auto or manual for 1HD FT

[Dusten]

When you get into the world of precise electronic control, traction control systems, hill descent, CVT's, there are lots of other arguments to be made. I am very much talking about the question of a 1HD-FT engine with a period auto vs manual transmission though.

I'm well aware
That's why I said, I don't like this auto. It has faults I'd correct but I'm not sure the work to do so is worth the effort.

 

[SaturnAscends]

Yep, it's got long throws for sure. Very similar to a manual Hilux from the era if you're ever driven one of those. Of course, having done over 500,000km in vehicles like this, it just feels "normal" to me and every other manual feels like it's got a short throw.

I've never driven an off-road auto diesel, but I've driven a mix of petrol and diesel manuals. There's definitely a difference with the diesel engine off-road, with how much torque it has low down in the RPM range, it makes it quite a different beast offroad to the petrol engines.

One thing I've never done though is drive a manual LHD vehicle with a stick shift, only autos or column shift. Seems to me like it'd be really weird unless you were a lefty. I'm used to using my dominant hand on the wheel, while using my off-hand to change gears. Anyone from the LHD world have an opinion on that?

I drove a 98 Tacoma with a 5 speed. It was a little notchy at times but I though it was a great gearbox; really fun to drive, and 1st gear lo was almost like a hill descent control in in itself. I'm not sure about the ratios or whatever, but it was good enough for me. The only concern I had was wearing out the clutch when I had to ride it on slow sections.

That's funny what you say about LHD manuals seeming awkward to drive. To me it's the opposite: I've always thought it'd be weird shifting with my off hand. When I lived in Tasmania I had a 96 Camry with the auto. It wasn't pretty, or 4x4, but that thing got me everywhere I needed to go, and was cheap as dirt to buy and keep on the road. I miss that thing.

 

[gilmorneau]

One thing I've never done though is drive a manual LHD vehicle with a stick shift, only autos or column shift. Seems to me like it'd be really weird unless you were a lefty. I'm used to using my dominant hand on the wheel, while using my off-hand to change gears. Anyone from the LHD world have an opinion on that?

I was traveling quite a bit a few years ago, and switching back and forth between RHD and LHD manual transmission cars. Really not that big of a problem. You get accustomed to it quickly. You'll have more problems with the turn signals and wiper controls being on opposite sides. With LHD being "normal" to me, I was constantly signaling turns with my wipers in RHD cars. lol

 

[peacesells63]

I mean, for me, keeping my foot off the clutch isn't the goal. Just about every bend on a lose surface, I'm in a lower gear with the clutch partially depressed. That's how I ensure I don't slip, because I'm in control of the torque to the wheels. You've got analogue control over it as long as your foot is on the clutch. Fighting against it with the brake isn't the same thing.

You can do the same thing with an auto by letting off of the throttle.

When I drive a manual, my goal is to be on the clutch as little as possible. I don't like replacing clutches

If you're driving something so dicey to require such incredibly slow speeds as you've described, that's exactly when I want the precise control the clutch gives me. If you're going uphill super slow, you're working the accelerator and the clutch, and you can go as slow as you want. If you're going downhill super slow, you're working the clutch and the brake. Don't really see how an auto would make anything easier, just gives you less control. And if you're bogged or on super wet or slippery surfaces, the auto gives you only the accelerator to work with, and the power transfer is less even. In a manual I can turn my wheels at one rotation per minute at a consistent rate if I choose to.

On wet/slippery surfaces, an auto is much better if you don’t want to spin tires. Especially in deep snow when you are trying to maintain momentum without spinning. If you slip the clutch that much, you will be replacing it constantly.

That said, it takes more time and experience to learn to control a manual properly. An auto is simple by comparison, that's the exact reason they were invented, to require less knowledge or experience to get the vehicle to move forward. The clutch gives you an alternate way to accelerate or brake, and allows you to truly coast or have ultra low torque at the wheels, but you use it in tandem with the accelerator and brakes. How to work it is by feel, and comes down to experience. I DD my 80, and have DD a Toyota manual diesel of some form continuously for 25 years now. If you only hop into the vehicle every month or so, it'd be hard to develop the skill to control it properly in really rough offroad use IMO.

The vast majority of my wheeling has been in manual Toyota’s with with either 108:1 or 228:1 1st gear double low ratios. 228:1 was almost too low, but nice for control. I had a few dozen times where 108:1 left a lot to be desired. For comparison, nearly all buggies run autos and gear ratios around 55:1 in 1st gear low range, with no desire for lower gearing. That's the difference an auto makes in technical stuff.

I have taken manual toyotas through tougher trails with stock gearing, it flat out sucks. Either its rough and bumpy and you're slipping off lines, or you are burning the clutch up.

Here is a video from 13 years ago where I had to do a good but of clutch work at 108:1, and would have preferred but did not need lower gearing. You wont be taking a nice 80 through this trail, but you could if you wanted to smash it up.

And I'm not compelled by the park brake argument. That thing can be fixed up proper to work well, like mine does.

Each to their own though I guess.

Cruiser parking brakes suck. I have 3 built and well maintained cruisers and I won’t park any of them in my driveway (it’s fairly steep) with just the parking brake. I do a lot of wheelin solo and the consequences of trusting a parking brake on Moab trails or Arizona/Colorado shelf roads is not worth it. I’ve seen them slip. That’s how trucks go off the edge at black bear pass. If it’s manual, shut the truck off and leave it in gear + parking brake.

By comparison, most trails in Australia are much longer, less technical and more remote. In the states our trails are mostly shorter, more technical, and not nearly as remote. I could see favoring a manual trans there just for the fact that you can bump start the truck if the starter goes out or batt dies. I carry a spare starter and a jump pack to negate that issue, though I haven't had to use them.

Having said all of that, get what you prefer to drive and what will work better for the type of driving you do. I would love to have a 5 speed in a cruiser that was just a touring rig. They are just more fun to drive. but, they are not enjoyable on technical trails unless you have super low gearing. Just sharing some experience in case the OP wants to do some more technical trails in his truck. By the way, if you dont already have 3.1 tcase gears, get them. You will love the difference.

 

[mudgudgeon]

One thing I've never done though is drive a manual LHD vehicle with a stick shift, only autos or column shift. Seems to me like it'd be really weird unless you were a lefty. I'm used to using my dominant hand on the wheel, while using my off-hand to change gears. Anyone from the LHD world have an opinion on that?

A week or two of it, and the hardest thing is not reaching for the park brake with the wrong hand hand.
It becomes normal quick enough

 

[mudgudgeon]

How is the H151f to drive? I've heard it's kinda like shifting a big rig, with long throws between gears.

Anyway I've never driven a diesel, but IMO in general the only advantage of an auto is you can avoid stalling on steep climbs and slow sections. And it's easier to have a coffee while driving I suppose.

They take practice to drive them smoothly.
They have a long throw shift for sure, plus they have very heavy gears and synchros are marginal.

Shifting needs to be deliberate and precise. Nit slow so much as deliberate.

They shift more like a truck than a sports car, but you can drive them in a spritely manner with some skill.
Matching RPM as you shift and throttle control is important.

My brother could not drive my tuned up hdj81 5 speed landcruiser smoothly at all. He was used to sportier vehicles, and just couldn't wrap his head around what it takes.
Taking my son to drive in a manual cruiser was tricky too, but he had it nailed after a while.

 

[HRTROB]

I haven’t driven a 1HD-FT with an auto, but I do have a H151 manual 1HDT as well as an auto LX470 with the A442. The manual is just more fun and more engaging to drive. The old 4 speed auto in my LX470 is just too slow and I even contemplated on doing a manual swap on it. The 6 speed auto on my VDJ200 is a different beast though, shifts are fast and smooth and I don’t think I would have it any other way.