ICON vs KING (My Experience) (1 Viewer)

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Joined
Mar 12, 2018
Threads
31
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684
Location
Doha Qatar
Disclaimer: My intention is to share my experience, and what worked best for my application and use. I am and will never claim to hate on a specific shock brand, and say one is better then the other overall and instead provide details of how they all performed in my testing and where they excel. Please take note before reading that this is my experience and with local spec cruisers.

What you have available might or might not have different characteristics. For instance I recently discovered that our cruisers here have a heavier front ends then the ones sold in the United States.

Please do share any thoughts, If you disagree with my information write down your arguments. Lets all learn from each other.

Pros and Cons List
{

KING Pros:

1. Progressive valving provides much better small bump compliance in small uneven terrain, washboard roads and corrugations.

2. Very simple design, easy to re valve, shims, spare parts are very abundant.

3. King shocks built from the ground up to fit the intended application. (Yes their are OEM kits available off the self, I highly do not recommend those since you dont want to end up revlaving it 100 times like I did.

KING Cons:

1. Progressive valving in some situations can cause more body roll, and is less stable in very big hits.

2. From my experience on different cruisers, King coil overs rarely provide a 2 inch lift, they almost always need to be re-springed to a heavier spring rate, and when that happens, ride quality suffers(to stiff). The solution for me was to build a longer coil over with the same soft spring rate(600lb).

3. King shocks off the shelf does not max out down travel, even with Uniball upper control arms, similar to the previous con the solution was to build a longer coilover.

ICON Pros:

1. Digressive valving provides a much more controlled feel, much less body roll. It also is much less likely to bottom out on big hits.

2. All the ICON shocks I have tried have provided more then enough lift (0-3.5 inch). The shocks have many extra preload threads to compensate for added weight and are built as long as possible of the shelf, this is a big bonus for me.

3. Similar to the previous pro, ICON coilovers always MAX out the CV angle, meaning they provide as much travel as possible when paired with Uniball upper control arms off the shelf.

ICON Cons:

1. Digressive valving suffers when it comes to small bump compliance resulting in a choppy ride. This is a major problem if the terrain you frequently traverse has washboard roads, or small uneven bumps.

*(In some situations this can be tuned out or reduced by deleting the sway bar, dropping the tire pressure significantly or revalving it but in my experience it did not do any good, I have tried many many times to get it tuned out however softening up the low end is no good because the digressive valving is meant to be controlled in that part of the stroke, you will end up screwing up the performance big time )*

2. More complex design, shims are very hard to swap out since they do not sell any of those online (to my knowledge, I have searched everywhere), and the shims are not stacked in order. Very hard to keep track of the valving. I had to contact my local vendor to get it revalved which is a pain in the ass since he is always busy and charges big time.

3. Does not treat orders as custom, this is a big No no for me, every application is different, every truck is different you cannot have a shock that is one size fits all. That does not make any sense. However if you try to get in contact you can get them to change certain elements of the shock. Similar to king their is a certain build time(2-8 weeks depending on seasonal demand).
}

My Current Preferred Setup:

1. King 3.0 Coilover with finned reservoirs (600lb x 14 spring), 2 inch lift. Revalved for heavier rebound, standard compression shims.

2. King 3.0 rear double bypass shock. (Adjusted for softest compression and medium rebound damping)

3. Stock rear coil springs with a 3cm spacer for extra up travel(maintains stock spring rate while having more travel).

This setup worked best for me because it maximizes small bump compliance and comfort while also being stable, however the ICON shocks provide much more stability(less bottoming out) but sacrifices comfort.

Advice:

1. Always use the softest spring possible without sag, to allow the shock to do the work. This will provide the best ride quality.

2. Always use the lightest rebound possible without unsettling the vehicle. To fast and the vehicle will get unsettled, To slow and you will not be able to use all of your travel. I usually stay on the heavier side since at high speeds the tire will already reach the other bump without the need to rebound, if in my scenario it was light the tire would drop before reaching the next bump causing the vehicle to unsettle.

3. (Shocks with reservoirs ) Always fill the shock with the right amount of nitrogen pressure. You want the shock to have enough nitrogen to prevent cavitation while minimizing rod force. Adding to much will increase rod force which makes the shock want to extend. This is not something you want.

That's all I can think of now, I might add some more information as I gain more experience and try out new things.
 
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What size Kings vs What size Icons?

I see you are now running 3.0s Kings f/r. It’s my understanding in general larger diameter shocks can be tuned for better bump compliance with more control. At least I have heard that about going up in size for Bilsteins and Icon 2.5 vs 3.0.

Just saying that comparing a 2.0 or 2.5 Icon to 3.0 King will be very different. 2.0 Icon behaves differently than 2.5 Icon, at least for 80s.
 
What size Kings vs What size Icons?

I see you are now running 3.0s Kings f/r. It’s my understanding in general larger diameter shocks can be tuned for better bump compliance with more control. At least I have heard that about going up in size for Bilsteins and Icon 2.5 vs 3.0.

Just saying that comparing a 2.0 or 2.5 Icon to 3.0 King will be very different. 2.0 Icon behaves differently than 2.5 Icon, at least for 80s.
That is a valid point sir. I have tried all sizes 2.5 Kings with different lengths, 2.5 icons with different lengths. I simply chose the 3.0 right now because I was curious on how it rides still knew to me. Apologies for not clarifying.



You mentioned 3.0s having better compliance tuning ? Sounds Intresting never knew about that.
 
Thanx for the writeup, very good information. Looking forward to hearing about your experience with the 3.0s.
 
Standard King Coilover 2.5 vs Standard Icon Coilover 2.5 Length. Icon takes the win here. To be fair King can build the coilover with the same length obviously. Of Course this is comparing standard sets(off the shelf).

IMG_4598.JPG
 
I think if I had to redo my decision again I would go custom progressive Kings but I think for non custom Icons does a decent job. I love my LC and usually don't like settling for second best. I wish this write up existed 6 months ago. I also use the stock spring and like it but it is less sport handling than my 100 with 1.5" ARB suspension. The Icons are good but I still feel things could have been better and I hate wishing for something more. I didn't want to lift the vehicle so I thought the Icons would work well enough in my application. I haven't tried bringing tire pressure down yet so maybe I am not being fair to the Icons. The car is much better than stock so I am not nitpicking and I like having coilovers as suspension feels like a new car even with 200k miles.
 
@ToyotaIsLife

Did the 3” Kings fit in the rear without modification to the mounts?
 
Awesome!

Running 3” custom Kings f/r, I take it you have no trouble keeping up with Raptors ;)
 
I just bought a 2013, right now it’s on BP-51s. I hope with Tundra arms and quality long travel 2.5” or 3.0” set up I’ll be able wheel with 80s in the rocks and run down Raptors.

(To be fair, the PO has already wheeled this 200 very hard in the rocks.). Still I believe there’s room to get more of the best of both worlds.
 
I just bought a 2013, right now it’s on BP-51s. I hope with Tundra arms and quality long travel 2.5” or 3.0” set up I’ll be able wheel with 80s in the rocks and run down Raptors.

(To be fair, the PO has already wheeled this 200 very hard in the rocks.). Still I believe there’s room to get more of the best of both worlds.

BP51's!, I am planning to try those out since they are internal bypass, but I would definitely not invest in it because of 2.0 piston diameter and little added travel from stock. Plus the progressive coilover spring rate is not the best when it comes to performance and ride consistency . That's why I always play with Icons and Kings. How do they ride?
 
Not sure what to say about BP-51s yet, I haven’t even put 100 miles on it yet. @TonyP could give a better answer.

I have very limited suspension experience: Stock 80 and 100, OME 80. No premium suspension experience yet. Soon will have Slinky with 2.5 Icons on an 80 though.

I have wanted a 200 for a long time, but I knew I didn’t like the mushy feel of stock ride of the few 200s I test drove. Definitely like the BP-51s better than that.

Me and especially my kids HATE the stock ride of a 100 I got a few years ago. I replaced the shocks with new OEM, still mushy. Their experience prior to that was an 80 with OME medium. They prefer a firmer ride through the corners.
 
Travel difference, dont have the numbers yet.

But to the trained eye you could easily tell the difference that the 16 inch coilover has over the 14. Out of the top of my head I would say 1+inches down, again nothing to confirm that yet.

(Focus on the down travel differences front and rear, this will help you differentiate )

14 Inch KING coilover. Uniball upper arms plus sway bar delete (nothing is limiting travel but the shock)

Travel Example.jpg


16 Inch KING coilover with STOCK upper arms! Sway bar is not deleted. (Apologies for the pixelated quality)

Travel Example 2.jpg
 
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Better example, nothing more the stock travel upfront. This is pissing me off, need to order a new set ASAP.

14 inch KING coilover

Travel.png
 
Last edited:
Disclaimer: My intention is to share my experience, and what worked best for my application and use. I am and will never claim to hate on a specific shock brand, and say one is better then the other overall and instead provide details of how they all performed in my testing and where they excel. Please take note before reading that this is my experience and with local spec cruisers.

What you have available might or might not have different characteristics. For instance I recently discovered that our cruisers here have a heavier front ends then the ones sold in the United States.

Please do share any thoughts, If you disagree with my information write down your arguments. Lets all learn from each other.

Pros and Cons List
{

KING Pros:

1. Progressive valving provides much better small bump compliance in small uneven terrain, washboard roads and corrugations.

2. Very simple design, easy to re valve, shims, spare parts are very abundant.

3. King shocks built from the ground up to fit the intended application. (Yes their are OEM kits available off the self, I highly do not recommend those since you dont want to end up revlaving it 100 times like I did.

KING Cons:

1. Progressive valving in some situations can cause more body roll, and is less stable in very big hits.

2. From my experience on different cruisers, King coil overs rarely provide a 2 inch lift, they almost always need to be re-springed to a heavier spring rate, and when that happens, ride quality suffers(to stiff). The solution for me was to build a longer coil over with the same soft spring rate(600lb).

3. King shocks off the shelf does not max out down travel, even with Uniball upper control arms, similar to the previous con the solution was to build a longer coilover.

ICON Pros:

1. Digressive valving provides a much more controlled feel, much less body roll. It also is much less likely to bottom out on big hits.

2. All the ICON shocks I have tried have provided more then enough lift (0-3.5 inch). The shocks have many extra preload threads to compensate for added weight and are built as long as possible of the shelf, this is a big bonus for me.

3. Similar to the previous pro, ICON coilovers always MAX out the CV angle, meaning they provide as much travel as possible when paired with Uniball upper control arms off the shelf.

ICON Cons:

1. Digressive valving suffers when it comes to small bump compliance resulting in a choppy ride. This is a major problem if the terrain you frequently traverse has washboard roads, or small uneven bumps.

*(In some situations this can be tuned out or reduced by deleting the sway bar, dropping the tire pressure significantly or revalving it but in my experience it did not do any good, I have tried many many times to get it tuned out however softening up the low end is no good because the digressive valving is meant to be controlled in that part of the stroke, you will end up screwing up the performance big time )*

2. More complex design, shims are very hard to swap out since they do not sell any of those online (to my knowledge, I have searched everywhere), and the shims are not stacked in order. Very hard to keep track of the valving. I had to contact my local vendor to get it revalved which is a pain in the ass since he is always busy and charges big time.

3. Does not treat orders as custom, this is a big No no for me, every application is different, every truck is different you cannot have a shock that is one size fits all. That does not make any sense. However if you try to get in contact you can get them to change certain elements of the shock. Similar to king their is a certain build time(2-8 weeks depending on seasonal demand).
}

My Current Preferred Setup:

1. King 3.0 Coilover with finned reservoirs (600lb x 14 spring), 2 inch lift. Revalved for heavier rebound, standard compression shims.

2. King 3.0 rear double bypass shock. (Adjusted for softest compression and medium rebound damping)

3. Stock rear coil springs with a 3cm spacer for extra up travel(maintains stock spring rate while having more travel).

This setup worked best for me because it maximizes small bump compliance and comfort while also being stable, however the ICON shocks provide much more stability(less bottoming out) but sacrifices comfort.

Advice:

1. Always use the softest spring possible without sag, to allow the shock to do the work. This will provide the best ride quality.

2. Always use the lightest rebound possible without unsettling the vehicle. To fast and the vehicle will get unsettled, To slow and you will not be able to use all of your travel. I usually stay on the heavier side since at high speeds the tire will already reach the other bump without the need to rebound, if in my scenario it was light the tire would drop before reaching the next bump causing the vehicle to unsettle.

3. (Shocks with reservoirs ) Always fill the shock with the right amount of nitrogen pressure. You want the shock to have enough nitrogen to prevent cavitation while minimizing rod force. Adding to much will increase rod force which makes the shock want to extend. This is not something you want.

That's all I can think of now, I might add some more information as I gain more experience and try out new things.
Wow, great feedback. Many thanks!
 
This board is going to cost me so much da#$ed money . . . and I love it :D
 

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