Harsher ride quality than expected - 2019 Land Cruiser, 86k miles

[mountainsandskis]

Howdy all - I recently bought a 2019 Land Cruiser from a Toyota dealer. It’s Gold CPO at 81k miles in excellent condition. It’s now at 86k and in Colorado (potholes, mountains, construction) the ride feels off.

Over bumps, cracks, and road texture I get a pretty harsh transfer into the cabin. I feel like I can feel every single bump. It’s not bouncy or floating afterward, but it’s more than “unaffected.” Based on how everyone talks about it, I thought the ride might be a bit more plush than I’m finding it.

Setup:

• Tires: Toyo Open Country A/T III LT275/65R18 Load Range C

• Have run between 37 and 40 PSI cold unloaded

• Shocks: Dealer + independent inspection — no leaks, bounce test passes, “within spec.”

• Stock height, KDSS, no mods.

I recognize this is a body on frame heavy SUV, but I’ve constantly heard about it driving “plush”. For context, I came from a 5th gen 4Runner and I’m not finding it much better than that beyond body roll due to KDSS.

So is this normal for a 200 with LT C-rated tires at 86k on rough roads, or should it still feel more isolated? Anyone running these same Toyos (or similar LTs) and found a better pressure sweet spot? Did an OEM Bilstein refresh at ~80-100k (even with no leak) noticeably improve small-bump harshness? Worth it for daily comfort?

Happy to share more details. Thanks!

 

[Sandroad]

Why not experiment with some different tire pressures? I strongly suggest different tires before investing in aftermarket suspension. Perhaps a non-LT tire with more of a comfort/road focus?

 

[Heckraiser]

Others will tell you different, but 40psi is too high for ride comfort if you're not towing. Let some air out and see how it does. Was your 4runner on LT tires or SL tires?

 

[Sandroad]

Others will tell you different, but 40psi is too high for ride comfort if you're not towing. Let some air out and see how it does. Was your 4runner on LT tires or SL tires?

I agree. 40 psi can cause all the effects described. OEM size in non-LT run at 33. Tires are always a set of compromises and it sounds like the OP wants to focus on comfort. And of course one person’s “plush” is another person’s “butt-buster”.

 

[TheIcemanCometh]

I run that size of tire and as noted the RCTP is 33 psi.

 

[dudemancool1904]

Definitely the tires. My truck was gold cpo blah blah 61k miles and with HT’s it rode like a Cadillac.

 

[mountainsandskis]

Why not experiment with some different tire pressures? I strongly suggest different tires before investing in aftermarket suspension. Perhaps a non-LT tire with more of a comfort/road focus?

I bought it with Michelin Defenders from the factory and they were definitely softer, but not by that much. I still felt the over reactive sensation over bumps that I’m describing.

For my tire size (275/65/r18, so a bit narrower but taller than stock) What psi should I run?

 

[mountainsandskis]

Definitely the tires. My truck was gold cpo blah blah 61k miles and with HT’s it rode like a Cadillac.

Interesting - what are HTs sorry? Highway tires? I used to have Michelin Defenders when I bought the vehicle and they certainly were smoother but I wouldn't necessarily say it drove like a Cadillac.

 

[mountainsandskis]

I run that size of tire and as noted the RCTP is 33 psi.

Right but that is the recommended tire pressure for the stock size tire. The size I have are a bit narrower and taller, and plus they're C-rated, so I'm wondering if that means that I need to have a higher tire pressure.

I've looked into load tables and all that sort of stuff and it seems to recommend as high as 40 or 45 psi if I've got weight in the truck.

 

[dms]

Try 33-35psi. If you still think it rides like a F350, get Michelin Defenders.

 

[TeCKis300]

Just confirming but it's on factory suspension? Factory springs? Is there any suspicion this vehicle has been modified before with aftermarket suspension?

Yes, the tires can definitely play a role in this and 275s aren't a great size if prioritizing ride quality as it tends to need more pressure for the same loads. Play with the inflation pressure and there is margin to try lower pressures though understand that if you're going to be laden with gear, you do need to increase the pressure.

I ask about potential prior mods as some shops will install suspension and torque all the control arm bolts with suspension and full droop which preloads the bushings such that it can very much impact ride quality.too.

 

[bloc]

Mine does the same thing over specific road imperfection shapes and has for the 130k+ I've owned it. This was through stock suspension, king 2.5s, and back to stock. On stock dunlops, E-load KO2s, LT-C open country AT3s, XL AT3s, defender 2s. The kings made a huge difference in overall body control and suspension capability, but they didn't change this quirk in a meaningful way.

It's a little tough to describe but for me has the most to do with the shape of the imperfection. If it's 1-2" tall with a sharp-ish edge, or even more specifically a slight dip that goes across the whole road getting the wheels on both sides of the rig (like they trenched for utilities then did a poor job refilling and smoothing the pavement), so the wheels move down then back up.. it is a much sharper shudder through the vehicle than I'd expect given the way the suspension acts in other instances.

Said another way, a slightly upward protruding manhole cover isn't a problem, but one sunk below the road surface the same amount triggers a much harsher response.

Over the years I've chalked this up to a heavy rear axle.. or possibly body mounts having sagged with the result being more NVH making it into the cab than intended. One day I want to find a way to quantify this body mount sag and compare to other users with 2021 that should have seen less miles and time.. but that's not high on the priority list.

 

[TheIcemanCometh]

Right but that is the recommended tire pressure for the stock size tire. The size I have are a bit narrower and taller, and plus they're C-rated, so I'm wondering if that means that I need to have a higher tire pressure.

I've looked into load tables and all that sort of stuff and it seems to recommend as high as 40 or 45 psi if I've got weight in the truck.

Just because it is RCTP for the stock does not mean it is not also the RCTP for that tire too. As I noted I am running the same size 275/65R18 but SL rather than C and 33 psi is the RCTP. See this post:

Post in thread 'Tire Pressure recommendation'

Nov 28, 2023

On my stock 2015 LC I just got new shoes and rubber today. Cooper's newly released Discoverer Road & Trail AT which replaces the 4S.
The specs are 275/65R18 116H 620AB SL 2756lbs

Though slightly narrower / taller than the stock tires knowing the RCTIP would be appreciated. I believe it should still be 33 psi. But want to confirm. TIA.

I was going to ask the tech what he set the pressure at and why but forgot. I looked on the way home, five tires five different pressures.

The RCTIP for a Standard Load (SL) ISO-Metric 275/65R18 116H tire on your LC200 is indeed...

• gaijin

• 

 

[gaijin]

Howdy all - I recently bought a 2019 Land Cruiser from a Toyota dealer. It’s Gold CPO at 81k miles in excellent condition. It’s now at 86k and in Colorado (potholes, mountains, construction) the ride feels off.

Over bumps, cracks, and road texture I get a pretty harsh transfer into the cabin. I feel like I can feel every single bump. It’s not bouncy or floating afterward, but it’s more than “unaffected.” Based on how everyone talks about it, I thought the ride might be a bit more plush than I’m finding it.

Setup:

• Tires: Toyo Open Country A/T III LT275/65R18 Load Range C

• Have run between 37 and 40 PSI cold unloaded

• Shocks: Dealer + independent inspection — no leaks, bounce test passes, “within spec.”

• Stock height, KDSS, no mods.

I recognize this is a body on frame heavy SUV, but I’ve constantly heard about it driving “plush”. For context, I came from a 5th gen 4Runner and I’m not finding it much better than that beyond body roll due to KDSS.

So is this normal for a 200 with LT C-rated tires at 86k on rough roads, or should it still feel more isolated? Anyone running these same Toyos (or similar LTs) and found a better pressure sweet spot? Did an OEM Bilstein refresh at ~80-100k (even with no leak) noticeably improve small-bump harshness? Worth it for daily comfort?

Happy to share more details. Thanks!

Right but that is the recommended tire pressure for the stock size tire. The size I have are a bit narrower and taller, and plus they're C-rated, so I'm wondering if that means that I need to have a higher tire pressure.

I've looked into load tables and all that sort of stuff and it seems to recommend as high as 40 or 45 psi if I've got weight in the truck.

FYI, the correctly calculated RCTIP (Recommended Cold* Tire Inflation Pressure) for those LT-Metric LT275/65R18 Load Range C tires on your 2019 LC200 is 45psi Front/Rear.

*From Toyota:

Tire Pressure vs. Tire Temperature

Tire temperature is dependent on “cold” tire pressure, driving distance and speed, ambient temperature and road surface temperature. As the temperature of the tire changes, air in the tire expands and contracts, changing the tire’s air pressure. The cold tire pressure for all Toyota models will vary and will need to be adjusted accordingly.

“Cold” tire pressure, as shown on the tire pressure label on our vehicles, is generally considered to be the pressure in a tire that has not been driven in the past 4 hours and has been parked outdoors.


And don't forget to re-initialize your TPMS system.

HTH

 

[mountainsandskis]

Others will tell you different, but 40psi is too high for ride comfort if you're not towing. Let some air out and see how it does. Was your 4runner on LT tires or SL tires?

My 4Runner was on the exact same tire (Toyo AT3s), also C-loaded. I also felt that to be a pretty reactive, harsh ride over imperfections, but I eventually put Icons on it and that helped.

FYI, the correctly calculated RCTIP (Recommended Cold* Tire Inflation Pressure) for those LT-Metric LT275/65R18 Load Range C tires on your 2019 LC200 is 45psi Front/Rear.

*From Toyota:

Tire Pressure vs. Tire Temperature

Tire temperature is dependent on “cold” tire pressure, driving distance and speed, ambient temperature and road surface temperature. As the temperature of the tire changes, air in the tire expands and contracts, changing the tire’s air pressure. The cold tire pressure for all Toyota models will vary and will need to be adjusted accordingly.

“Cold” tire pressure, as shown on the tire pressure label on our vehicles, is generally considered to be the pressure in a tire that has not been driven in the past 4 hours and has been parked outdoors.


And don't forget to re-initialize your TPMS system.

HTH

Correct me if I’m wrong please, but isn’t the RCTIP of 45 PSI calculated against the GAWR (3,595 front / 4,300 rear), which represents the maximum rated axle load and not the actual weight sitting on my tires.

My 2019 has a curb weight of 5,815 lbs per Edmunds. With me in the driver’s seat and a full tank, I’m at roughly 6,015 lbs. Using a ~54/46 front/rear split, my heaviest tire (front driver side) is seeing approximately 1,624 lbs.
Per the TRA Light Truck Load Inflation Table for LT275/65R18 Load Range C:
∙ At 35 PSI: 1,940 lbs capacity per tire which is 316 lbs margin (19%) over my actual heaviest corner
∙ At 37 PSI: ~2,016 lbs capacity = 392 lbs margin (24%)
∙ At 45 PSI (RCTIP): 2,310 lbs capacity = 686 lbs margin (42%)

At 45, I’m carrying 42% more capacity than I need for a truck that runs unloaded 95% of the time. That’s capacity reserved for a loading scenario that doesn’t exist in my daily use case.
I’m not suggesting the RCTIP is wrong. I’m saying that for an unloaded daily driver, the actual load per tire is well within the tire’s rated capacity at 35-37 PSI cold, with meaningful margin remaining. When I load the truck up heavy for a trip or tow, I would just air up accordingly.

 

[gaijin]

My 4Runner was on the exact same tire (Toyo AT3s), also C-loaded. I also felt that to be a pretty reactive, harsh ride over imperfections, but I eventually put Icons on it and that helped.

Correct me if I’m wrong please, but isn’t the RCTIP of 45 PSI calculated against the GAWR (3,595 front / 4,300 rear), which represents the maximum rated axle load and not the actual weight sitting on my tires.

My 2019 has a curb weight of 5,815 lbs per Edmunds. With me in the driver’s seat and a full tank, I’m at roughly 6,015 lbs. Using a ~54/46 front/rear split, my heaviest tire (front driver side) is seeing approximately 1,624 lbs.
Per the TRA Light Truck Load Inflation Table for LT275/65R18 Load Range C:
∙ At 35 PSI: 1,940 lbs capacity per tire which is 316 lbs margin (19%) over my actual heaviest corner
∙ At 37 PSI: ~2,016 lbs capacity = 392 lbs margin (24%)
∙ At 45 PSI (RCTIP): 2,310 lbs capacity = 686 lbs margin (42%)

At 45, I’m carrying 42% more capacity than I need for a truck that runs unloaded 95% of the time. That’s capacity reserved for a loading scenario that doesn’t exist in my daily use case.
I’m not suggesting the RCTIP is wrong. I’m saying that for an unloaded daily driver, the actual load per tire is well within the tire’s rated capacity at 35-37 PSI cold, with meaningful margin remaining. When I load the truck up heavy for a trip or tow, I would just air up accordingly.

Stock tires for your LC200 are P285/60R18 tires at 33psi (according to the TIP (Tire Information Placard) affixed to your truck at the factory) which yields a Load Limit of 2,512 lbs. This is the Load Limit for required for safe operation with OEM tires.

As you know from reviewing the TRA Load/Inflation tables, for LT-Metric tires, we must divide that Load Limit by 1.1 to determine the required Load Limit. That shows us that the Load Limit required for safe operation with LT-Metric tires is 2,512/1.1 = 2,284 lbs. To achieve this Load Limit, again according to the TRA Load/Inflation tables, a LT275/65R18 LT-Metric tire would require slightly less than 45psi - rounded up for convenience to the RCTIP of 45psi.

TL;DR, Running your LT275/65R18 tires at 35-37psi as you suggest would be the equivalent of running the OEM 285/60R18 tires at some pressure below 26psi - in other words, an unsafe underinflated pressure.

Run whatever pressure you want, but please be aware that anything under 45psi is underinflated which results in all the associated safety/performance negatives associated with underinflated tires.

HTH

 

[discoverydave]

One angle I haven't seen mentioned yet: at 86k miles, what's the actual condition of those shocks? People jump straight to tires (and tires definitely matter) but stock shocks on an 80k+ mile rig can be well past their service life, especially if the previous owner did any serious road or trail use.

I've picked up used Land Cruisers before where everything looked fine mechanically but the ride was just wrong — kind of sharp and crashy over impacts rather than controlled. Every time I've pushed on the corners and checked for excessive bounce, the shocks have been the culprit. You can have great tires at the right pressure and still get that "every bump transfers right into the seat" feeling if the dampers are tired.

The LX450/200-series shocks typically degrade gradually so it's not dramatic, just that over time the dampening bleeds down and you lose the controlled absorption. A CPO inspection won't catch gradual shock wear — the dealer is checking for leaks and obvious failure, not calibrated damping performance.

I'd suggest the bounce test at all four corners before going deeper into tire brands and pressures. If it bounces more than once after you release it, that's your answer. The tire pressure conversation is worth having, but if the shocks are at 86k and never replaced, I'd want to know that first.

 

[Sandroad]

One angle I haven't seen mentioned yet: at 86k miles, what's the actual condition of those shocks? People jump straight to tires (and tires definitely matter) but stock shocks on an 80k+ mile rig can be well past their service life, especially if the previous owner did any serious road or trail use.

I've picked up used Land Cruisers before where everything looked fine mechanically but the ride was just wrong — kind of sharp and crashy over impacts rather than controlled. Every time I've pushed on the corners and checked for excessive bounce, the shocks have been the culprit. You can have great tires at the right pressure and still get that "every bump transfers right into the seat" feeling if the dampers are tired.

The LX450/200-series shocks typically degrade gradually so it's not dramatic, just that over time the dampening bleeds down and you lose the controlled absorption. A CPO inspection won't catch gradual shock wear — the dealer is checking for leaks and obvious failure, not calibrated damping performance.

I'd suggest the bounce test at all four corners before going deeper into tire brands and pressures. If it bounces more than once after you release it, that's your answer. The tire pressure conversation is worth having, but if the shocks are at 86k and never replaced, I'd want to know that first.

I agree use history is important, but if it’s had anything like normal LC use, 81,000 miles is fine for OEM shocks on a ‘19. They are robust units. I tow a lot and replaced the rear shocks at about the mileage and didn’t detect any difference at all in ride quality or compliance/control. In fact, I even bought a set of front shocks too and decided against installing them.

 

[bloc]

I agree use history is important, but if it’s had anything like normal LC use, 81,000 miles is fine for OEM shocks on a ‘19. They are robust units. I tow a lot and replaced the rear shocks at about the mileage and didn’t detect any difference at all in ride quality or compliance/control. In fact, I even bought a set of front shocks too and decided against installing them.

Yep. I put new OEM shocks on my rig when I got it at 105k miles.. I couldn't tell a difference between the old ones and new.

Granted, that's only one vehicle. But that was my experience.

 

[studawg]

Hmmm, this is weird. LC200s do ride pretty plush. I often hear people say that the ride is too soft, too much body roll, "wonky", etc...from people who drive them the first time.

If anything, your tires appear to be underinflated, so I dont think its tire pressure.

I guess the only thing it could be is the shocks. Are they aftermarket knockoffs or something?

Have you driven any other 200s to compare it to?