Landcruiser

[ShottsUZJ100]

You state that as fact, on what basis?

I suppose that this statement might technically be true since the 100 series is undeniably younger than any 80- or 60 or 55 or 40, any of which I would argue will be proven to be more mechanically reliable than the electronic-dependant 100 in the long term. For that matter, the 80 pushes my personal limits of what should be electronic. For me, the coil suspension, solid axles and overbuilt design makes up for the electronic transmission and climate control- neither of which has been shown to be a problem, but still... the more complex a machine, the more likelyhood for failure.

The original question referenced cost of repairs. How would you rate the 100 in that category Shotts? (No digs here, just trying to help the poster and I have no experience with 100 series repair bills.)

In the end they're all Land Cruisers and worthy of consideration. The 100 is undeniably the flagship for luxury- to date.



-Spike

The reliability stuff has been well noted on MUD. Consumer Reports over the years showed the comparison as well as numerous other choices. The 100's had less required repairs both early in life and as they age. It's amazing how all the little and nagging failures the 80's have were eliminated in the 100 (as they should).

Overheating
Bad sunroofs
Poor power windows
AT shifting issues
Engine failures
A/C cut out
Poor brakes

Unless you are bulding an extreme wheeler there's no reason to put up with old technology unless you can't afford the new.

The 100 has a few issues though the frequency is much less than the 80's nagging ones.

Manfolds
Starter

This guy stated "DD then eventually a wheeler". That's why he was asked by me about that and if the 100 was in his sights.

By the way.....the "over built design" is even more impressive in the 100 compared to the 80 (as it should be). The FF axle answer doesn't hold water unless you're building a ShortBus, so don't try it. In every other way (frame, strength, engine, structure, brakes, creaks and cracks...frame caused) the 100 bombs the 80 for being over built.

It's up to this guy. If he wants a Rubicon Trail rig eventually then I change my tune. If he wants to run almost everything but that....why live with the old stuff when the new offfers so much more?

 

[-Spike-]

And repair costs?

I'm not conceding any of your points, but this isn't the place to debate them. Both of us have stated our opinions.

-Spike

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

And repair costs?

I'm not conceding any of your points, but this isn't the place to debate them. Both of us have stated our opinions.

-Spike

I get tired of debating this. On MUD, the 80 and 60 wheelers far out cry the number of 100 wheelers. So the number of opinions against the 100 are higher. In 5-10 more years will the attitudes change.

From my experience, the part costs seem the pretty close. I've seen only a couple of wierd 100 things cost-wise and these failures are rare.

**Control arm bushings are not sold by themselves. You need to buy the whole arm. (Who's had to buy 100 rear arms besides me?)

**Front ball joints cannot be bought by themselves. You have to buy the whole arm. (Who in the US has needed to buy new arms? Very few.)

**The brake booster is VERY expensive. There have been very few failures. For me? I'll pay out the nose for this safety feature. 100% braking without the engine on? I'll pay. Hell, I'd pay for the booster replacement just to get the safe brakes in the 100. An 80 can't stop worth a crap and in my opinion is very dangerous. I'll use the word under-built.

OK Ben....you get the last word. Go for it, then let's see if this fella posts more about his future needs?

 

[-Spike-]

LOL, you have a very defensive attitude about the 100. There are only 2 opinions about 100's in this thread- yours and mine. And I suggested he look at 100's in my first reply, albeit with a caveat.

My question about repair costs was not part of the 'debate', it was an attempt to get some info that the original poster asked for.

And both of my 80's stop fine, although neither did when I got them. They system is difficult to bleed properly, which probably is the problem for many 80's. They can stop even better with 100 series pads swapped in.

-Spike

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

LOL, you have a very defensive attitude about the 100. There are only 2 opinions about 100's in this thread- yours and mine. And I suggested he look at 100's in my first reply, albeit with a caveat.

My question about repair costs was not part of the 'debate', it was an attempt to get some info that the original poster asked for.

And both of my 80's stop fine, although neither did when I got them. They system is difficult to bleed properly, which probably is the problem for many 80's. They can stop even better with 100 series pads swapped in.

-Spike

You shouldn't ruin an 80 by putting 100 parts in it!

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

LOL, you have a very defensive attitude about the 100.-Spike

Oh, and that's because I'm outnumbered on MUD due to sheer number of older wheelers. Somebody must stand up and share the 100 experience (and take it in the shorts).

 

[Tools R Us]

I get tired of debating this...

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

Reliability debates suck!

 

[Tools R Us]

wancho1, in case you can't tell, just about everything that John says after "I like my 100" is agenda driven BS exaggerations. A couple of examples; He conveniently left out how 100 front diffs break like popcorn, ask how many steering racks and front suspension components he has replaced.

He loves to call the 80 brakes "dangerous" regardless of the facts, some measured stopping from Consumer Reports;
1994 LC- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 136 feet
1996 LX450- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 136 feet
1998 LC- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 140 feet
2003 LC- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 135 feet


He loves to beat this very dead carcass, that's why he has this smiley named after him.:shotts:

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

wancho1, in case you can't tell, just about everything that John says after "I like my 100" is agenda driven BS exaggerations. A couple of examples; He conveniently left out how 100 front diffs break like popcorn, ask how many steering racks and front suspension components he has replaced.

He loves to call the 80 brakes "dangerous" regardless of the facts, some measured stopping from Consumer Reports;
1994 LC- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 136 feet
1996 LX450- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 136 feet
1998 LC- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 140 feet
2003 LC- 60-0 mph stopping distance of 135 feet


He loves to beat this very dead carcass, that's why he has this smiley named after him.:shotts:

Oh my god Kevin. You know very well that as soon as you tire-up the 80 the brakes go to hell. This is well know and documented. The system sucks with 35's.

I have a video of my LX450 and 100 (not PC based) both with 35's and AT KO's that show this.

From 60MPH the 100 stopped almost 3 truck lengths shorter!
Then, what we should have done is test it 3 times. I guarantee the brake fade that would have set in on the LX450 would have show huge losses in power too. Maybe I'll go back and do these again with the digital camera.

From 25MPH (parking lot scenario...somebody backing out) the 100 stopped a truck length + shorter. From only 25! My 1993 was identical. At 25 and a mashed pedal it just slowwws (kind of). Damn....from 25 it's HARD to get ABS to kick in the systems suck so bad with the big tires. The 100 just GRABS and you stop ASAP.

Why oh why some of you non-100 owners cannot admit these improvements.

 

[Tools R Us]

Oh my god Kevin. You know very well that as soon as you tire-up the 80 the brakes go to hell. This is well know and documented. The system sucks with 35's.

Why don't we have a yawning icon? If I ever downgrade to 35's I will let you know my thoughts on them.

Why oh why some of you non-100 owners cannot admit these improvements.

I like some of the upgrades on the 100's, others changes I don't see as upgrades for my personal usage. The 100 is a better street rig, as any newer generation should be. When is your new 200 series coming, so we can look forward to "the 200's rule and everything else sucks" threads?

PS; If it's taking 45' longer to stop your 80, I would have it looked at by a competent tech!

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

PS; If it's taking 45' longer to stop your 80, I would have it looked at by a competent tech!

Obviously you have never been against a 100 in a situation like this.

 

[-Spike-]

Were both of these trucks that you compared brand new? If not, maintenance (quality and lack of) plays a part. The front rotors on the two trucks are the same diameter, don't know about the rears. The only difference is pad composition, and 100 pads fit on an 80, as well as many aftermarket options. This is a pointless debate. The numbers Kevin posted don't lie, and tire size will affect both systems equally. I have already acceded the 100 pads are better, but I don't have to buy a $20,000 truck to get them.

(Shotts) conveniently left out how 100 front diffs break like popcorn, ask how many steering racks and front suspension components he has replaced.

You do seem a bit 'memory challenged' when asked for any downside to a 100. It's a bit difficult to take you seriously when you are so obviously blindly biased.


-Spike

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

Were both of these trucks that you compared brand new? If not, maintenance (quality and lack of) plays a part. The front rotors on the two trucks are the same diameter, don't know about the rears. The only difference is pad composition, and 100 pads fit on an 80, as well as many aftermarket options. This is a pointless debate. The numbers Kevin posted don't lie, and tire size will affect both systems equally. I have already acceded the 100 pads are better, but I don't have to buy a $20,000 truck to get them.

-Spike

Ah.....are we driving stock Cruisers? The numbers are misleading. The 80 "system" can't keep up with the load the larger tires put onto it. Here's another scenario....engine torque:

0-60...my Rx8 vs a Mustang GT:

Drivers only....the race is CLOSE as can be.
Driver and 3 passengers....the Mustang eats me. The engine doesn't have the torque to keep the weight from dogging it while the big V8 does.
STOCK numbers do not represent all scenarios.

Spike....slapping 100 pads helps some. That's only one small part. This debate is pointless. What matters will be revealed if you just experience both. A 100 on 35's will bury an 80 on 35's with 100 pads. I've experienced it and others have seen it too.

Damn, next time we're togther let's do it! We'll drive down the road at 60 and have an un-drag race. YOU WON'T BELEIVE THE OUTCOME! Then no more debate (at least in AZ).

Seeing is believing! "Why" doesn't matter. "When something happens" is why you want a 100 unless it doesn't fit your needs.

 

[RHINO]

see i told ya its gonna be another one of those comparison "mine is better" threads,,,

 

[-Spike-]

see i told ya its gonna be another one of those comparison "mine is better" threads,,,

puss. I saw that edit.

-Spike

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

see i told ya its gonna be another one of those comparison "mine is better" threads,,, check this out mr shotts.. in all my life of driving i have never been in an accident, i have never had a ticket and i have never been accused of reckless driving. do i tally that up to my rig and its greatness in handling and braking? no, i tally it up to the fact that i'm not one of those stupid arse speeding, tailgating, talking an the cellphone while chicaning in and out of every lane on the road jerks that too many drivers have become these days. i'm not implying your driving habits reflect one of those "jerks" out there, but the fact that you put sooooo much on a little better stopping power makes me wonder.

p.s. i'm not a 100 hater, i'm just not a sheeple buying into the false sense of security. no matter what you drive there is something on the road bigger and heavier, safety is not in the vehicle its in the driver.

Well, dig this:

My wife rear ended somebody in our 1993. My kids said it wasn't here fault. "The truck just didn't stop Dad like your new one (100)".

As far as "mine is better"? You and some others have "selective memory". There's planty of times I've recommended an 80-series and for the same reasons I've owned two.

The bottom line comes down to what this guy's needs are. From post one it sounds like he might want to look into a 100 also. Until we know yea or nea, our posts can inform him.

For Spike and Kevin....they need 80's. Me, I need both. Some need a 100 or a 40 or 60.

Needs dictate what vehicle is best for THAT person, NOT which vehicle is superior to the other. For some reason, some go nuts when they keep hearing the vehicle they do not own (100) is superior to theirs in certain (or most) ways.

 

[RHINO]

naww it was too long winded,,, i'm no puss. see its right there for all to see.

shotts is a retard

see i said it,, and i say it cause while shotts makes valid points about safety and stuff he also has modified his rig from stock making it less safe than the factory intended and that negates his whole safety argument.

 

[RHINO]

Well, dig this:

My wife rear ended somebody in our 1993. My kids said it wasn't here fault. "The truck just didn't stop Dad like your new one (100)".

like i said, excessive speed and following too close. i know i know, the car in front stopped on a dime and even thought she was doing the speed limit and following 5 seconds behind that stupid piece of crap 80 just couldnt stop.

it really makes me wonder, how all these years in Phx traffic i have managed to not rear end any one in my under braked 37" tire 55.

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

naww it was too long winded,,, i'm no puss.

shotts is a retard

see i said it,, and i say it cause while shotts makes valid points about safety and stuff he also has modified his rig from stock making it less safe than the factory intended and that negates his whole safety argument.

Retard here. This makes about as much sense as I may have ever read on this forum. Modding a vehicle for four wheeling has nothing.......nevermind.

And damn! My LX450 that loses in the braking dept only has sliders and two timy bumpers. My 100 has....and weighs how much more than the Lx......awe.....nevermind.

Retard over and out.

Nope...back on again!

Damn! This reminds me of the accelleration war here in AZ. I had several AZ folks claim their TRD 80 could hang with a 100 in the speed dept. They swore I was full of it. So finally one day we did it.

We ran my 100, mis-geared by 35's so it had a 12% disadvantage.
We ran a equally equipped 80 with TRD S/C, 35's, AND 4.88 gears (10% gearing advantage for a 22% ratio total).

Winner at every speed we did? I won't even say because the disbelievers will get out the baseball bat and name calling again.