Dodge Diesel Tow Rig?

[Elbert]

Ok, I'll do some searches as see what I can find. Looking for opinions on tow rig for roughly 9K trailer. (6K FJ60 +2.5K trailer +misc stuf)= 9 K.


Looking for used diesel, dependable machine., mostly stock type setup.

(1) what is a good year range to look for, what years to stay away from?

(2) What preference for engine (verion of the cummins I-6)?

(3) go with manual trans or auto...any year models to stay away from?

(4) Would prefer 4 wheel drive, manual controls.

(5) at what point is milage a factor on these trucks..250K or more?

(6) any preference for gear ratio.

(7) what kind of fuel milage can you expect pulling 9k trailer?

really looking for a 2500 but would consider 3500 with single rear tires.

Apprecaite any pointers or comments...

 

[Elbert]

Anyone have any comments?

I'm potentially looking to change from a 01 K2500 suburban to a 2500 or 3500 series truck.

choices in my mind:

dodge 2500 or 3500 with I-6 deisel and manual trans.
ford 250 or 350 with 7.3 deisel with manual trans
GM 2500 or 3500 with duramax, allison trans or manual trans.
used...

 

[Combat Chuck]

Dodge Cummins is a decent choice, I'm not familiar with the AL smog laws, but here all diesels produced after 1998 must be smogged. That said, I would pull a Gumby and get a good shape D2500 diesel, and mod it however you need to make it do what you need.
The early-to-mid '90's Ford diesels are the better ones, IMO, before they got too overcomplicated, the newer ones, some sewar by 'em but my neighbor's 2009 F450 was troublesome from day one, and that's my sole experience there.
A friend of mine has the 3500 Duramax with the Allison, hauls a big trailer with it, and it's pretty good, except the Allison went out about two years ago, IIRC. He only used it to haul the trailer, so it was still under the mileage warranty, got it rebuilt.

If I had the funds, the time, and the skills, I'd get a '65 Chevy C20, and rebuild it around a newer Duramax and Allison, Ford Dual axle in the rear, and Dana front axle...

 

[Elbert]

may have a line on a 04 K2500 Ram crew cab truck / local , with auto trans and I-6 cummins. I want something stock and dependable. Truck has 160K miles and has been well maintained and is is good shape. Most likely I will buy this if able (I'm 2nd in line). I would like to find a nice truck with similar otpions except for manual trans over auto...but only seen a few on Ebay and Auto-trader. Most so-called local trucks / used are comeing out of TX and have 250K plus miles.

 

[Gumby]

The 12V Cummins are good motors. I don't know why people like them more than the 24V, but I have to say I really like my 12V.

None of the autos can take torque of the Cummins forever. The early non-intercooled used a 3 speed 727 Torque Flight. In 92 they went to the intercooled motor and A519 4 speed non-lockup, then in 95 to the L4RE version with the lock up. The lock up is nice, but they are known to lunch the front pumps.

If you want a auto, don't turn up the injection pump. Put a good torque converter in it. Put a trans temp gauge on it and a big ass trans cooler. If the temp goes above 200* shift out of OD. Drive it careful when the torque converter is working hardest, at low speeds.

Manuals are nice, but hard to come by and generally expensive. The Getrag trans is not quite as desirable as the NV4500.

Ideally I would get a 12V intercooled manual 4x4.

Mileage on the motor isn't important up to 300,000, but the rest of the truck will likely need some things by then.

 

[Elbert]

I'm told you can modify the 12V engines fairly easy. I'm not really into going crazy on the modifications.

There is a used car lot a few blocks from where I currently live...they have a nice 3500 2wheel drive , metal deck bed, with auto trans and it looks like they just got in a 2500 pickup. I agree that the manuals are the thing to get.

My preference is a "nice" truck...4*4, 2500 or 3500, Cummins, manual trans, manual 4*4 controls. I've seen a few on ebay an autotrader. I think the max I will ever tow is around 10K.

Would like to buy local in my area if possible...as some of these trucks really get used hard.

Waiting on the local guy to figure out what he wants to do on his truck and then I'll look elsewhere for what I want if needed. I've also heard you need to swap out the torque converter but I've not heard specific brands or sources.

 

[Gumby]

It's really easy to turn up a 12V. It's really tempting, but not too good for the trans.

 

[WILLD420]

For towing, no auto trans will ever be as good as a stick behind that cummins. Mine (2002) has an auto with all kinds of bells and whistles added over the years. I still prefer to tow with my old Ford non-turbo with a stick. Slower than hell, but I never have to worry whether I'm at a high enough rpm so the trans doesn't burn up, I don't have the torque converter locking and unlocking at random, mystery switches, aftermarket controllers, $1,000 converters etc. or all the other b.s. that goes with the Dodge auto.

If you tow in the mountains or ever will, get the 4.11 gears if you go with an auto truck. With a stick, it doesn't matter if it's 3.55's or 4.11's.

Ford and Chevy may have lot's of fans, but you take either of those two brands, load them with a 10K lb trailer and head across the Rocky Mountains and you are going to find a lot of Cummins trucks that you will have a hard time passing. On the flats the Ford and Chevy have a lot going for them, but hit the hills and the Cummins torque really shines.

Mileage is of little concern under 150K. Over 220 is when you need to start looking. Ford's are generally o.k. to about 250-280K, Duramax's seem to die around 300K. Cummins will last forever (550K+) if driven nicely and not modded. If you see evidence of programmers ie. glue stains around the engine compartment from peeled off velcro, hacked wiring harnesses etc. start asking more questions. A chip/controller can be a good thing if done smartly and monitored, or it can melt everything but the block and head leaving a mess.

A Cummins may not be a dream machine, or as quiet as the others, but a rebuild kit is cheap. Same for the drivetrains. A rebuild on an Allison with good hardparts can run you an easy grand more than the same build on a Dodge trans. Ford is a little different, but about the same price as the Dodge stuff.

Fords have the best body and interior longevity. Chevy's seem to hold their value forever. Dodges have the engine to beat for towing, but the rest of the truck will nickel and dime you to death if you're a perfectionist.

 

[Elbert]

appreciate the feedback.

Still in a wait mode on the 04 Dodge mentioned above. I recognize that the manual trans is the way to go, but have only seen either local ones that are rough with high miles or ones on Ebay or Autotrader. Have not come across one yet that (manaul trans) that is in as nice of shape as the 2004 model I'm waiting to hear back on from my friend (comparable dollars).

I'll be towing somewhere around 9K, mostly in the southeast, so no real HD mountain stuff. If I can't buy the local 04 truck I'll look for a mnaul setup with a fair price. I have seen a few 1 tons on the internet, manual trans. I hate to buy something blind, but may have to "roll-the-dice".

 

[Rastaforte]

Two of us (cumminscruiser) have converted an FJ60 to the 12V 6BT5.9 cummins diesel and while it's probably overkill for that wt vehicle, the simplicity and durability is what mattered to us. I'm still in process of finishing that transplant now....

Alot of guys I've talked to in the Dodge world after "upgrading" to a late-model Dodge (smog, 24V, computer controlled, etc) have longingly dazed over as they reminisce on that "darn pre-98 diesel that just ran, and ran, and ran... " one guy I remember mentioned how the "truck body literally fell apart AROUND the diesel engine".

Cummins diesel diehards are plenty...

Anyway, I agree with all of the points made by WILDD420 and would just add that the cummins route for the first gen diesels can will find you spending some time looking for any engine-related parts you are missing as demand is so high that parts to get your rig going can sometimes be hard to find. But like a restaurant that is exceptional.....lots of people everyday means you can't go wrong. However, that being said---the parts cost are cheap compared to some of the other alternatives when you're looking at rebuilds. I suppose there are reasons to justify the bigger Allison cost, but I'm too ignorant to do an ROI between that and such a reliable, cost-effective tranny as the 4500.

By way, both Bill and I are running a 5-speed NV4500 Dodge tranny with an Advanced Adaptor component that hooks the stock Toyota transfer case to this tranny. $800 not a bad deal.

Notice you are running a VORTEC in the 60----have you thought of doing another conversion and upgrading the 2F to a diesel?? Skip the Dodge truck body and go find you a $1500-1800 first gen diesel (there's three on Craigslist right now). Plus, unless I have some major surprise coming up when I visit the Cali smog referee, you don't need a cat or smog requirements if you keep your engine older than a '98 I believe. I could be wrong but that is what I remember right now. No smog and no Cat makes me happy (of course, legislators have a funny way of grandfathering things to muck up happiness like that)

Anyway, there's my two cents---LOL, I'm obviously biased ) Ultimately your goal is to tow and when that consideration becomes your biggest priority, my bet would be with a 12V Cummins powerplant.

Cheers & Good Luck!

 

[Elbert]

just to be clear... I'm not wanting to modify the LC to tow. I'm wanting to buy a 2500 or 3500 Dodge to tow the trailer with LC on it. RIght now I have a K2500 Suburban that tows fairly well...8.1 liter with 4L80E trans...HD towing setup... But overall I find myself wanting a pickup or other truck for hauling stuff and crap you can't use a suburban for. So I'll looking for a K2500 or K3500 Dodge Cummins. I had a line on a 04 K2500 Dodge but I was 2nd in line and truck sold..(not to me).

 

[Rastaforte]

just to be clear... I'm not wanting to modify the LC to tow. I'm wanting to buy a 2500 or 3500 Dodge to tow the trailer with LC on it. RIght now I have a K2500 Suburban that tows fairly well...8.1 liter with 4L80E trans...HD towing setup... But overall I find myself wanting a pickup or other truck for hauling stuff and crap you can't use a suburban for. So I'll looking for a K2500 or K3500 Dodge Cummins. I had a line on a 04 K2500 Dodge but I was 2nd in line and truck sold..(not to me).

Hey Mate - Completely understand..... my comment about doing a diesel transplant into a second LC was just that... an aside and a small challenge not unlike the novel Vortec rig you now have. More important was the issues everyone brings up regarding engine type/mfr and tranny combo---which seems you've nailed. You'll find it

 

[Elbert]

saw a nice K2500 6 speed manual (Cummins / Dodge)... on EBAY but was a used car lot and they wanted 2K north of a fair price.

Would like a 6 speed manual, 3500 4wheel drive, cummins, single rear tire, manual controls for 4wheel drive, and not more than 150K miles... maybe I can find one.

most of the local trucks are north of 250K miles and 5th wheel queens and have all the crap for external fuel tanks.....which some folks refer to as hot-shot rigs or cattle haulers.

A lot of these guys hauling cattle never saw a trailer too heavy... If you have one of those super long 3 axle 5th wheel trailers and it crammed full of mature cows..."you're" pushing some heavy weight..

 

[Gumby]

I had a line on a 04 K2500 Dodge but I was 2nd in line and truck sold..(not to me).

K is GM 4wd
W is Chrysler 4wd

 

[Elbert]

Yeah...I'm a old school gm fan... 4wd dodge was what I was referring too

 

[crushers]

cummins is s***, want to buy one cheap?
95/96 Powersmoke with either manual OR auto is the way to go. better fuel mileage, better power.

 

[Elbert]

not really looking for a Ford. don't think the cummins is ##$% either. If I were, it would be the 7.3 with manual trans. I drove a F450 wrecker for a few years with that setup..back 96-98 time frame.

 

[crushers]

well, since i have owned both, AND TOWED floats with Cruisers on them LONG DISTANCES, i can say with experience, that the cummins is crap and i can say the 95-96 powersmoke is the vehicle to own ...

but, hey, it is your money so what do i care.

enjoy your dodge and i hope the best for you

 

[Gumby]

well, since i have owned both, AND TOWED floats with Cruisers on them LONG DISTANCES, i can say with experience, that the cummins is crap and i can say the 95-96 powersmoke is the vehicle to own ...

but, hey, it is your money so what do i care.

enjoy your dodge and i hope the best for you

What a diskish pair of posts. Not that I'm in the least bit surprised.

What is surprising is that you would make posts like that AND have the sig line you do.

 

[crushers]

diskish ??