Anyone buy a 2018 recently?

[coleAK]

I sold Porsche part time when I was in professional school and part of my first year of residency (crazy I know). To answer the why don’t car salesmen know more about the product - most of them don’t stay at any given dealer very long. Extremely high employee turnover in general. The owners of the Porsche dealer also had (if I remember correctly) - Toyota, Lexus, Audi, jag, LR, nissian, infinity, VW, Subaru. They had new salesman classes every month and from what I remember well more than half the sales staff didn’t last 6 months. I was there 5 years and only 1 salesman from the Porsche, Lexus, Audi, jag, LR, infinity side had been there longer then I had.

 

[M1911]

I sold Porsche part time when I was in professional school and part of my first year of residency (crazy I know). To answer the why don’t car salesmen know more about the product - most of them don’t stay at any given dealer very long. Extremely high employee turnover in general. The owners of the Porsche dealer also had (if I remember correctly) - Toyota, Lexus, Audi, jag, LR, nissian, infinity, VW, Subaru. They had new salesman classes every month and from what I remember well more than half the sales staff didn’t last 6 months. I was there 5 years and only 1 salesman from the Porsche, Lexus, Audi, jag, LR, infinity side had been there longer then I had.

From what I’ve read, 100% turn over per year is typical.

 

[linuxgod]

I asked who else is going to walk in here for a 88K vehicle with cash and doesn't need multiple financiers, without a trade in and dual insurance riders to get this deal done.. OH yeah... that's exactly what you want so you can play your hidden numbers games... SEE YA!.. he followed me out the door saying "sir please come back in and lets look at the numbers again... I'm sure we can get this deal done.." I said not today your not.

There's your "problem", you weren't willing to finance.

FWIW if you're willing to finance, and let them screw you on the rate, just verify there's no prepayment penalty then take the loan and then go pay it off after you walk out the door. Dealer's will be willing to give you several hundred $ more off if they see you as a financing mark.

My wife's mother's second husband ("stepfather-in-law" technically but my wife refused to refer to him as that) was a sleazy car finance guy for year. I'm not saying all car finance guys are sleazy, but this guy was. He knew all the tricks:

• Dealer's get a kickback from the bank based on volume they route through the bank. By you financing they end up pocketing a few hundred dollars. Some banks may not pay them the kickback if you finance and then immediately pay off your loan, but the dealer finance won't know you're going to do that when you sign the paperwork
• Dealer's can get a kickback and/or points (a percentage cut) when you finance if they inflate your financing rate. i.e. you might be eligible for a 5% rate, but they make it 5.5% or 6% and take the premium. Again if you finance and then immediate pay off the loan they will think they're making $ on the deal
• Finance pitches the extended warranties, paint protection, tire and rim protection, etc. For extended warranties, markup typically starts at about 2.5 to 3x what they will actually sell it for. You're not buying these on a new vehicle but I'm just including here for reference.

He had a bunch of other sleazy tactics I don't entirely recall. He never said he would pull tricks like calling up a buyer a few days later and telling them their loan didn't go through and they'd need to return the vehicle or pay a higher rate, but I have no doubt he did that kind of crap.

 

[mooneywa]

I sold Porsche part time when I was in professional school and part of my first year of residency (crazy I know). To answer the why don’t car salesmen know more about the product - most of them don’t stay at any given dealer very long. Extremely high employee turnover in general. The owners of the Porsche dealer also had (if I remember correctly) - Toyota, Lexus, Audi, jag, LR, nissian, infinity, VW, Subaru. They had new salesman classes every month and from what I remember well more than half the sales staff didn’t last 6 months. I was there 5 years and only 1 salesman from the Porsche, Lexus, Audi, jag, LR, infinity side had been there longer then I had.

I just think it’s laziness. Most of us are “car guys” and probably would know what options are what and how and where on all of those mfgs. If you didn’t know you’d probably learn quickly just out of interest and curiosity. I’d suspect most guys are told that they’ll just be able to sell as soon as they talk to a customer and are not self motivated enough to be a knowledgable sales person. If you’re motivated enough to sell cars during residency, you’re pretty motivated period!

I have never needed a salesperson to do anything except process the transaction. I researched what I wanted long before I ever made a phone call and I haven’t bought a car locally (within 200 miles) in 17 years. I just take the salesman out of the equation - here’s what I’ll pay for said car. Take it or leave it. And all but once they’ve taken it.

I’ve also found that the more “high volume” a dealer is, the more unknowledgable and impersonal the transaction is. That usually is both service and sales. I bought my cruiser from a very small dealer in Ohio and the sales manager came and introduced himself and we talked an extra 30 min about cruisers, sales of cruisers, etc. And I don’t think I paid anymore there than I would have at the mega dealers closer to me.

 

[mooneywa]

There's your "problem", you weren't willing to finance.

FWIW if you're willing to finance, and let them screw you on the rate, just verify there's no prepayment penalty then take the loan and then go pay it off after you walk out the door. Dealer's will be willing to give you several hundred $ more off if they see you as a financing mark.

My wife's mother's second husband ("stepfather-in-law" technically but my wife refused to refer to him as that) was a sleazy car finance guy for year. I'm not saying all car finance guys are sleazy, but this guy was. He knew all the tricks:

• Dealer's get a kickback from the bank based on volume they route through the bank. By you financing they end up pocketing a few hundred dollars. Some banks may not pay them the kickback if you finance and then immediately pay off your loan, but the dealer finance won't know you're going to do that when you sign the paperwork
• Dealer's can get a kickback and/or points (a percentage cut) when you finance if they inflate your financing rate. i.e. you might be eligible for a 5% rate, but they make it 5.5% or 6% and take the premium. Again if you finance and then immediate pay off the loan they will think they're making $ on the deal
• Finance pitches the extended warranties, paint protection, tire and rim protection, etc. For extended warranties, markup typically starts at about 2.5 to 3x what they will actually sell it for. You're not buying these on a new vehicle but I'm just including here for reference.

He had a bunch of other sleazy tactics I don't entirely recall. He never said he would pull tricks like calling up a buyer a few days later and telling them their loan didn't go through and they'd need to return the vehicle or pay a higher rate, but I have no doubt he did that kind of crap.

Strangely on the cruiser I had a loan all set up with USAA to pay for part of it so it was going to appear to be a cash transaction as far as the dealer was concerned (and the price was already very fair). They asked if I would be interested in financing through them and I agreed if they can beat USAA’s rate, it’s a legitimate banking institution, and there’s no pre-payment penalty. They cut a point and a quarter off and were well under 1% total and it was through Capital One. It was surprising how well it turned out considering dealers in general.

 

[coleAK]

I just think it’s laziness. Most of us are “car guys” and probably would know what options are what and how and where on all of those mfgs. If you didn’t know you’d probably learn quickly just out of interest and curiosity. I’d suspect most guys are told that they’ll just be able to sell as soon as they talk to a customer and are not self motivated enough to be a knowledgable sales person. If you’re motivated enough to sell cars during residency, you’re pretty motivated period!

I have never needed a salesperson to do anything except process the transaction. I researched what I wanted long before I ever made a phone call and I haven’t bought a car locally (within 200 miles) in 17 years. I just take the salesman out of the equation - here’s what I’ll pay for said car. Take it or leave it. And all but once they’ve taken it.

I’ve also found that the more “high volume” a dealer is, the more unknowledgable and impersonal the transaction is. That usually is both service and sales. I bought my cruiser from a very small dealer in Ohio and the sales manager came and introduced himself and we talked an extra 30 min about cruisers, sales of cruisers, etc. And I don’t think I paid anymore there than I would have at the mega dealers closer to me.

I agree 100% it’s laziness. Being a life long “car guy” (I joke car addict in recovery) I was able to get a job selling Porsche at 23 with no car sales experience because I did my research and knew the product.

From my limited knowledge of the industry from 20 years ago typically there are a handful of sales staff that have been there a while, work every day and make $$$$. Every year at our employee awards sales numbers were announced, I was always amazed in my dealer group the top sales guy (same one every year, Toyota) made $500-600k a year (20 years ago no joke), there were 5-10% of the sales staff that made >$100. The remaining 90-95% made <$40k and most of them had been there <1 year.

At my local Toyota/Lexus dealer I know a really good sales guy and the sales manager is awsome. They are a fairly large high volume dealer and the only one within a 7 hour drive.

 

[texas]

Thanks guys.