Anyone have a SOR Voltage Regulator...

[FF LC FREAK]

...and does it work?

Story time. Grab a , sit back and enjoy...

First, a little background. 1981 Canadian Spec BJ42. About a month ago, I blew my alternator and external voltage regulator. Got the alternator rebuilt, but I am having a hard time with the voltage regulator. I called up my local Toyota dealer and asked for one - part number 27700-57030. They told me there were 2 in the country, and it would cost me about $200. Ouch! So, I called up SOR. They had one listed for a 24volt diesel for $25.99, but said it didn't fit Canadian models. After a little research in the 3B engine manual, it showed that the only difference between Canadian models and everyone else's was the plug. Canada had a round plug and everyone else had a rectangular plug. The posts inside the plug were even in the same location.

No problem, right? I could just cut the plug off my current one and put it on the voltage regulator from SOR. It should work, right? So, I bought one, but the SOR rep put on the reciept that they wouldn't take it back because I am altering the plug. Whatever. After SOR's shipping, it cost me about $40. I label the wires, cut off the plug, and splice the Canadian plug onto the VR. I plug it in, turn the key, and it blows my engine fuse. So, I pull off the VR and test it according to the FSM. It doesn't come close to passing in 3 of the 5 tests!

I call up SOR, tell them about it, and the salesman says to send it in and they'll test it. If it tests faulty, they'll send me a new one. I told him I had already cut the plug off, but he said it was no problem. It cost me $12 to send it back to them with tracking info. After they had it for a week and i hadn't heard anything, I called them up. "Oh, yeah, we haven't had a chance to test it yet. We'll test it right away and get back to you". An hour later I get an e-mail saying that they won't test it because the plug had already been cut off! And they won't give me my money back because they said on the reciept that returns wouldn't be accpeted.

So I call up once again, and they guy says yeah, we've probably sold 15 of these over the past 2 years and never had a bad one or one returned. So I say, can you send me another one, but can you test it first to make sure it works. And they assure me they will. And they send another one for $40. Yeah, I'm a glutton for punishment.

I get it today, and before cutting off the plug, I test it. It tests roughly the same as the one I sent back. It does not meet the specs in 3 of the 5 tests in the FSM. Now I'm into it for over $90 and still don't have a functioning VR. I would buy the Toyota one, but I just got off the phone with them. None available in the US and they are no longer available.

If anyone is still reading this after my rant and has bought one of these, do they actually work? Is my logic way off here? Any thoughts? Is there a substitute for Toyota part #27700-57030?


Thanks!

 

[bj40green]

A little research turned up the following:
27700-57030 24V Voltage Regulator for BJ42 Canadian Market with round plug.
27700-57010 replaced by 27700-57080 24V Voltage Regulator for BJ42 General Market with rectangular plug.
So far, so good. Now blowing a fuse. I don't see how an alternator or a regulator can blow your engine fuse. The alternator has nothing to do with the engine fuse and the regulator is so straight forward that only an internal short can blow your fuse unless there is a wiring problem or mix up. Are you sure that the wires from the alternator are not mixed up? Ground and Field? In that case the engine fuse can blow.

Just my 0.02 cents.

Rudi

 

[FF LC FREAK]

A little research turned up the following:
27700-57030 24V Voltage Regulator for BJ42 Canadian Market with round plug.
27700-57010 replaced by 27700-57080 24V Voltage Regulator for BJ42 General Market with rectangular plug.

Thanks for the reply, Rudi!

Sorry, I'm not following you here. So, is there a Toyota replacement for 27700-57030 with the round plug? For that matter, is there any VR that would work?

So far, so good. Now blowing a fuse. I don't see how an alternator or a regulator can blow your engine fuse. The alternator has nothing to do with the engine fuse and the regulator is so straight forward that only an internal short can blow your fuse unless there is a wiring problem or mix up. Are you sure that the wires from the alternator are not mixed up? Ground and Field? In that case the engine fuse can blow.
Just my 0.02 cents.
Rudi

Sorry, I mis-spoke a little in my above post. Its not my engine fuse that blows. I have a 30 amp fuse instead of the fusible links (from the PO). It is this fuse that blew as soon as I turned the key. So, battery power goes through it, to the alternator and through the VR. I can run it no problem (albeit without charging) with no voltage regulator. Its only when I plug in Spector Off Road's VR and turn the key on that the fuse blows.

As far as mixing up the wires on the alternator, it is only 1 plug and 1 wire. Pretty much impossible to mix up unless the people that rebuilt my alternator mixed them up somehow. But they said they tested it and it was good. They also have a very good reputation.

So, to me, it still comes back to the voltage regulator. I know I am trying to swap plugs, but that shouldn't matter. The internals of the voltage regulator should work the same. What I don't get is that they SOR VR does not meet the specs given in the B Series Engine Manual. Which brings me back to my question of, does anyone have one of these and does it work? And finally, is there a suitable replacement for this voltage regulator?

 

[jdb3]

I sent my voltage regulator to a guy in Raymore, Mo and he rebuilt it for me. If you need a phone number and address email me. Jim

 

[FF LC FREAK]

I sent my voltage regulator to a guy in Raymore, Mo and he rebuilt it for me. If you need a phone number and address email me. Jim

Thanks jdb3.

I just got off the phone with Dan at 4 Wheel Auto and they have an aftermarket one they are sending me. Hopefully that will work. I'm getting kind of tired of dealing with this issue. When I get it, I'll do a little write up for those that are interested.

However, I'm still interested to know if anyone has a 24 volt regulator (general market) from Spector Off Road. I don't get how it can work for the general market and not for Canadian models. Like I said, the plug should be the only difference. But, so far, it doesn't work for me.

 

[bj40green]

Thanks for the reply, Rudi!

Sorry, I'm not following you here. So, is there a Toyota replacement for 27700-57030 with the round plug? For that matter, is there any VR that would work?

I think that both are the same but only the plugs are different. Green round 6 wire plug versus Black rectangular 6 wire plug. Maybe somebody who did this swap can chime in?

Sorry, I mis-spoke a little in my above post. Its not my engine fuse that blows. I have a 30 amp fuse instead of the fusible links (from the PO). It is this fuse that blew as soon as I turned the key. So, battery power goes through it, to the alternator and through the VR. I can run it no problem (albeit without charging) with no voltage regulator. Its only when I plug in Spector Off Road's VR and turn the key on that the fuse blows.

OK so you didn't blow the "engine" fuse in the fuse block but only the fusible link (in your case the 30 Amp fuse in the charge wire).
Hmmmmm, let me think about this.

As far as mixing up the wires on the alternator, it is only 1 plug and 1 wire. Pretty much impossible to mix up unless the people that rebuilt my alternator mixed them up somehow. But they said they tested it and it was good. They also have a very good reputation.

There is one wire named B (goes to the battery) and there is the plug with 3 wires on the alternator which end up on your firewall in the 6 wire green round plug to the regulator. My question is; did they a full test with a VR connected or just a test to see if it is charging? If they do the latter they just apply 24V to the F wire to see if it's charging.
I don't have a correct wiring diagram for a BJ42 here but i'll start looking for it. I come back on this later.

So, to me, it still comes back to the voltage regulator. I know I am trying to swap plugs, but that shouldn't matter. The internals of the voltage regulator should work the same. What I don't get is that they SOR VR does not meet the specs given in the B Series Engine Manual. Which brings me back to my question of, does anyone have one of these and does it work? And finally, is there a suitable replacement for this voltage regulator?

The FSM is loaded with errors, so don't rely to much on it. Ask me how I know.

I'll be back later.

Rudi

 

[bj40green]

Back again. I've spend a few hours on researching 24V charge systems for late 70's - early 80's BJ's, HJ's and FJ's and all work with basicly the same 6 wire Voltage Regulator. There are little differences like yes or no charge light, housing and connectors, but they all work on the same mechanical principle.
I can't see a situation in which the VR is responsable for blowing the Fusible Link. (From now on I call your 30 Amp floating fuse the fusible link)

That brings me back to the beginning of this thread. You wrote:
"About a month ago, I blew my alternator and external voltage regulator." so my question is: What happened or was the situation at that moment. I have the idea that whatever caused "the blow up" is still there and is causing you all this trouble. What did the repair guys tell you was wrong with the alternator?
Stator burned, rotor burned, brushes, rectifier diodes? That's all the parts there is in an alternator with external VR.

Or.............
You also wrote: "I plug it in, turn the key, and it blows my engine fuse." That same fuse works also the other way. All the current to everything that needs power (except the starter) is passing by that same fuse. When you start the engine (with the blown fuse) does everything work? Headlights, wiper, brake lights and so on. Does the fuse also blow when the VR is not connected and you turn the key?
Maybe the alternator and the VR are ok but you have a short somewhere that's causing the fuse to blow when you turn the key?

Curious to your answers.

Rudi

 

[FF LC FREAK]

Okay, I'll do my best to answer your questions.

I think that both are the same but only the plugs are different. Green round 6 wire plug versus Black rectangular 6 wire plug. Maybe somebody who did this swap can chime in?

Yes, both 6 wire plugs and according to FSM the prongs of the plug are in the same location. The only difference is round vs rectangular.

OK so you didn't blow the "engine" fuse in the fuse block but only the fusible link (in your case the 30 Amp fuse in the charge wire).
Hmmmmm, let me think about this.


There is one wire named B (goes to the battery) and there is the plug with 3 wires on the alternator which end up on your firewall in the 6 wire green round plug to the regulator. My question is; did they a full test with a VR connected or just a test to see if it is charging? If they do the latter they just apply 24V to the F wire to see if it's charging.
I don't have a correct wiring diagram for a BJ42 here but i'll start looking for it. I come back on this later.

They did not test the full charging system. I only took them the alternator to have them rebuild it. I'll come back to this momentarily.

The FSM is loaded with errors, so don't rely to much on it. Ask me how I know.

I don't doubt this. However, the part regarding the voltage regulator testing seems to be correct. I tested my regulator about a year ago and it tested out perfect according to the FSM. At that time, it was the alternator that needed to be rebuilt.

I'll be back later.

Rudi

Back again. I've spend a few hours on researching 24V charge systems for late 70's - early 80's BJ's, HJ's and FJ's and all work with basicly the same 6 wire Voltage Regulator. There are little differences like yes or no charge light, housing and connectors, but they all work on the same mechanical principle.
I can't see a situation in which the VR is responsable for blowing the Fusible Link. (From now on I call your 30 Amp floating fuse the fusible link)

That brings me back to the beginning of this thread. You wrote:
"About a month ago, I blew my alternator and external voltage regulator." so my question is: What happened or was the situation at that moment. I have the idea that whatever caused "the blow up" is still there and is causing you all this trouble. What did the repair guys tell you was wrong with the alternator?
Stator burned, rotor burned, brushes, rectifier diodes? That's all the parts there is in an alternator with external VR.

Okay, here's the story. I was on a multi day back country trip. Driving along in a convoy of other Land Cruisers, I started smelling an electrical smell. I had several electronic devices plugged in, so I started checking them. I finally noticed that my charge light was on, so I pulled off as soon as I could to check under the hood. That's when I found the wire on top of my alternator (B lug or battery feed to the alternator) had rubbed the insulation off the wire and shorted to the body of the alternator. Wanting to get back on the road quickly, I just taped that wire up and out of the way and did not disconnect the plug on the back of the alternator. I now know that was the wrong thing to do. Not much further down the road, I smelled electrical again and found the inside of my alternator glowing. I then unplugged it the rest of the way.

Once back, I took the alternator into the place that rebuilt it before. They knew exactly what happened as soon as they looked at it. I did not take the vehicle in to them, only the alternator. When I got home with the rebuilt alternator, I plugged it in, started up and the charge light was still on. I checked the voltage and it was at 31 and still rising. I quickly shut down and checked the VR according to the FSM. It showed up as faulty.

At that point, I started looking for a new VR. Apparently, they are no longer available from Toyota. As I wrote before, SOR has one that works for 24v but has a different plug. That's what brings me to now. I can't get the SOR VR to work. If I plug in my old VR, it won't control the voltage, but it doesn't blow the fuse/fusible link either. If I plug in the SOR VR, the fuse/fusible link blows. If I take out the VR, everything works fine, but it obviously doesn't charge.

Or.............
You also wrote: "I plug it in, turn the key, and it blows my engine fuse." That same fuse works also the other way. All the current to everything that needs power (except the starter) is passing by that same fuse. When you start the engine (with the blown fuse) does everything work? Headlights, wiper, brake lights and so on. Does the fuse also blow when the VR is not connected and you turn the key?
Maybe the alternator and the VR are ok but you have a short somewhere that's causing the fuse to blow when you turn the key?

Curious to your answers.

Rudi

Okay, hopefully that gives you some insight. I'm still thinking that it is the Spector Off Road voltage regulator. That is the only thing that changed when the fuse started blowing. And since I a "altered" the SOR regulator, it could possible cause problems.

As I wrote before, I talked with Dan at 4 Wheel Auto (Canadian Land Cruiser shop). He is sending me an aftermarket regulator that he says will work. I'm really hoping that will take care of my problem by having a "known" workable solution. The SOR VR is basically an unknown. I did a search on Mud and have not seen anyone that has swapped plugs. If my problem persists, I'll be back asking more questions.

Thanks for your help!

 

[jdb3]

When mine went south to be rebuilt I learned that there are many other 24 volt regulators used on aircraft. So you may be able to fit one of them on your BJ. Jim

 

[bj40green]

As I wrote before, I talked with Dan at 4 Wheel Auto (Canadian Land Cruiser shop). He is sending me an aftermarket regulator that he says will work. I'm really hoping that will take care of my problem by having a "known" workable solution. The SOR VR is basically an unknown. I did a search on Mud and have not seen anyone that has swapped plugs. If my problem persists, I'll be back asking more questions.

Thanks for your help!

Hi FF,

How did you solve the problem? New regulator? Which brand, what model?

Rudi

 

[FF LC FREAK]

Hi Rudi!

I just responded to Cruisernerd's recent post. I used a VR from 4 Wheel Auto for about 6 months. It worked okay, but I lost some of the functionality that I liked, such as the idiot light on the dash for low voltage. I could have wired in a volt gauge, but never bothered. Instead, I found someone that was converting from 24 volts to 12 volts and got an OEM VR (Thanks DBradford!). It has been working great ever since!