If you had the choice to buy a rear bumper again, would you?

[Nottajeep]

A rear bumper cost < body work. LOL

If you are going to drive anywhere near difficult trails you must armor up and a rear bumper is one of the major pieces of armor. You gotta pay to play.

Even on a simple outing , once you are on a trail most of the time your not turning around. now with that said you have to do some pretty good stuff to end up like this: (not me)



and not mind this look with zip ties.



What can I say , we were talking about rear ends and I had to bring Nick into the thread.

Now as a compare I always start out with price first , then function, then looks. For me I wanted to have bolt on features that I can swap on and off the arms. The only detail that didn't like I just fixed with the BIOR rear, is that it has open ends of the wings. (not the high clearance version) I like the way slee has his closed off and not open for mud and rocks.

I really needed a rear bumper as I seem to back into , drop , bang mine any where I can.

 

[paflytyer]

My .02,

I don't think it is fair to tear apart the components used by one vendor just because the other vendor says this or that is not as good as what I do. I don't think there has been independent side by side failure testing between the Slee and BIOR components? But even if there has, really are you going to take it to that level of failure?

That's exactly what I was trying to avoid. I didn't want to come off as bashing the BIOR bumper. I think it looks great. Again, there are parts of it that I really like and parts I don't. I like the idea of struts for opening and closing. But, I don't like how much force they have when opening.

I would have no problem spending my money with Mike and his products. Especially his skid plates. My point was there are differences in the two bumpers. The comment was made that they're basically the same bumper but for less money. I disagree with that and I can see where the extra cost comes from now. Where before, I couldn't. Does that mean that one bumper will fail before the other? Who knows? That also doesn't mean that I think one bumper is better than the other. It just means that they're not the same and one costs more because some of the internal components are more expensive to manufacture, and to some degree, a higher quality. Those costs are passed on to us.

As the consumer, I'm "ok" with the extra cost of a product if it can be explained where the extra costs stem from. For $2k+, I want to know what that gets me. The "whys and hows". If I'm spending that kind of money, I only want to do it once and not regret my decision. I could take my family on a nice vacation for the cost of a rear bumper.

I meant no ill will towards any product, just pointing out the differences that I myself would have easily missed.

I know Christo does excellent work and his stuff always has that extra beefiness to his products. I guess I would argue is it necessary in this case? Is it worth the extra cash between the two vendors to you mr. customer?

Stan is saying yes, I am saying no. At the end of the day, our opinion matters more, because we are the consumer.

Mike's craftsmanship really shows on his BIOR rear bumpers and it is a quality product. For me I just liked the BIOR better.

I have spent a great deal with Christo and really like his stuff, but this time I chose a different product that I felt was more of what I wanted.
I think it boils down to which one appeals to you more and where you want to spend your hard earned dollars.

Hope this helps your evaluation process.

Here is a perfect example of "if you ask two people the same question, you'll get two different answers". Neither is right or wrong, just different. You first need to decide if a rear bumper is the right mod for you, then you'll have to decide who to give your money to. Whatever one you buy, is the right one.

 

[macneill]

Without a doubt. However, being a new Dad, I would opt for not getting the spare tire carrier. It has become a bit of a PITA loading and unloading baby crap.

 

[Layonnn]

Dude, I need a set of these!

You could probably use any black plastic, the plastic from a black trashcan would even work. Tin snips make easy work out of it. Just make a template out of cardboard.

 

[Chris Sandstorm FJ]

You could probably use any black plastic, the plastic from a black trashcan would even work. Tin snips make easy work out of it. Just make a template out of cardboard.

Great idea. I have all that stuff laying about!

 

[LCAdvocate]

I would say the bumper is well worth it as long as you plan to keep your cruiser for a long time. It takes your rig to the next level of cool, but don't expect to get your money back if you sell the cruiser later.

Don't ever expect to get your money back from a depreciating asset. I've had the 4XLabs double swing out with tire, ladder, and can carrier attachment. It was a fine bumper - the service over there is an issue though.

I have another rig to outfit and the Slee and ARB products are just too hard to beat. It will be one those for the next front and rear bumpers.

 

[KlausVanWinkle]

No one has updated this comparison in awhile. I'm in the process of ordering a BIOR bolt on and routinely debate the purchase with Slee fan and owner SanDiegoCruiser. So these are the differences as I understand them.

Slee Bumper Advantages:

• Capped wheel well ends for stronger, more finished look
• 4 step powder coating procedure with media blasting and zinc epoxy coating
• Uses higher grade spindles
• Pins are larger and use stainless steel sleeves for less corrosion
• Welds are cleaner
• Tire carrier has 3 tire contact points
• More complex hi-lift mount
• Jerry can holder holds one more can
• True bolt on design
  
  Slee added:
• Supplied with easily removable spindle cap that unscrews.
• We offer custom machines plastic spindle caps with O-ring seal to cover unused spindles.
  
  
  

Slee Disadvantages:

• Cost
• No custom requests
• Bumper sticks out farther
• Glossier powder coating hairline scratches more easily
• Tire mount height isn't adjustable
• Need ladder to run jerry can mount
• Pins are on the spindles, requiring two handed opening
• No struts to assist opening.

BIOR Bumper Advantages:

• Cost
• Customizability
• Strut assisted opening
• Welded stoppers for swing outs
• Pins near latch for simpler opening
• Less overhang/increased departure angle
• Height adjustable tire carrier
• Ability to run just a jerry can holder sans ladder.
• More scratch resistant powder coating
• Non capped wheel wells easier to clean
• Trailer chain mounting points
• Modular second swing out carriers
• Optional steel powder coated spindle covers

BIOR Disadvantages:

• Less precise welds
• Pin sleeves can corrode (preventable with maintenance)
• Spindles not as strong (Fixed: new spindles are heavier duty)
• Gen 1 hardware was weak (Fixed: Gen 2 uses 10.9 Class and grade 8 hardware)
• Bolt on second swing out attachments less strong than welded
• More recessed Hitch hinders access
• Less finished looking end caps (Optional capped ends)
• Wasn't the first to build this style
• Hitch requires notching cross member
• Upper hi-lift mount is less secure
• Zinc epoxy priming is optional
• Capping wheel wells is optional

 

[paulbgardner]

So it's an advantage to have the wheel well ends capped and not capped?

What alloy steel is used on each? Less strong can be pretty relative if you don't give the yield strengths to compare. If the "weaker" steel has a yield strength of 100,000psi then there is really no need to even list steel alloy as an advantage or disadvantage.

 

[sleeoffroad]

Items are listed as pro's and con's and sometimes it is useful to know the reasons why certain design elements are chosen. So I am going to explain some of the items in the list so that people have an understanding of what the differences are.

Slee Bumper Advantages:

• Uses stronger steel

• 
  Not sure what they use, but we use regular A36 steel for the 100 series bumper.
  
  There might be some confusion on this since we do use grade 50 on our 80 series bumpers. We used to have it made from grade 80, but that has become really difficult to source. This might be where this
  
  

  [*]Pins use stainless steel sleeves

  
  Not only are they stainless but they are also larger than any of the off-the-shelve pins.

Slee Disadvantages:

• Cost
• No custom requests
• No trailer hitch chain mounts

• 
  
  We have now added slots to accommodate a screw together chain link for safety chains. See pic below.
  
  

  [*]Bumper sticks out farther/less departure angle

  
  I am not sure this is the case. The bottom of our bumper has a 45 degree angle and the back of that is against the cross member. So if you measured departure angle from there to the wheels I think you will find it is the same or close for ours compared to any other bumper where the cross member is retained.
  
  

  [*]Glossier powder coating scratches more easily

  
  If you are talking about stepping on it for example and getting small hairline scratches that you could see from a shoe or something then yes, but if you are talking about scratching on a rock, then I do not believe there are any differences.
  
  

  [*]Pins are on the spindles, requiring two handed opening

For this there is a very good reason. When you have the pin at the end of the swing-out by the latch it is not a 100 % fail safe when the latch pops open. If that happens the tire carrier arm can move up and down thus unseating the pin out of the hole and it will swing open. We had this happen early on when we did it that way on our 80 series bumpers. That is why we changed it to have it at the hub where there is zero chance of that happening. It is easy to say we don't need it, but we really don't want to pay for the bodywork on a rear quarter panel.

Here is also some other pros for our bumper. Not sure how the BIOR compares.

1. Supplied with LED license plate light
2. Supplied with easily removable spindle cap that unscrews.
3. We offer custom machines plastic spindle caps with O-ring seal to cover unused spindles.

 

[paflytyer]

No one has updated this comparison in awhile.

Somebody wrote an article for Toyota Trails recently that had some great bumper info just like this. One of the many benefits of being a TLCA member is its fine magazine content.

 

[Chris Sandstorm FJ]

BIOR
I don't think notching the crossbar is really a CON unless it is based on the labor, in that you have to do it...

Your notching it, not cutting the crossbar clean through and your mounting a giant steel cross member to it (the bumper), bolted on either ends, so essentially reinforcing the cross member with either bumper...

I wonder if it actually would save the vehicle from being totaled in a rear end collision, as it could create a point of failure/release vs. bending the frame down stream... Just a thought.

Slee
I think you might be able to get Christo's without a powder coat, so you could have powder coated with what ever you want..

I like the top cap to Slee's spindle cover vs. what I have on mine.



I think both are great products and you should save shipping by picking up in Colorado no matter the choice, so we can go wheeling with ya!

 

[KlausVanWinkle]

I am not sure this is the case. The bottom of our bumper has a 45 degree angle and the back of that is against the cross member. So if you measured departure angle from there to the wheels I think you will find it is the same or close for ours compared to any other bumper where the cross member is retained.

Great post. Thanks for the information.

I hadn't considered the 45 degree angle on the Slee. That's interesting.

BIOR
I don't think notching the crossbar is really a CON unless it is based on the labor, in that you have to do it...

I think both are great products and you should save shipping by picking up in Colorado no matter the choice, so we can go wheeling with ya!

WhiteElephant ran into the oem rear bumper on my last 100 going 5mph and dented the rear crossmember/bumper. So, personally, I don't have a lot of faith in the strength of that crossmember to begin with.

That'd cost more in gas than it costs to ship it! But a bunch of us will probably be your way this summer.

Somebody wrote an article for Toyota Trails recently that had some great bumper info just like this. One of the many benefits of being a TLCA member is its fine magazine content.

We're supposed to read those? Mine's still in the plastic bag.

 

[Nottajeep]

I have really enjoyed the Slee rear bumper.

There are some nits I have:
1) how the spare sidewall presses against the mount. Seems to leave an indent on the tire over time. (5 tire rotation)
So it makes me somewhat nervous of possible tire damage or a tire mfg finding it as an "out" for a warranty claim, should one come into question.
Slee offered up some foam padding but those failed to hold up when summer temps hit. Unless, I missed it somewhere, this is still an item that needs permanent solution.

2) the little red handles on the latch have turned pink over the last year. This is purely cosmetic, but pink is not preferred for Manly cruiser. So a better UVA resistant handle would be nice.

A third item would be safety chain hooks but it looks like that was finally addressed. (Just not on mine). I hope Slee also thinks about adding a location for trailer pin mount as mine is mounted at the bottom of my bumper and can drag on the trail. (I've already been in the board discussion about towing and the liability stuff, but since safety chains have been brought in, why not add the trailer pin mount?)

I also wanted to second the previous comments on Slee's welds. Solid, smooth and looks like 100% coverage. The pins and swingouts are still quite and smooth.
Still no rattles or vibrations.

Clearly, this is a piece worthy of putting on a durable land cruiser like the 100.

Beamed from my Galaxy 4 using IH8MUD to your computer screen

 

[sleeoffroad]

I have really enjoyed the Slee rear bumper.

There are some nits I have:
1) how the spare sidewall presses against the mount. Seems to leave an indent on the tire over time. (5 tire rotation)
So it makes me somewhat nervous of possible tire damage or a tire mfg finding it as an "out" for a warranty claim, should one come into question.
Slee offered up some foam padding but those failed to hold up when summer temps hit. Unless, I missed it somewhere, this is still an item that needs permanent solution.

I can send you some more of them if you need them. That clearance issue with the upright gusset to tire has been addressed. We now laser cut that piece with a curve to clear the tire. Easiest way we found to retro that is to grind the upright, but that obviously will damage the powder coat.

2) the little red handles on the latch have turned pink over the last year. This is purely cosmetic, but pink is not preferred for Manly cruiser. So a better UVA resistant handle would be nice.

The latch is always my nemesis. I so want a better latch that fits the bumper better, but coming up with a design that does not cost $100 per latch to produce is difficult.

I have seen people plastidip them.

A third item would be safety chain hooks but it looks like that was finally addressed. (Just not on mine). I hope Slee also thinks about adding a location for trailer pin mount as mine is mounted at the bottom of my bumper and can drag on the trail. (I've already been in the board discussion about towing and the liability stuff, but since safety chains have been brought in, why not add the trailer pin mount?)

If you are referring to a hole for a plug, then sorry, we are not going to do that, since there are so many different plug configurations. If you really want to install it on the face, a holesaw will make quick work of the hole you need, provided it fits the plug you use. Even if we did the big round hole, one would still have to drill the mounting holes.

We install the 7 pin connectors against the rear cross member on the inside. That way they are out of the way and don't get damaged.

 

[aaronrules]

I bought a Slee rear bumper the same time I bought my truck. I got the bumper about 2 months after recieving the truck. The one thing that has bugged me a little bit is the fact that it is a multi step process to get into the back If you have swing outs. This is seriously a tiny little complaint that speaks more about my laziness than it does about the bumper. I got the ladder and tire swingout. The ladder I got as a platform to modify to carry stuff. I am currently trying to figure out how to rig up a way to mount a bike rack off of it.

I almost got the ARB rear, and I love the idea of struts help open swingouts from the BIOR if that's the one that has it. But in the end, the Slee is bulletproof. The two step process to open the swingouts is idiotproof, I have driven off without latching the latches in the middle of the bumper and the pins held the swingouts inplace, even with a pretty damn heavy spare tire and Hi-Lift lack. The opening process of the bumper has become something that isn't that big of deal, and my 9 year old boy can do it all. He has even climbed all over the swingouts when they were open! That's a decent amount of stress on the pivot points, and the Slee held up like a champ!

I would absolutley repurchase the Slee rear bumper.

 

[cboyd]

I also have the Slee rear bumper. Installed by Slee when I was in Golden this past summer. I really like the bumper, the looks of it and the overall protection and functionality.

My only real complaint is the dual swing out. If there were in option for a single swing out where the spare tire was centered I would probably do that if I had to do it over again. I really like the dual set up, but for quick dashes into the rear hatch it can be problematic. Not so much for me but my wife and kids can't really operate the latches. More than once I've just stuck stuff through the side door when I really should've taken the time to open up the back. This really is just on daily driver activities... Which I don't do anymore. It's the adventure rig now, have a different daily driver.

For sheer off-road stuff, it can't be beaten in my opinion. I like that the tire is up high out-of-the-way. The departure angles are good and you can carry various configurations of stuff on the ladder rack. The height of the spare does create some issues with the rear blind spot for highway driving, but I've been able to manage that. My wife complained she can't see out the back at all... Definitely adding a backup camera on for that reason.

As for trailering, I have towed my Chaser with this twice now and have no real issues. Glad to see the new cutouts for the safety chains, I might have to retrofit mine for that. As for the hitch 7- pin connector, I almost drilled a hole for a flush mount connector, but after looking at it a couple more times, mounted it to the rear crossmember up high tucked underneath. I feel it is more protected there...

EDIT: oooh! I have the cut outs for the chains!! I didn't realize what they were for until Christo's comments on this thread! Thanks again MUD!

 

[Rigger]

I like Slee's rear bumper best. I'm saving up for one.

Actually, I'd like to ship my truck to Slee's shop, have his crew lift it, diff drop it, align it, slider it, stir in front and rear bumpers, and then I'd swing by, wave the fantastic plastic at 'em, and drive home with a big ole grin on my face!

 

[pcut]

I like Slee's rear bumper best. I'm saving up for one.

Actually, I'd like to ship my truck to Slee's shop, have his crew lift it, diff drop it, align it, slider it, stir in front and rear bumpers, and then I'd swing by, wave the fantastic plastic at 'em, and drive home with a big ole grin on my face!

Yup- that's exactly what I did- shipped the new-to-me 100 from south Texas to Christo and picked it up a couple of weeks later with bumpers(with dual swingouts) OME suspension, diff drop, winch, etc, etc. Love everything about it. The guys at Slee were extremely helpful and honest. They actually talked me out of doing a reservoir type shock based on my anticipated usage which saved me a bundle!
Thanks Christo and company!

 

[macneill]

TJM Rear Bumper

I'm meh about mine. Yeah, it was cheap, but it's rusted to hell. Got the RB8 before TJM left the states, also got the steel side bars from AU that fit the T-15, that I gave go my buddy to put on his 100, also rusted to hell.

 

[Nottajeep]

They actually talked me out of doing a reservoir type shock based on my anticipated usage which saved me a bundle!
Thanks Christo and company!

Please tell us more so I can be talked out of this.