LX570 ATF filter (1 Viewer)

[weaponoffreedom]

Conflicting info I have found..............................Does it have replaceable filter of not? ATF. Some say there is a "screen" but I have found several filters that are just like conventional atf filters for my 09 LX....please advise

 

[bloc]

Your 6spd has a standard ATF filter like nearly all automatic transmissions.

I suspect the comments about a screen are just pointing out it doesn’t actually do a lot to filter the fluid.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

Your 6spd has a standard ATF filter like nearly all automatic transmissions.

I suspect the comments about a screen are just pointing out it doesn’t actually do a lot to filter the fluid.

I have read many threads on here and on other forums, and looked into it a bit. The filter looks not unlike any other, as you put it.....so I am not sure as to why an individual would think that it would not need to be changed at some point. I have always changed my ATF filters at aprx 30k intervals with Gm 4l80e trannies. Any thoughts on this?

 

[tominboise]

I changed the fluid in the trans at 80k or so and intend to do the fluid and the filter this summer at around 135k. I don't think it will hurt anything to do so and pulling the pan gets another qt of ATF out of the system.

 

[bloc]

I have read many threads on here and on other forums, and looked into it a bit. The filter looks not unlike any other, as you put it.....so I am not sure as to why an individual would think that it would not need to be changed at some point. I have always changed my ATF filters at aprx 30k intervals with Gm 4l80e trannies. Any thoughts on this?

Hard to say. The Toyota filtering and flow system could be better to the point they really can go 3x as long.

As for why someone would say it’s not necessary.. I think it actually may not be in the recommended maintenance list. Though I’m not sure about that.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

Hard to say. The Toyota filtering and flow system could be better to the point they really can go 3x as long.

As for why someone would say it’s not necessary.. I think it actually may not be in the recommended maintenance list. Though I’m not sure about that.

I think it was also at a time, where "total cost of ownership was a a big selling point back in 09, when gas was high.......etc.........it has a filter and a magnet, those items are there for a reason I ordered a filter and gasket and 12 quarts of Mobil Multi vehicle ATF which meets WS. I would like to examine the filter to verify some of my suspicions.

It is bad info to assume that there is no filter, or the filter never has to be changed. Bad info. If one waits until a filter is clogged to change it, one is doing the wrong thing.

 

[bloc]

It is bad info to assume that there is no filter, or the filter never has to be changed. Bad info. If one waits until a filter is clogged to change it, one is doing the wrong thing.

It’s not an assumption, Toyota doesn’t state that it has to be changed, despite at least on my 2013 the maintenance schedule running out to 120k miles and recommending two fluid changes in that time.

So technically “the filter doesn’t need to be changed” is accurate info, according to the company that built the vehicle. Whatever an owner decides to do above and beyond that is up to them. (I changed the filter in mine at ~110k)

 

[weaponoffreedom]

It’s not an assumption, Toyota doesn’t state that it has to be changed, despite at least on my 2013 the maintenance schedule running out to 120k miles and recommending two fluid changes in that time.

So technically “the filter doesn’t need to be changed” is accurate info, according to the company that built the vehicle. Whatever an owner decides to do above and beyond that is up to them. (I changed the filter in mine at ~110k)

The book not specifically calling out to do some does not mean you never do it. There is no specific interval for the lower radiator hose either, but you know when you need to replace it.

With the ATF filter, if it clogs, the tranny dies.

it is dumb to assume the filter never has to be changed, and even dumber to regurgitate such BS.

 

[OregonLC]

It's only dumb if there's evidence of the filter's efficacy in terms of trans life. Has there been any known cases of trans fluid starvation in a 200? Do we know that the trans filter is a small-particle filter designed to catch wear particles rather than just keep larger chucks out of the flow? Has anyone done comparative Blackstone analysis on fluid changes with the filter vs without?

And dropping the pan to replace isn't a risk-free activity. Those small bolts can be froze by corrosion and break during removal.

From what I've seen, 60k fluid change intervals is much more critical than filter changes.

 

[gasman4u]

It's only dumb if there's evidence of the filter's efficacy in terms of trans life. Has there been any known cases of trans fluid starvation in a 200? Do we know that the trans filter is a small-particle filter designed to catch wear particles rather than just keep larger chucks out of the flow? Has anyone done comparative Blackstone analysis on fluid changes with the filter vs without?

And dropping the pan to replace isn't a risk-free activity. Those small bolts can be froze by corrosion and break during removal.

From what I've seen, 60k fluid change intervals is much more critical than filter changes.

I would agree the risk of contamination, parts not being put back just right, gasket issues, etc might make dropping the pan just for the filter a risk:reward scenario to consider.

I changed my ATF at 50k and plan on keeping that schedule. The filter is original. With that said, the magnet being addressed would be a priority for me when the time comes to drop it. I am on the fence for 100k being the time I change the filter or not.

Apparently OEM’s get credit for maintenance intervals using petroleum products. Hence, the big push for 10k oil change intervals, “lifetime” fluids, etc. They care about CAFE metrics, not whether your rig makes 400k or not. That’s my unsolicited opinion though.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

I would agree the risk of contamination, parts not being put back just right, gasket issues, etc might make dropping the pan just for the filter a risk:reward scenario to consider.

I changed my ATF at 50k and plan on keeping that schedule. The filter is original. With that said, the magnet being addressed would be a priority for me when the time comes to drop it. I am on the fence for 100k being the time I change the filter or not.

Apparently OEM’s get credit for maintenance intervals using petroleum products. Hence, the big push for 10k oil change intervals, “lifetime” fluids, etc. They care about CAFE metrics, not whether your rig makes 400k or not. That’s my unsolicited opinion though.

That is sensible. 100%, they care about CAFE and therefore there are many things left out of a typical service interval of these and other machines. I dont do 10k oil changes either on anything. I think we are on the same page here.

The magnet is a good point. I would argue that contamination and or issues with reassembly are best met with someone who is not a hack, and has a good mechanical inclination. Imagine all the metal particles flowing past a magnet that cant catch it, and the wear that insues.

My argument here, in this thread, is that many say there is no filter, and say, "it does not say to do it in the manual" is a complete falsehood, and or a misunderstanding of what a filter does, and why it is even there. The consensus here and other sites on this subject is just drain and fill until dead. This is silly.

The same people, who state "change plugs, coils, shocks, u joints and everything else under the sun at 100k" then tout the reliability of the LX\LC are speaking two different languages.

Opposed to what many think, there is NOTHING special about the LX\LC, no magic fluid or "unobtainium" materials. It has a tranny, which uses clutch material, that materials wears off over use. Some gets caught in the fluid. Over time the filter WILL get clogged, or the magnet will be "over its clinging ability" to hold metal, and that metal will flow. It does not matter the transmission, it is not good for any of them.

The typical ATF filter is 100 micron, twice the within of a human hair, or about .0039 inches........

 

[OregonLC]

I feel the extending intervals started at the same time manufacturers started offering free 24 month (or whatever interval maintenance). When it's on the consumer the OCIs were 3k. When on the manufacturer the increased to 10k. Now at the same time there was also a push from dino to synth so that had a role in it too.

I don't agree with all things Dave's Auto, but he's pretty big on 5k OCI's. While Blackstone may provide evidence of the condition of the oil, what they can't show is the amount of sludge accumulating in the engine. His argument is that while the wear protection may show okay, it's the risk to flow from sludge buildup that will spin a bearing or round a cam and kill an engine.

We can go way down a rabbit hole here, but this is probably even more important with Turbo engines that have small-journal bearings at high temps.

 

[gasman4u]

I feel the extending intervals started at the same time manufacturers started offering free 24 month (or whatever interval maintenance). When it's on the consumer the OCIs were 3k. When on the manufacturer the increased to 10k. Now at the same time there was also a push from dino to synth so that had a role in it too.

I don't agree with all things Dave's Auto, but he's pretty big on 5k OCI's. While Blackstone may provide evidence of the condition of the oil, what they can't show is the amount of sludge accumulating in the engine. His argument is that while the wear protection may show okay, it's the risk to flow from sludge buildup that will spin a bearing or round a cam and kill an engine.

We can go way down a rabbit hole here, but this is probably even more important with Turbo engines that have small-journal bearings at high temps.

Gas turbo direct injection has entered the chat! 10k oci’s on those would definitely yield out of spec oil when you’re finally draining it. Likely able to flash it off too due to fuel dilution. The 5k oci is tough to make mistakes with. I go longer, but use more expensive oil and filters and get oil analysis with wear check (apparently blackstone doesn’t have as accurate of testing per bitog) to verify my engine is still getting in spec, effective lubrication at the end of the oil life cycle. Supposedly I could go longer, but I don’t think I will despite my likely wasting money on the oil/filter compared to OEM (which is definitely good enough for 5k).

That is sensible. 100%, they care about CAFE and therefore there are many things left out of a typical service interval of these and other machines. I dont do 10k oil changes either on anything. I think we are on the same page here.

The magnet is a good point. I would argue that contamination and or issues with reassembly are best met with someone who is not a hack, and has a good mechanical inclination. Imagine all the metal particles flowing past a magnet that cant catch it, and the wear that insues.

My argument here, in this thread, is that many say there is no filter, and say, "it does not say to do it in the manual" is a complete falsehood, and or a misunderstanding of what a filter does, and why it is even there. The consensus here and other sites on this subject is just drain and fill until dead. This is silly.

The same people, who state "change plugs, coils, shocks, u joints and everything else under the sun at 100k" then tout the reliability of the LX\LC are speaking two different languages.

Opposed to what many think, there is NOTHING special about the LX\LC, no magic fluid or "unobtainium" materials. It has a tranny, which uses clutch material, that materials wears off over use. Some gets caught in the fluid. Over time the filter WILL get clogged, or the magnet will be "over its clinging ability" to hold metal, and that metal will flow. It does not matter the transmission, it is not good for any of them.

The typical ATF filter is 100 micron, twice the within of a human hair, or about .0039 inches........

This is the first I’ve seen info for filter media density for transmissions (though I haven’t looked ). Interesting that it’s that high, but makes sense as I guess you want some material floating about compared to the engine oil.

Some owners are definitely “by the book” and don’t touch what isn’t described there. I can see merits to this from a short term, but definite downsides too (as written above) given competing interests from the OEM’s. It’d be cool to see what people do at what interval via a poll or survey of some sort. And whether or not that actually helps, doesn’t matter, or actually is detrimental to longevity.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

We can go way down a rabbit hole here, but this is probably even more important with Turbo engines that have small-journal bearings at high temps.

Right, high temps caused by high power output per liter. Long intervals are not a good thing with newer DI engines, 100% fact.

I feel the extending intervals started at the same time manufacturers started offering free 24 month (or whatever interval maintenance). When it's on the consumer the OCIs were 3k. When on the manufacturer the increased to 10k. Now at the same time there was also a push from dino to synth so that had a role in it too.

100% fact.

Some owners are definitely “by the book” and don’t touch what isn’t described there.

Right, and some if not most of LX\LC owners do not even do their own servicing, so dont even know what size bolt is used to fasten the pan on, besides a google search. I am going to change my filter next week, and will post what I find here. My new to me LX was factory serviced at the dealer at the suggested intervals. I did one drain and fill at 120k, has just north of that now. I will disect the filter and hopefully extract debris, should there be any.......my guess is that there will be.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

Well, I did change the filter yesterday, but forgot to take any pictures. Big fail on my part.

No broken bolts no issues anywhere, magnets were nasty, but not as nasty as I would have thought for the mileage. The pan a nasty, but again, for the mileage it was fine.

I do not know if someone has changed the filter or not before me or not.

The filter was saturated with material, none was glittery, just dark.


Refilling took somewhere about 6-7 quarts. if you use a pump to fill, account for the pump and line loses.......I had to put 7 quarts in my pail to achieve full status. If you understand what I am saying.

The pan holds about 1.5 quarts after draining during a drain and fill FYI.

Used Beck Arney filter kit, and Mobil Multi Vehicle ATF