Curing Vapor Lock (1 Viewer)

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Joined
Jun 10, 2017
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512
Location
Washington
Beating Back Vapor Lock

We spent 2 years restoring a 1968 Toyota Land Cruiser. We rebuilt the original 3.9 liter inline 6, all 135 HP worth. With a 3 on the tree, it is very very nostalgic to cruise through town and the local back roads. During the restoration we added a auxiliary fuel tank and Vintage Air Conditioning. With the auxiliary tank, we added a 3 way valve that allows switching between the the original tank and auxiliary tank. Fuel is supplied to a Rochester B series single barrel carburetor through a Facet electric (solid state) fuel pump. So between the AC, and local summer temperatures that run in the 90 to 100 degree range, I had a terrible time with vapor lock. The issue was further exacerbated buy running on pump gas at up to 15% ethanol.

I blame myself for some of the problem, I installed the fuel pump, the 3 way valve and the fuel filter in the engine compartment. Actually built a sweet little mountain plate just aft of the battery support bracket. With all of the fuel delivery components inboard to protect from water spray and on a hot day, the 200 plus degree air from the radiator and AC condenser would heat the fuel delivery components until you could hear the fuel pump rattle (a true death rattle) as the fuel flashed to vapor and the pump lost suction.

Now, most of you will say, just move the fuel pump, valve and filter to under the vehicle and closer to the fuel tank(s) and problem solved. That wouldn’t have been an easy task since I ran all of the fuel lines inside of the frame rails....out of sight....protected...impossible to get to. I saved that for a last resort. Or maybe find non-ethanol gas...in the area we live in, 300,000 residents, there are only 3 stations that carry it...and they are way way out of the way.

My first attempt at curing my design oversight was using DEI aluminized silicon sleeving over the fuel lines from the 3 way valve all the way to the carburetor. This partially corrected the problem. However, in town, idling for any length of time, engine compartment temperatures still caused the fuel to flash at fuel pump, starving the carburetor.

As a final solution, I ended up building an insulated heat shield out of thin gage aluminum and lining it with Noico sticky back sound and heat insulation. I also ran the AC drain hose to the base of the fuel pump. There were several iterations of this shield. It worked better each time, but didn’t quite cure the issue. The final iteration, completely covering the pump, valve and filter has, ‘dare I say’, cured my vapor lock issue.

The other item that seemed to help ‘heat soak’ at the carburetor and hard starting after sort engine shutdowns, was insulation the exhaust pipe using Heat Shield Products 1/4 inch ceramic and aluminum blanket material. The original cast iron exhaust manifold was ceramic coated during the restoration, mostly for aesthetics, but I think between that and the exhaust pipe insulation, they keep that side of the engine compartment at a more reasonable temperature. I’m still playing with the pipe insulation but it all helps.

Back to the fuel system.....after a good longe drive on a 90 degree day, at engine coolant temperatures upwards of 212 to 215, the fuel pump area was at ambient....sill at 90 degrees.

We run a Dakota Digital, and I set the engine temperature warning feature at 210. Anything over 210 degrees flashes the temperature in the odometer window. As all of you know, with a 12 psi cap, 50/50 antifreeze, and a 180 degree thermostat, anything under 220 at speeds in excess of 60 on a 100 degree day are pretty darn good for these old rigs, especially with the AC at full blast. Around town, I never see the rig over 190 or so. Of course...that’s putt putting around at 35 and 40.

So between modern insulation material and the AC drain hose blowing just a tiny bit of cool air across the fuel delivery components, I can burn modern fuels without having to pull over with the hood up, waiting for the engine to cool.....and I can keep my sweet mounting bracket that looks cool but caused all of the problems to begin with.

Original Install (Nice and Neat but ‘Oh’ the Heat!)
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Heat Shield with Noico Insulation (under the truck looking forward)
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DEI Fuel Line Insulation
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Heat Shield Products Exhaust Pipe Insulation
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I think a part of your issue and will continue to be, is the routing of your fuel line, above the carburator. Any accumulation of vapor is going to collect in that high spot above the valve cover, whereas if it were routed in a similar fashion as stock any accumulation of vapor would be vented out of the carburator "high point" vent.
 
You have put a lot of thought into this and communicated your methods well.

Fuel and other liquids like to be pushed, not pulled, and for that reason, it's always best to mount the pump in or very near the tank, and below the static tank level, so that the pump sees fuel all the time. Beyond that, you're also fighting the eternal battle of a very volatile liquid at high temps under very low pressure. This is one reason I added TBI EFI to my FJ40. Since that time, happiness. I would think you could re-mount the fuel pump nearer to the tank and leave your 'in-the-frame' lines and continue to use them. You can also mount a temporary pump there and see if that helps, without gutting your current setup.

Is your radiator new-ish? I would think that on the highway, even with A/C, you should not be seeing 220F coolant temps, unless that's measured right at the head.
 
Radiator is new....and the Dakota Digital coolant temperature sensor is on the head, next to cylinder 6. Yep, the hottest part of the engine.

And you are correct, in hindsight I should have used 2 pumps, one under each tank and an alternating relay with the 3 way valve. But hindsight is always hindsight. And there’s always that ‘Next’ restoration. LOL
 
My ‘78 doesn't have AC , but it does have headers, so the engine compartment is VERY hot. I have driven across the Central Nevada desert, with the outside temperature at 108*, the inside temperature considerably hotter and my headers at 450*... never a stutter... since I redesigned my fuel delivery system.

When my oem fuel pump diaphragm split, 10 miles off road, I swapped in a used oem pump and got home ok... then changed my engine oil and filter.


But, thinking about it, I didn’t want to chance an oem pump dumping fuel in my crankcase, should the diaphragm split again.

I also wanted a secondary fuel pump backup, that I could switch to, should one pump fail.

So, I removed the oem pump, plugged the hole with a BBC Blockoff Plate. Then, I installed 2 Electric Pumps, near the grommet that serves the main tank lines that breach the floor. The main pump is mounted to the body bulkhead, the Aux is mounted to the DS of the PS frame rail... both below and very near the two tanks. Here’s a pic... sorry you can’t see much.

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Each pump has a filter, just downstream and the lines run thru the PS frame rail.

The fuel feed lines converge into a Pollak 6-port switching valve and exit the Pollak, to a soft line that connects to the hard feed line, which routes, as oem, to the carb.

The carb return hard line routes, as oem, to a soft line that returns to the Pollak And spilts to individual return lines, back to their associated tank.

The hard lines, around the valve cover and over the intake, are heat-sleeved.

I also use an OPSS to cut power to the fuel pumps, when The engine dies, the ignition remains on and the oil pressure falls below 7 psi ( an accident ), but It still allows the engine to start normally when no oil pressure.

This design also provides an emergency fuel pump backup, should the active pump fail... as long as I keep several gallons in the other tank.
 
Greetings from Wa. Solace. I see your posts in the veterans forum now and then.

Thank you for the comments....2 pumps, 1 at each tank, that’s awesome! Actually I carry a spare under the seat....just in case.

I built the 68 for my wife, and it spends most of its time in the local suburbs here in Kennewick Wa. It doesn’t see much highway or off highway use. But it sure is fun to cruise around in. When we originally bought the rig in 94 when gas was just gas, no ethanol. The rig broke a piston in 2000 and it was parked behind the house for 17 years...finally got around to doing something with it.

Didn’t think much of how to route the fuel lines or how 10/15% ethanol would effect drivability in the heat. When I planed out the fuel system, just neatened up what was there before....shame on me, LOL.

Attached is a video you might enjoy, my daughter made it as collage class project. It’s preyt good and may take you down memory lane....as far as these old FJ40’s go.

Thanks again.

 
Thanks! I’ll watch it tonight.

FWIW I buy whatever 87 octane is available. I may be naive, but I don’t worry about ethanol.

No vapor lock.

I do add Marvel Mystery Oil and ZDDP to my fuel.

I also carry a 3rd electric pump, same as the others, in my spares.
 
Great video @Mark Jennings . Somewhere, somehow, I believe I’ve seen this posted elsewhere, good to see it again. Your daughter did a fine job.🎯💅
 
Dumb question and apologies if it's been answered, but are you running a return line?


68 did not have a return line. The one barrel Rochester doesn't have a return line either. I find a vapor lock interesting. Never had a vapor lock issue on my 68 I've since 1974. Ran a number of different carburetors over the years and had header for a number of years. One think I never have run is an electric fuel pump.
 
Got you. I never had vapor lock issues until ethanol became the rage, but had it happen a couple of times in the past, particularly when I was sitting in traffic. I did reposition my fuel pumps (main tank/aux tank) as close to their respective sources as possible so that they push the fuel and later I added a Lincoln Mark VIII electric fan (I have an SBC 350 in mine) and that seems to pull so much air that it helped to eliminate vapor lock too. BUT--that said, I'm no expert mechanic...All I know for sure is that it's the first electric fan I've run that will make the engine temp drop regardless of the outside temp, when stuck in traffic.

I always wondered if you could put a T fitting in with a much smaller outlet right at the carb, and routed back to the tank as a return, but maybe that'd create issues when running down the road. Or maybe it'd create issues when idling AND running down the road. As I said, I'm no expert....
 
Maybe this should be a new thread, but as this one is called Vapor Lock and the vintages of the FJ40s is close...I have 67FJ40, engine & driveline from 85 FJ60. De smog and trollhole carb. During summer hard starts after running the engine a bit — should retrofit a FJ60 carb fan?

Do these carbs/engines or require this? Seems like an easy fix if it is.,,,
 

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