Power Window Failure Diagnosis (1 Viewer)

[LCnAZ]

Hey guys, I've read up in the sticky what there is on windows, and I can see there can be multiple things that can affect window travel. For instance, the front passenger window is very slow when using the driver main panel switch, but is fine/zippy when using the passenger door window switch. So I plan to go into the driver switch and try to clean up pitting, etc..

The driver window failed on me at half way suddenly recently. I'm trying to get an accurate diagnosis of the source of that failure. I have the repair manual, but I'm not confident of my findings there. I thought that maybe I could describe the symptoms/situation here and maybe some of you guys have seen similar. I'd like to do that before ordering a new motor.

The driver widow does not mechanically move at all when the window switch is activated up or down. I can hear the relay or something trying to command the movement, but nothing. I also tried what the manual says to put battery power straight to the window motor pins briefly to verify activation. Nothing.

Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[LCnAZ]

Here's some follow up on diagnosis of my own problem. Upon close inspection of the driver's side harness, I could tell that something wasn't factory. I did buy this vehicle new, but I had a Viper alarm system put it which included the ability to lock/unlock the doors with a key fob. It worked great in the day, but eventually created big problems and the system was removed ... I thought. Apparently not all of it.

Inside the door panel cavity I found two relay like cubes to which the door lock cables from the harness were tapped and re-directed. I removed these and restored the original paths and, voila ... the door locks worked like a champ! In reality, they were a bit stiff. But after opening all the doors, lubing all the door lock linkages, and cycling them a lot, they work darn well if the vehicle is running. A little less reliable is not.

What does this have to do with the original post about power windows? I suspected that this non-factory electrical was creating other problems. I've had a problem with batteries not holding charges well, despite everything checking good. Sure enough, upon testing the front passenger window operation from the driver switches, it now works fine, too. I then cleaned and lubed up the channels for that.

So, I can't explain exactly what was going on, but it appears that remnants of that old security system were causing a higher than normal resistance in the electrical system and this affected all the power items, plus very possibly the drain on the battery. Only a week of time or so will confirm that.

So, FWIW, there's a bit of information. Probably more useful to those of you who bought your Cruiser used.

 

[Crick60]

Everything you need to know is here:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/index.php?threads/Power-Windows-and-Door-Locks--Permanent-Fix!.261058/

 

[LCnAZ]

Everything you need to know is here:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/index.php?threads/Power-Windows-and-Door-Locks--Permanent-Fix!.261058/

Well, maybe or probably so, but the thread is primarily about the "permanent fix" mod rather than pure diagnosis. I haven't dug up anything in that thread (which is where I started my research before posting) that zeroed in on my inoperative driver window. Of course, nothing in that thread could have helped with the fact that aftermarket products were what were causing numerous problems in my vehicle.

Unfortunately, the driver's side motor will have to be replaced. Got one coming from Cruiser Dan.

 

[Crick60]

Don't be surprised if the new motor doesn't fix it, between the loom and degraded negative return most times the relay mod is the only true fix

 

[LCnAZ]

Don't be surprised if the new motor doesn't fix it, between the loom and degraded negative return most times the relay mod is the only true fix

That looms, for sure.

What strikes me really strange is that the window has been flawless, and suddenly failed to a dead stop in mid-travel. The pavement was also a little rough at that moment. At first I wondered if something just got knocked loose.

 

[slcfj62]

Replace the relays in the green box in the drivers door before you do the motor. See this link:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/fj62-drivers-power-window-autodown-relay-fix.362868/

 

[LCnAZ]

Replace the relays in the green box in the drivers door before you do the motor. See this link:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/fj62-drivers-power-window-autodown-relay-fix.362868/

Thank you for the link to the excellent thread. I'm sure that will be useful, although it doesn't fix my problem. I was able to determine today that the relay is definitely outputting the commands to the window, but the motor is dead. It will not respond to 12v current whatsoever. Regardless of the relay performance, if the window motor doesn't respond to direct battery current, it is certainly in need of replacement.

I may plan for a rainy relay day, though, thanks to your suggestion.

 

[Crick60]

Just be sure when you replace it that it doesn't immediately burnout because the issue that initially caused the problem has not been realised or resolved.
It sounds like you're onto it but be prepared to disconnect quickly, alternatively you could put a resettable fuse on the motor and or a current meter to check if it's still under fault.
I'm yet to hear of a burnt out 60 window motor but your circuit certainly seemed suspect.

 

[LCnAZ]

Just be sure when you replace it that it doesn't immediately burnout because the issue that initially caused the problem has not been realised or resolved.
It sounds like you're onto it but be prepared to disconnect quickly, alternatively you could put a resettable fuse on the motor and or a current meter to check if it's still under fault.
I'm yet to hear of a burnt out 60 window motor but your circuit certainly seemed suspect.

Excellent advice. Thank you for that. How many amps should the window command be? I don't see that specified in the repair manual.

FWIW, Cruiser Dan says the right passenger 60 wagon window wagon is no longer available. Why would that be if they were not burning out?

 

[Crick60]

Not too sure on the current draw, if it was burnt out I would expect close to a full short but that should have been protected by the circuit fuse. At a guess I would say maybe 2-4A is normal? Even as high as 8-10 could be ok for short periods.

The motor may be used in a multitude of other vehicles, Toyota's six sigma program dictated the use of common store items across all models in the 80's and 90's.

 

[LCnAZ]

Anybody have any luck with these. This shows for 1/90 and after. I presume that is manufacturing date. Mine was built 11/89. http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/s...tor/1990/A1471138.html?loc=Front,+Driver+Side