim the rear due to vibration.
Click to expand...


I wish i did it for that cheap....after u-bolts, brake lines, spring perches, hy-steer,wheels & tires, add a leafs, shims, anit-inv. shackles, bushings, etc. etc.... i was pushing 1500 easy...


....then to make it right....re-gear, wrap bar, protections for the belly, kunckle re-build, and im still collecting parts that would normally break on the trail with big tires and a big lift...birfs, inners, rears, d shafts......


its a snowball effect...but its one hell of a ride. More fun this way anywho...


and tonight for offesting those wamping meats...4 runner calipers...
 
Your current calipers bad???

you will only see a .0005678% increase in stopping power ;)
 
yeah my current right front doesnt work at all, unless ya mash on the pedal during a quick light change.....and it will proceed to stay on, making the cab smell funny.....oh kinda like burning brakes.
 
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