I have a confession to make (re trans/t-case fluids)

[Arya Ebrahimi]

Alright, sounds like I'll do the drain and fill routine. Any particular brand/spec of fluid recommended for my high mileage tranny?

Thanks guys!

 

[97 FZJ80]

I use Mobile 1 ATF. I haven't seen any other brands of synthetic ATF in my local auto parts store.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Alright, sounds like I'll do the drain and fill routine. Any particular brand/spec of fluid recommended for my high mileage tranny?

Thanks guys!

It has a ton of miles, so I'd stay with conventional. Costco carries cases of Chevron MD3 ATF at a good price. Do a couple of drain/fills. While you're at it, use some of the ATF to change the power steering as well. You will be impressed with the immediate "smoothing: of the shifts with new fluid.

The t-case may be the one place to use synthetic. You only need 2 quarts, and Mobil1 75w-90 is available everywhere.

 

[EricE]

Change the fluid with no worries. I neglected mine for 60K or so (prior to that I have no idea if it was ever done by the PO) and then did a full fluid flush with new. No issues for at least 20K afterwards. Still going strong.

 

[cary]

All this released buildup will then be captured by the trans filter of most vehicles. If the fluid has gone neglected long enough, it can possibly release enough to plug the trans filter which will starve the transmission of lubricant, and obviously leads to transmission failure. Mr. T uses a screen in the transmission of your 80 instead of a fine filter, which avoids the filter plugging issue.

Bingo. The problem arises because people don't change the fluid forever and then go get a flush or drain and fill but don't change the filter. So you have a filter that is already full of crap and now gets even more crap in it. Unlike an engine oil filter, transmission filters (on cars and light trucks) are put on the end of the pickup for the oil pump. Because of this, when they get plugged, they cannot go into a bypass mode which leads to the starvation.

Toyota was very smart in using the transmission screen that cleans itself when you drain the fluid (it self backflushes). There is no need to change a filter, and because they have a drain plug, transmission servicing becomes a 15 minute, 4-5 quart deal every 30k miles. Because there is no filter to plug, even when the oil change is done on a severely neglected tranny there is little chance of failure.

As far as "lifetime" transmission fluids, that is a falicy. BMW went this route and after about 5 years retreated to 100k intervals (and they are using $15 quart specialized synthetic ATF). They did this because of a high failure rate of transmissions. I just had the fluid and filter changed on my Wife's X5 at 90k miles, it was dirty and used up. I can also see why many people don't change the filter, the thing costs $100, + 2 hours of labor + $100 in fluid ends up being a $400 tranny service. Expensive and a place people will cut corners when trying to save money. IMHO still cheaper than the $3500-4000 for a new tranny.

 

[cary]

If you aren't having any problems with the ATF and its clean and not burned. I would say you don't really need to change it. Same thing with x-fer case oil.

245k miles on original ATF/transfer case oil in our 80.

275k miles on original ATF/transfer case oil in my dad's old 62. (sold now)

No problems with either.

I've changed the AT fluid in my 62 multiple times, but have had to because of overheating etc.

People on this board tend to be maintenance crazy.

This is like saying, "hey I eat cheeseburgers, pizza and french fries for every meal, smoke 2 packs a day, and drink like Mikey Rubicon, I'm 60 and doing fine, that whole eating healthy and taking care of yourself is a sham." For some people, they can have those habits and live a long life, for most, it will result in an early death.

There will always be outliers in every group, but this is a foolish strategy, that on average will result in early transmission failure.

 

[EricG]

One more datapoint - I was having some problems with the transmission on my truck (93, ~140K at the time) missing the passing gear downshift. In other words, when it went to kick down, it wouldn't engage at all and the engine would race - taking your foot off the gas would let it hook up again.

A transmission fluid change, using the FAQ procedure, has all but eliminated this problem. On very rare occasions the engine revs slighly during the kickdown, but it engages without having to take your foot off the gas. I'm now at about 160K and have towed pretty heavy recently withg no problems. So I'm a big fan of changing the fluid.

 

[tomatopants]

Hell, even I've had it changed since I bought it 15k miles ago.

Of course, it accidentally got drained the first time I changed my oil myself.


But I've even had it changed since then. I'm going to switch over to synthetic fluids in a short while, too.


I figure if the fluid isn't red, it's not good.



Pull the dipstick every once in a while, see what color it is, if it's blackish/brownish/not reddish, it needs to be changed.



And to check it, you need to pull the dipstick after driving for a while. Like. Not just to the grocery store and back. I mean drive for a half hour or longer at a good speed. And leave the engine on while you pull out the dipstick and make sure it's where it needs to be.

 

[corsair23]

My experience:

'97 LX450 w/ ~95K miles on it at purchase - ATF was black and probably original. Did a complete home DIY ATF change out (20 qts). 4+ months and ~5K later no issues. On a side note I also did not notice any significant change in how the LX shifted, just had the peace of mind that the ATF was fresh and doing it's job.

'97 FZJ80 w/ ~94K miles on it at purchase - ATF was bright red and appeared fresh. Did the 4qt drain and fill. No problems ~4K miles later and again no noticeable change in shifting.

My ongoing PM plan is to do the 4qt drain and fill on both the LX and the 80 once per year. Probably overkill but 90+% of both rigs annual mileage (~10K/year) is city driving with a lot of stop and go.

I use the Valvoline Max Life ATF that was recommended to me...Hopefully it is a good ATF as it among the readily available ATFs around here

 

[Truckasaurus]

I wholeheartedly recommend draining and re-filling the transmission. Regardless of whether you try to pump and re-fill 20 quarts or not, definitely remove the drain plug, and allow the accumulated "solids" to drain out of the bottom of the pan. I've drained via the pan 2-3 times, and after taking the drippings to the local Auto Zone, have seen a little silver 'dust' in the bottom of my drain pan. While I don't think these are actually "flowing" throughout the system (they're heavier, and have settled into the bottom of the pan), why not get 'em outta there anyway. I consider these to be normal remnants of use and every day wear and tear, so I'm not worried about WHAT the are, as much as I'd prefer they weren't IN the system.

My $0.02.

 

[Arya Ebrahimi]

Well I did the drain and fill on the trans today. Fluid coming out looked ok, but as I ran my fingers through the stream, I could feel a slight amount of grittyness in it. I suppose that's the gunk from the screen getting cleaned out. I did notice an ever so slight improvement in shifts today. They were not bad before, but they are not as abrupt now, much smoother.

I also flushed the PS fluid and man what a difference. The stuff that came out looked like very well used 40 weight, not ATF. I remember boiling over the PS fluid 2 summers ago when I got stuck really bad and sustained 4500 rpms in reverse while sawing the wheel back and forth. I had intended to change it shortly after that, but never got to it. Now it's smooth as silk and the groaning I had before has completely dissappeared. It was also VERY easy. I just followed the write-up in the FAQ and it was stupid easy. Only took 20 mins. If I'd have known it was this easy/quick I would have done it a long long time ago.

Ary

 

[IdahoDoug]

Arya,

The gunk from the screen does not get cleaned out by a drain and fill - only by dropping the tranny pan and manually cleaning the permanent metal filter screen in there. The fresh additives may/will in fact slowly loosen gunk from elsewhere in the tranny and begin depositing it on the screen. That's one reason I suggest paying a Toyota dealer to clean the filter and re-FIPG the tranny pan back on for you after a few months to a year of using newer fluid. Just be excruciatingly clear that you DO NOT want a flush as everybody now packages this as a full tranny service where all trannies that have the filter cleaned get a flush at the same time.

DougM

 

[Arya Ebrahimi]

Arya,

The gunk from the screen does not get cleaned out by a drain and fill - only by dropping the tranny pan and manually cleaning the permanent metal filter screen in there. The fresh additives may/will in fact slowly loosen gunk from elsewhere in the tranny and begin depositing it on the screen. That's one reason I suggest paying a Toyota dealer to clean the filter and re-FIPG the tranny pan back on for you after a few months to a year of using newer fluid. Just be excruciatingly clear that you DO NOT want a flush as everybody now packages this as a full tranny service where all trannies that have the filter cleaned get a flush at the same time.

DougM

Is it really that much of a PITA that it's worth paying the dealer to do? I'm not an expert mechanic, but I like to think I'm reasonably capable. I just completed a head gasket/timing chain R&R on my 22RE, and the dang thing runs, so I can't be a complete buffoon.

Ary

 

[whodat]

Is it really that much of a PITA that it's worth paying the dealer to do? I'm not an expert mechanic, but I like to think I'm reasonably capable. I just completed a head gasket/timing chain R&R on my 22RE, and the dang thing runs, so I can't be a complete buffoon.

Ary

I did it with the help of the FSM and I am a 1 guy.

I chose to replace the whole pan because the drain bolt was stripped.

very easy and straightforward...just a little messy because the atf will keep dripping out of the tranny for DAYS if you let it.

I replaced the filter while I was in there...(did not want to clean it)

 

[Lka1988]

Arya,

The gunk from the screen does not get cleaned out by a drain and fill - only by dropping the tranny pan and manually cleaning the permanent metal filter screen in there. The fresh additives may/will in fact slowly loosen gunk from elsewhere in the tranny and begin depositing it on the screen. That's one reason I suggest paying a Toyota dealer to clean the filter and re-FIPG the tranny pan back on for you after a few months to a year of using newer fluid. Just be excruciatingly clear that you DO NOT want a flush as everybody now packages this as a full tranny service where all trannies that have the filter cleaned get a flush at the same time.

DougM

Just to be clear....the screen is removable, right?

 

[whodat]

Just to be clear....the screen is removable, right?

The filter that has the screen is removable...then cleaned. Or replaced.