I guess this explains the hard-starting on my B diesel!

[herbs]

Had a look at mine and it's only got 2 loops in the resistive coil, compared to the items for the B motors shown above. Not sure that it's ever worked, the coil still has dune beige paint all over it, the nuts are rusted up though.

 

[rockcrawler]

You will need 240mm of B&S 15 (1.45mm) nichrome. Form over 8mm drill bit, 6 loops.

 

[lostmarbles]

Couple of questions here, are the controllers still available new and does the H diesel use the same 8.5 V plugs? (but 2 more of them) The controller on mine doesn't work and erm......there's bare copper attached to one of the terminals. That's kinda bad.

Have a look at this site in your country:

Controller, glow plug. 12v - Offroad Shop

Here they say they have your controller (HJ45) and mine too (BJ40) available.

Can I suggest you try them and report back.

But I recently tried to get (ordered and paid for) an FD Voltage Regulator (for my BJ40) from the same company - They refunded my money a few days later saying they couldn't supply it (with apologies).

This is a picture their site displayed then - but I see they've recently removed these pictures:
View attachment 354658

And this is what I tried buying a week or so ago:
View attachment 354659

And YES. Your HJ45 takes the same 8.5V plugs:

View attachment 354663

 

[lostmarbles]

You will need 240mm of B&S 15 (1.45mm) nichrome. Form over 8mm drill bit, 6 loops.

Wow! Are you sure Alex? Is that length, type, rating, and no. of coils accurate for a "12Volt 6 x 8.5Vplug cruiser?

Of course a 6-plug engine must require a different coil resistance to a 4 cylinder. And I'm trying to get my head around this. Hmmmm. The combination of 6 parallel-connected plugs would have a lower overall resistance and thus would promote higher current flow through the glow controller. So I guess this would tend to burn out a 4-cylinder controller. From this line of thinking ....I guess a 6-cylinder controller would need thicker wire (or less turns of wire) in order to produce the SAME voltage drop from the higher 6-plug current.

If you have this sort of data at your fingertips, can you give us the same details for our "12Volt 4 x 8.5Vplug versions"

PS. I understand our BJ40 controllers glow more clearly/brightly than the more-enclosed BJ42 controllers (where four 8.5V plugs are also used .... in BJ42s that date from around 1980 to 1982).

And nanocr87 sent me a photo of his BJ40 controller glowing just as well as mine does (once he got the right plugs fitted).



PS. The reason I'm quite fussy about the Brand of glowplug I choose for my BJ40 is because I know the resistance of my glowplugs MUST match my existing glow controller properly. Too much resistance and it won't glow brightly. Too little resitance and it is likely to melt.
I think cruisers with other types of glow systems may not be so sensitive to having "OEM spec plugs" --- and so their owners can probably experiment more freely with cheap plugs that are sourced from emerging manufacturers (without such a high risk involved).

PPS. Great thread...............Lots of good stuff here.

 

[Henry James the 47th]

"PS. I understand our BJ40 controllers glow more clearly/brightly than the more-enclosed BJ42 controllers (where four 8.5V plugs are also used .... in BJ42s that date from around 1980 to 1982). "

Well, that's curious - I have the fully-enclosed controller (new as of last year) on my truck Tom, and it glows just as bright as yours.

i think Falco80's anemic glow at the controller relates to his use of the 8v plugs. It could only glow warmly in that set up, but not to the correct cherry red zone. I suspect that when he fits 8.5v. plugs, the controller will glow as it should.

 

[lostmarbles]

...Well, that's curious - I have the fully-enclosed controller (new as of last year) on my truck Tom, and it glows just as bright as yours.....

Cool.

Thanks Chris.

Glad to hear that I'm WRONG here.

It is probably the lack of pictures of "brightly glowing enclosed-type controllers" (on MUD) that brought me to the incorrect conclusion that they were unable to glow as brightly.

And your "re-education" makes me particularly happy because I bought that BJ42 controller as a spare for my existing BJ40 controller.

I know Joe Egolf has never managed to get his 1982 BJ42 glow controller to glow properly and this is another reason for my previous doubt.

 

[Henry James the 47th]

You know, this entire thread leads me to wonder how many people are driving around with the wrong glowplugs in their truck, perhaps due to errors such as you have found in both Roodogs sales material and EPC databases Tom.

Particularly in warmer climates, where glow is less critical to clean starting, and shorter glow cycles would appear to most to 'do the job'. Indeed, the use of 8v plugs instead of 8.5v plugs would seem very similar, and if you never had the correct plugs in place, how would you know - hit glow, wait a while, and start the truck - everything would seem good. In time, the fact that the 8v plugs would be glowing a little bit hotter for the given glow period, plus perhaps the odd longer glow period in the winter months, would eventually lead to the premature glow plug failure and anemic glow controller performance.

I remember when I ran 10.5v plugs in my rig, thinking they were the right ones - after 45 seconds the glow controller was barely glowing, and I suspect the plugs were similarly barely glowing too. in a warm climate it might 'work', but not in a cold one.

hmm - now wait a minute! If my controller was barely coming on when I used plugs of a higher than rated voltage, I would thing that Falco80 and his slightly lower voltage plugs, with all glow plugs firing, would have a controller glowing very red very fast.

 

[rockcrawler]

Wow! Are you sure Alex? Is that length, type, rating, and no. of coils accurate for a "12Volt 6 x 8.5Vplug cruiser?

Of course a 6-plug engine must require a different coil resistance to a 4 cylinder. And I'm trying to get my head around this. Hmmmm. The combination of 6 parallel-connected plugs would have a lower overall resistance and thus would promote higher current flow through the glow controller. So I guess this would tend to burn out a 4-cylinder controller. From this line of thinking ....I guess a 6-cylinder controller would need thicker wire (or less turns of wire) in order to produce the SAME voltage drop from the higher 6-plug current.

If you have this sort of data at your fingertips, can you give us the same details for our "12Volt 4 x 8.5Vplug versions"

PS. I understand our BJ40 controllers glow more clearly/brightly than the more-enclosed BJ42 controllers (where four 8.5V plugs are also used .... in BJ42s that date from around 1980 to 1982).

And nanocr87 sent me a photo of his BJ40 controller glowing just as well as mine does (once he got the right plugs fitted).



PS. The reason I'm quite fussy about the Brand of glowplug I choose for my BJ40 is because I know the resistance of my glowplugs MUST match my existing glow controller properly. Too much resistance and it won't glow brightly. Too little resitance and it is likely to melt.
I think cruisers with other types of glow systems may not be so sensitive to having "OEM spec plugs" --- and so their owners can probably experiment more freely with cheap plugs that are sourced from emerging manufacturers (without such a high risk involved).

PPS. Great thread...............Lots of good stuff here.

Sorry, that's what it would be for our BJ40's Tom, just realized herbs has a 42.
The way I worked this out was by measuring the thickness of my controller resistor wire and cross referencing a B&S nichrome wire chart. Then I formed a similar coil out of copper to work out the total length and checked that the resistance would match, which it does, 0.05 ohm (you'll need a good meter to measure this).

 

[lostmarbles]

...this entire thread leads me to wonder how many people are driving around with the wrong glowplugs in their truck....

From what I see, owners of early 12 volt BJ42 3B-powered cruisers are probably in the worst position Chris. (That's August 1980 to October 1982 models.)

The Toyota EPC wrongly lists their plugs as being 6V (but at least it gives the part number for the correct 8.5V plugs). And it is always rare to see an eBay seller listing the correct plugs for these cruisers. (Heck -Even reputable plug manufacturers continually list the wrong plugs for these cruisers too!)

But then BJ40 and BJ42 models are in "my limited field of interest/experience". So perhaps the problem is indeed much more widespread but I'm just not aware of it.

... I would thing that Falco80 and his slightly lower voltage plugs, with all glow plugs firing, would have a controller glowing very red very fast.

I agree that the 8V plugs would tend to make his glow controller glow more brightly.



PS. I was rather surprised to find Roodogs listing those 8V plugs for a BJ40. I think it must be a relatively recent error because the usual mix-ups I've noticed in the past are with 6V or 10.5V plugs being offered (which are more understandable errors).
And I didn't even know the 8V plugs were used in a 73/74 HJ45 until looking it up in the EPC for this thread. - So the 8V plug part number was hitherto completely unfamiliar to me and stood out like a sore thumb!

 

[lostmarbles]

Sorry, that's what it would be for our BJ40's Tom, just realized herbs has a 42.
The way I worked this out was by measuring the thickness of my controller resistor wire and cross referencing a B&S nichrome wire chart. Then I formed a similar coil out of copper to work out the total length and checked that the resistance would match, which it does, 0.05 ohm (you'll need a good meter to measure this).

My bad Alex (See- I'm learning to speak like those on the "upside-down part of the world" .)

I didn't notice Herbs had a BJ42. I was looking at his HJ45 in his signature line and obviously didn't read as far as his BJ42.

So now I don't know which controller he's referring to! (4 cylinder or 6?)

(but if it was the 42 - the coil should be the same as our 40 models!)

Edit...... But thinking about it more.... His BJ42 is a 1983 model so that should be superglow with 6V plugs and sadly missing one of our valuable glow controllers.... So I think he must be talking about his HJ45!!!!!! Which is a 6 cylinder .... so it will need 4 turns of that wire instead of 6 (I think! - Not sure! ............I'm no electrical expert! ....Second thoughts - Probably need thicker wire AS WELL AS fewer turns of it!)

 

[rockcrawler]

I do have a book on forming nichrome resistors somewhere (my problem is I have too many books!) but the calculations on that are referenced to heat, not amount of "glow". In any case it's not rocket science with something like this, so it could just be worked out empirically with some experimentation quite easily.
Re herbs, now I'm as confused as you hehe

 

[herbs]

Gee been a flurry of activity in this thread. Yeah I was asking about the glow system in my hj 45, my '83 bj 42 has an almost totally functioning superglow system (save for the heater in the thermostat housing, but I digress)

The glow plug controller for the H motor only has 2 turns of wire compared to the many more in the B/3B items. There's been a serious amount of current applied to it at some stage because the insulation of the wires on it has burnt off - 3 inches of bare copper in behind my dash. I wonder if the wrong glow plugs have been put in and it's cooked the terminals on the controller?

 

[rockcrawler]

...There's been a serious amount of current applied to it at some stage because the insulation of the wires on it has burnt off...

Could have been a short from the terminal bolts to the case. If its anything like the BJ40 controller then careless reassembly could quite easily create fireworks.

 

[dkroth]

My 1982 BJ42 came with Champion CH-121 glow plugs, which are 8.5V. I replaced them (one was bad) with NGK 7227 Y-128T which are also 8.5V that I sourced from a shop in England.

If I look up my truck on toyodiy.com, I get part number 19850-68030 which has a description that includes, "12V - 6v". Of course, I have a 12V electrical system.

I'm pretty sure I got my part info from some of the parts threads here on Mud, because I don't recall having to deal with the 6V-8V-8.5V issue.

I have a voltmeter in my truck. When I glow, the voltage drops to about 10.75 - 11.0V. I can get a decent glow in the controller after 20 - 22 seconds. Still, sometimes it starts better than others.

 

[Henry James the 47th]

Well, if your truck was made on 10/82 or later, it would probably have the Superglow system, and 6v plugs would be the ones to get. You can tell if you have Superglow by the presence of 2 glow relays, a main and a sub, and the lack of a glow controller on the dash (replaced by a glow light). Additionally, there is a glow timer in a Superglow set up, and a current sensor and resistor attached to the intake manifold. If your 1982 truck is made before 10/82, then you would have the slow glow system with glow controller and 8.5v. plugs would be correct for that, and a 10~20 second glow period normal.

 

[dkroth]

Well, if your truck was made on 10/82 or later...

Noob question/thread hijack: where is the date of manufacture on the truck? My vin plate is in good condition, but doesn't list it. There's a silver sticker inside the right door jamb, but it's completely blank. Is there another plate I'm missing?

 

[lostmarbles]

Noob question/thread hijack: where is the date of manufacture on the truck? My vin plate is in good condition, but doesn't list it. There's a silver sticker inside the right door jamb, but it's completely blank. Is there another plate I'm missing?

Good question. In my experience it can be hard to pinpoint your vehicle's "official build month". (The "build year" shouldn't be too hard though.)

My original wheels give me a clue .... They were made in August 1979 and are all stamped with this information on the split-rims:



And my engine has a plate on the tappet/valve cover giving my engine "compliance approval date" as July 1979:



And there was an "Australian Standards Plate" (that I've since removed) on my LH inner guard/fender that showed it complied with Australian Standards in September 1979. (So it won't have been sold till at least Sept 1979 I imagine.)

But I now accept my official build date as "July 1979".

Here is the EPC with my VIN details loaded in. (I've blanked out my VIN number.)



I think I settled on the "July official build date" because if I put some vehicle details in - the EPC can come up with others by itself. And I seem to remember it keeps coming up with July for me. (Perhaps one of those Internet EPC sites will alllow you to do this too?)

 

[Henry James the 47th]

To add to what Tom mentioned,

North American trucks have an aluminum GVW plate on the inside driver's door pillar which provides the build date.

I determined the build date for my HJ47 using a Russian website which used to list all the 40 series models and their production numbers, month to month, however this page is no longer on the web. I did print the page for HJ47 production and it's in my files.

Anyone with an HJ47 who wants to know their production month, and how many were made that month, can PM me with their chassis number and I'll provide the info.

 

[Falco80]

Wow, this has turned into an epic thread. I picked up my new glow plugs today. Got a set of Bosch 8.5v GPT-208 plugs. They look like they are very slightly longer but i hope these work out. Going to go fit them right now....

 

[herbs]

This is what can happen to your glow controller when it decides to go bad.......