FJ60--I am about to quit on my 2F

[vtcruiser60]

I am in a rare mood. I just walked to work for the second time in a year after my 60 died. What should I do?

The stock 2F has 218K (1984). I bought a used head and had it rebuilt last summer after the headgasket blew. The old head was cracked. Since then, odds and ends have cost me about $2500. I am into the vehicle for $5,500. Too much I know, but they are addictive.

I swear to god the headgasket just blew again. The vehicle was consumed with white smoke....I thought I hit 50lb bag of flour. I have been losing antifreeze too. So...I have a truck, 218k....nickle and diming me, with what looks like another major teardown. Oh it is my daily driver too.

What can I do? Sell it? Small block conversion? Long block rebuild? When is enough enough?

 

[60wag]

A V8 conversion on your daily driver would be a nightmare IMO. IF you have done several V8s before, you might be able to do it for close to the cost of a rebuilt 2F, otherwise, it costs more. Your 2F could probably use a full rebuild, but might not require it to run for another 50k. I think it is important to figure out why the head gasket failed. The replacement head could be cracked, bad luck but possible. The block might be cracked or warped. Then it would need a rebuild if the crack could be repaired. It could be a weakness in the cooling system that overheated the engine and caused the head gasket failure. Had any overtemp episodes since the head was replaced? Was the head gasket retorqued after it was installed? I know lots of the gasket manufacturers claim no retorque needed - I know, I used to work for one of them. But its easy to do and might reduce the chance of gasket failure. With over 200k on the existing engine, you might want to shop for functional built up 2F to swap in, but I'd at least pull the head and try to find the exact spot where the water jacket is leaking into a cyl - you might be able to narrow it down to a particular cyl by examining the plugs. What you do really depends on how much you want to keep the 60. If your really attached to it, by a beater to drive while you repair it. Or it might end up costing about the same to take it to someone to have the gasket replaced. Personally I'd like to pull the head myself and be able to examine the gasket, the head and the block. Another useful bit of info is to do pull-up torque measurements on the head bolts. Mark the position of the head of the bolt on the engine head with a paint pen. Loosen one bolt at a time and retighten it back to the marked postion with a torque wrench. A scale type wrench works much better than a clicker type. The measured torque should be at least %60 of the original spec'd torque. Its a crude measurement but can give you a good idea of the amount of clamp stress left in the gasket after its been heat cycled.

 

[markdud]

Some one on PBB has a 2F for free, just go pick it up. I don't remember where.

Mark

 

[Travis_Kinney]

I also have a friend here in maine that is seriously thinking of putting in a diesel conversion and his original 2F is in great shape and was rebuilt acouple years ago. I know he's going to want to sell it.

 

[Travis_Kinney]

Does the 'VT' in vtcruiser stand for Vermont? Maybe you and he could work something out where you have the experience and could help him swap engines and put his in yours at the same time.

 

[vtcruiser60]

Thanks thus far guys. A couple of answers....

I am assuming that it is a headgasket. Though the head was used, magnafluxed, and rebuilt, YES, it could have developed a crack. s*** ass luck for sure. The head bolts were retorqued at 500 miles. The gasket is/was from Man-a-fre.

I am inclined to stay with the 2F because that is where my knowledge base is. Personally, if it is cracked, I think I am done with rebuilding it again. I would rather work with installing a used 2F and leave the thing alone.

Yes, I am in Vermont...in Burlington actually. The idea of heading to Maine sounds like fun.

 

[fsusteve]

It sounds like you took the appropriate steps on the rebuild, do you have cooling issues that need to be addressed?

 

[vtcruiser60]

I don't have cooling issues. When I had all the work done, the thermostat was a sticky and replaced again. The waterpump is working fine....about three years old. The radiator is also three years old and not stock. It seems to work fine though. I don't overheat. If anything, I can barely get the thing warmed up in the Winter. I had a real hard time starting it with temps below 15-20F.
The starter is 3 years old and was replaced by the PO as the transmission was rebuilt.

See this is what I am talking about. All this crap has been replaced....still I have problems. I don't mean to whine....but I need some options before I face the wife at 6pm and tell her the good news.

Oh....yeah. we are expecting number 2 kid in August. Great time to drain the account.

 

[fsusteve]

Owning a twenty year old truck requires one of two things in my book. A good set of tools and a FSM or a job that makes a whole lot of money. Even cruiser parts break/wear over time and if not addressed as it happens s*** backs up and can cause lots of other problems. I know this doesn't help your situation now, but that's the reality of an old truck.

 

[Travis_Kinney]

Hey I'm with you with the account thing. My wife wishes I had bought a new truck. I bought my 69Fj40 for $2,200 and have put over $3,000 more into it and requires a lot more of my time. Plus I'm renovating a 127 year old farm and have 4 boys to raise! ugh

hey seriously keep my contact information. I'll talk to my friend about his engine. We could probably even find a garage (commercial one large enough for both rigs) for doing the engine swap.

Keep in touch

my email kinney@pdtarchs.com
and travisjolene@aol.com
number
207-885-0100

 

[Doc]

Ah, Burlington Vermont, a beautiful town to live in. I made a road trip through New England a couple of years ago to dig up family history and nearly stopped in Burlington, permenantly.

Nothing really to add to your post- as I'm no mechanic and new to cruisers. I bought a rusty 87 as a beater but already find myself trying to justify a lift for it (all 4 shocks are blown- so why not?).

My father once said that the cheapest car you will ever own is the one you already own. Well, that's true only up to a point. and it's really only you that can determine where that point is.

Good luck, and hopefully you can get her back on the road soon!

Have some panckakes with that great maple syrup and pat the cows for me!

 

[TJDIV]

I won't complain about how much money I've got in my Cruisers, because honestly, it's nothing compared to what some of my friends have in their cars!

0% financing available....roll over interest rates...debt for life.

NOT here. They can have their $25,000 Honda's.

So what if you're $5500 in it. What I learned is that you can spend the $10000 on a Cruiser right up front that you'll have in it anyway, or you can learn and build one for $10000, and THAT my friend, IS CHEAP.

Good Luck, stay patient.

 

[Ullr]

[quote author=TJDIV link=board=1;threadid=15940;start=msg152559#msg152559 date=1083957159]
I won't complain about how much money I've got in my Cruisers, because honestly, it's nothing compared to what some of my friends have in their cars!
[/quote]

I agree. Even a low car payment can add up to $3k - $4k/year, plus the added insurance you have to carry for a financed vehicle. If I spend $3-4k a year on the '40 in a couple of years it will be cherry

And at the end of those couple of years my '40 will have gained in value, versus the significant loss of value suffered by those who purchase new vehicles.

 

[zebrabeefj40]

You say the vehicle was "engulfed in white smoke"? I had that happen with an old Impala and the root cause was a blown radiator. Hot coolant hit the hot exhaust = instant smoke screen. I'd be looking for a blown hose or coolant line somewhere. Look underneath at the rear heater lines as well. At this point their probably getting pretty rusty. They are also above the exhaust which would yield a nice smoke sceen.

I agree with Doc: VT is a beautiful place to live. I lived there a year and wish I never left. I may yet return...

Good luck with the Cruiser.
Nick Jennings

 

[vtcruiser60]

I am feeling better after a weekend away. Thanks for the replies.

I am waiting on the results of a compression check and possible leak down test. I'll keep folks posted. Though I like the idea of rebuilding...it is a tough sell. FJ60's don't seem to appreciate like the FJ40. I should add that with an 1984, I do have a fair amount of lower body rust (rear wheel wells, lower rockers, rear hatch). So...if I really wanted a pretty DD, I am looking at body work.

Hey these are the lessons of a 20 year old truck. This boy is learning.

 

[60wag]

So was the white smoke coming out the tail pipe or from under the hood? If its under the hood, I'm Zebrabeef on a coolant leak under the hood.

 

[vtcruiser60]

The white smoke was pouring out the tailpipe.....reminiscent of the cheech and chong movies where the smoke engulfed the whole rear of a vw bus as it poked down the road. Seriously, it was pouring out the tailpipe at start-up and while idling at a stop. When driving down the road it dissipated.

 

[folsom50]

Sounds like a cracked head or blown head gasket.

Why the aftermarket radiator? Did the PO put it in, or yourself? If the PO did it I'd think that there has been some cooling problems involved and the old head and block may have warped/cracked.

 

[jim45r]

I don't know about the Man-a-fre gaskets, but I've heard of problems with aftermarket head gaskets. If the man-a-fre was all metal, I would be less suspect. If it was fiber with metal fire rings and water jacket rings, you might have just had a gasket failure. A porfessional mechanic friend of mine had a batch of aftermarket gaskets go bad on 22R valve jobs - 2-6mos after the job. He's OEM-only now with no more problems.

 

[jl]

vtcruiser,

$5500 may seem like a lot now, but in the long run, it is really nothing. I've found that these '60s go in spurts. I've put $5K in it one year and then only gas and oil for the next few years, and then another $5K.

The bottom line is that I've probably put $25K-$30K in my '60 over the past 14 years not including oil and gas, but it's still cheaper than any new SUV. What is that--$2K per year. I'll take it! The 2 biggest expenses have been engine rebuild, and body restore. Everything else seems to be a $500-$1000 dollar hit one a year.

This year Air Conditioning