Denso Rotary Injection Pump Reseal questions (1 Viewer)

[GTSSportCoupe]

Looks like my Injection Pump is beginning to seep a bit on my LJ78. Odo is at 180,000kms, but I suspect it was rolled back before import to Canada. Truck runs perfect still, but want to be preventative with this. I think it's time for a seal kit. Got a couple questions before I pull the IP off and get started.

Would this seal kit work ok? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/161208925287?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I'm under the impression that usually replacing all the seals is enough, and the mechanical components are usually still within tolerance. Is this what others have found also?

Any opportunity for a performance increase while I have it open? Are there parts from the 1KZTE pump that can be crossed over? I'm at the limits of the 2LTE pump right now, and room for a bit more fuel would be nice. I imagine this is beyond the capability of a person without specialty training and tools though....that said I do have good friends in a scientific machine shop at the University where I work.

I plan to follow this procedure (http://www.kovsh.com/media/library/231/V 3 P5ZGR01.pdf), but are there any tricks I should know?

Can I expect any sort of economy or power increase when I'm finished?

Here are a couple pics of the seeping, and of my truck. Thanks for any advice folks!

 

[yotahed]

That kit should work fine. You might see a tiny gain in economy, but doesn't look like it leaks like crazy.
You should start looking for a mechanical pump down the rd.
I heard mixing 1kzt and 2lt pump parts is the way to go. Maybe even a vw pump cranked up?

...via IH8MUD app

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

That kit should work fine. You might see a tiny gain in economy, but doesn't look like it leaks like crazy.
You should start looking for a mechanical pump down the rd.
I heard mixing 1kzt and 2lt pump parts is the way to go. Maybe even a vw pump cranked up?

...via IH8MUD app

Thanks yotahed! Did you rebuild the siezed one you have yet? I'm curious how that will work out.

So the economy gain that I might see is just from stopping the external leak? Internal seals wouldn't have any impact?

Yeah, you're totally right about going mechanical pump. I was thinking that now would be the time to do it. Although I may wait until I'm ready to do a R151 swap in a year or two. Then I could scrap the electrics for the trans and engine all at once.

There was a guy on here with a 40 series who I think bored out a 2lte pump body and put a 1kzte plunger in it. I think you gain 1mm diameter or so by doing this. He used this on a 1kzte though I think. I'd probably give something like this a try if I had the parts around. I'm looking for his thread, but just can't seem to find it right now.

I think more and more of the Jap imports with rotary pumps are going to be needing seal kits as they get around 200,000kms+. Many people will send their pumps away and pay $$$. I think buying the seal kit for $50 and doing the work myself is the way to go.

 

[roscoFJ73]

I think more and more of the Jap imports with rotary pumps are going to be needing seal kits as they get around 200,000kms+. Many people will send their pumps away and pay $$$. I think buying the seal kit for $50 and doing the work myself is the way to go.

You could do it yourself ,but when a pump is off the engine its also a good idea to have it bench tested. This will give you an idea of its condition. They can also test them for leaks but you maybe able to do the test outlined in the manual yourself with some suitable pressure gauges.

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

You could do it yourself ,but when a pump is off the engine its also a good idea to have it bench tested. This will give you an idea of its condition. They can also test them for leaks but you maybe able to do the test outlined in the manual yourself with some suitable pressure gauges.

Would be nice to get it bench tested alright...


I am going to do the leak test for sure.

 

[roscoFJ73]

Would be nice to get it bench tested alright...


I am going to do the leak test for sure.

I think the pump is filled with air and suspended in water and you watch for bubbles,I forget if there is some pressure to the air.

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

I think the pump is filled with air and suspended in water and you watch for bubbles,I forget if there is some pressure to the air.

It needs to be immersed in diesel, not water.

Here's what the manual says (for reference in case anyone is curious):

"
Testing for Airtightness

(1) Remove the overflow valve and attach a cover plug.

(2) Apply air pressure of 0.5 (+ or - 0.2) atm through the fuel inlet hole, and totally immerse the pump for 30 seconds minimum in diesel fuel at room temperature to make sure that there is no leakage.

(3) Perform a test similar to the above, this time applying 4.5 to 5.5 atm of air pressure.

(4) After testing for airtightness, use an air blow gun to blow off diesel fuel from the connectors.
"


Seems basic enough.

 

[yotahed]

Didnt get around to rebuilding that pump yet , no.
I have a job lined up working at a diesel shop, working on pumps and injectors exclusively. Should be starting this week hopefully.
So Ill probably rip it open after work or something one day. Id imagine everything inside is completely fooked from the ice... But we ll see...
If you do the re seal yourself, youll definley save some coin, but if you want it the best it can be, a bench test is a good idea. Replace the resistors inside and completely rebuild it, then you have a brand new pump to sell when you go mechanical.
Hunt down a mech pump of a hilux 3L. Lots on ebay The boost compensators that fit those are the same as 2LT and 1hdt and you could just leave the internals as is, and youd get more fuel from the stock setup. Just swap the top plate with the compensator.
Just thinkin out loud here....

...via IH8MUD app

 

[ForealBoreal]

you should be able to find a 1kz-t pump pretty easy and get rid of the electrics.
Someone must have done this upgrade before on the 2l-t
what do the surf forums turn up?

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

I have a job lined up working at a diesel shop, working on pumps and injectors exclusively.

Sounds like a cool job! Wonder if you'll see any of these Bosch style rotary pumps there? Seems like they are on a lot of different small diesel engines out there.

Thanks for the advice on the manual pump stuff. I've taken notes, and will revisit it when I go that route.

you should be able to find a 1kz-t pump pretty easy and get rid of the electrics.
Someone must have done this upgrade before on the 2l-t
what do the surf forums turn up?

I did take a look on the surf forums, and it seems those guys don't mess too much with their pumps. I was hoping that a 1kz-t pump would be nearly interchangeable with the 2l-t, but the fellas seem to think there are a couple fundamental mechanical differences.

So I ordered the kit I posted a link to above. The guy was excellent to deal with. His name is John, and this is his website: http://www.diydieselshop.com/ He sent me a bunch of instructions, and an email. Here's what he had to say:

"Hi Nicolas,

When you receive your kit you will find an extra few seals inside another bag. These are special to your pump for the top cover, actuator, fuel solenoid and advance solenoid. All the other seals you need can be found inside the larger kit. You will find attached a manual for your pump. I do not recommend you fully dismantle the pump unless you have equipment to test.

I have also attached some pictures to show how to change the distributor head seal without removing the head therefore avoiding losing the fuel settings, the pump in my picture is a little different to yours but the procedure is the same.

My only other advice would be try not to make this into a big job and only change the seals you know are leaking, this way you will avoid any problems.

Feel happy to drop me a line if you require further assistance and please visit my website www.diydieselshop.com

Kind Regards, John"

 

[ForealBoreal]

I would look into it.
My 12mm pump that I am set to put on is set up differently comparing to the 1hd-t pump. Completely different timing and everything.

Someone has dabbled with it and put info up. I would just hate that the set up would be wrong and hurt your engine.

 

[yotahed]

I went for a meet with the owner and they do everything from small vw pumps (very similar to yours) to the the big cummins and tractor inline pumps and everything in between. So i should get some good experience and know how.

Again, i wouldnt go hunting too hard for a 1kz-t pump. It would probably overfuel too much. A 3L pump with the boost comp off a 2LT would work the best as its tuned a lot closer and easy to find.

At any rate, when you disassemble, make sure you use nitrile gloves and keep everything really clean(try not to touch inner parts with bare fingers if you can help it.). Have a bucket of diesel to put the parts in after you clean them.
As long as you have a manual you should be fine, but like john said, i wouldn't delve too deep unless you plan to bench it afterward...

...via IH8MUD app

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

I would just hate that the set up would be wrong and hurt your engine.

I agree with that. After thinking about it, I'm going to go with a tried and true upgrade when I'm ready for the electronic to manual swap. What yotahed has suggested is what the guys in OZ and NZ do when they turbo their 3L's, and I think that would likely be the perfect solution for me.

I went for a meet with the owner and they do everything from small vw pumps (very similar to yours) to the the big cummins and tractor inline pumps and everything in between. So i should get some good experience and know how.

Again, i wouldnt go hunting too hard for a 1kz-t pump. It would probably overfuel too much. A 3L pump with the boost comp off a 2LT would work the best as its tuned a lot closer and easy to find.

At any rate, when you disassemble, make sure you use nitrile gloves and keep everything really clean(try not to touch inner parts with bare fingers if you can help it.). Have a bucket of diesel to put the parts in after you clean them.
As long as you have a manual you should be fine, but like john said, i wouldn't delve too deep unless you plan to bench it afterward...

...via IH8MUD app

Thanks a lot yotahed, really appreciate the advice.

Good for you on getting that job. It's going to be good having a guy here who's on the 'inside' with regard to these injection pumps. Might have to send you my future manual pump setup for upgrades and bench testing, haha.

I'll be keeping my eye out for the bits and pieces I need for the manual pump setup. Will have to save a bit of $$ to.

Yup, I'll definitely keep everything very clean. I'll do the work in the University machine shop here which is a good environment for this sort of work.

I'll take some pics as I go along, and post my results here.

Came across a new 3L camshaft on ebay for cheap while I was looking for manual injection pumps. Apparently these are a nice upgrade from the 2LTE camshaft with better mid-high range power. Tempting to pop one of those in while I have the timing belt off anyhow....

 

[ForealBoreal]

Don't IDI engines have bigger cam lobes?

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

Don't IDI engines have bigger cam lobes?

The 3L is an IDI engine just like the 2LTE (same head even), but it's 2.8litre displacement instead of 2.4litre, and is non turbo.

The difference with the camshafts has more to do with the engine being normally aspirated (the 3L) vs. forced induction (the 2LTE). The 3L camshaft is designed to flow better as it can't rely on the turbo for air. This is what they say on the surf forums anyhow. A few guys there have swapped cams.

 

[Douglas S]

The 3L is an IDI engine just like the 2LTE (same head even), but it's 2.8litre displacement instead of 2.4litre, and is non turbo.

The difference with the camshafts has more to do with the engine being normally aspirated (the 3L) vs. forced induction (the 2LTE). The 3L camshaft is designed to flow better as it can't rely on the turbo for air. This is what they say on the surf forums anyhow. A few guys there have swapped cams.

A friend of mine (he's on here occasionally) swapped the cam in his 2LTE. I think he noticed a small improvement.

 

[yotahed]

Makes sense^^^^.
I would think the duration would be a touch more on the 3L, i wouldnt think the lift would differ much.
Im actually suprised you dont have a 3L top end yet Nick !!

Just kidding.

...via IH8MUD app

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

Im actually suprised you dont have a 3L top end yet Nick !!

Just kidding.

Haha! To tell you the truth, I'm pretty surprised too. It's become a challenge now to see how far I can push her before she pops.

 

[BCR4619]

Haha! To tell you the truth, I'm pretty surprised too. It's become a challenge now to see how far I can push her before she pops.

Did you knock on wood with this post?

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

Did you knock on wood with this post?

I was half joking about pushing it till it blows. But I am mentally prepared for it if it does happen. The repair won't be a big deal for me, as I've done a lot of that sort of work before. I think it's more that the head will go at a very inconvenient time, like while towing my trailer on a camping trip with my family. Ah well, I've done everything I can (aside from an engine swap) to prevent it. Fingers crossed, knock on wood.