I have seen some of the 4x4 vans around, and was thinking it would be a good expo rig.
Any thoughts?
Any thoughts?
Anybody have a Toyota 4x4 Van for expo?
- Thread starter hawkeye
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Wits' End
Cannot think of a vehicle that is more easily stolen. My brother use to be one of those joy riding dick head teenagers and he said those were the vehicle of choice because he could load up a bunch of people and just use a pair of orange scissors to get into the truck and start it.
The have crap transmissions and torque converters. OTHER than those things, its was actually a cool little van.
The have crap transmissions and torque converters. OTHER than those things, its was actually a cool little van.
When you talk about an expo rig Im thinking trips involving thousands of klms
The safety outlook in a collision is pretty miserable.
They can chew through a lot of juice at highway speeds.
Engne is hard to work on without removing the front seats.
The diesel models have a "C" diesel and they have a varied reputation
Really rough terrain will bend the unibody.
The good points is they are quite roomy inside and can take 6 adults.
Ok for weekends away that dont involve long distance, heavy loads or high speed.
Ok if you know exactly what you are getting.
I would second the theft quote above. My buddy had one we used to take to mexico and camp out of it. I beleive it was stolen and recovered 4 separate times in 2 years, the final was a total loss. He had over 200 k miles on it driving back and forth to san diego and santa cruz without much problem. The ignition got jacked up so much you could take the keys out while driving, and the auto transmission shifter did not require you to push the button to shift. While driving it once i actually had it accidentally shift in reverse while slowing down and having gear hit the shifter and put into reverse. seemed pretty bullet proof overall.
I would say a 4x4 diesel Toyota Hiace van would be my first choice if I were to do it all again.
There are a lot of reasons, but the main one is living comfort. If you're on any long-term expedition, I think it's hard to modify a large SUV to equal the comfort level you can get in a small van... comfort matters after a while on the road, and can save you a lot of money.
An expo modified SUV probably can't take passengers as it likely will have no back seats... the comfy little van can. It's nice to share your adventures.
From where I've been parts availability is massive for these little vans as they're everywhere outside Canada and the US.
Nobody's going to steal it if you're in a third world country because it will blend in as 80% of the taxis/small buses are the exact same van. Likewise cops won't hassle you as much... you'll blend in and that is a massive asset. All you have to do is not put lots of stickers on it and paint a huge world map on the side!
They're tough little suckers. If you don't believe me, drive from Georgetown to Brazil... it's a very long, very rough road through the jungle in the middle of nowhere and these vans are what is used for the local buses... that alone would convince me.
If it's white, you can keep a magnetic red cross with you for "worst case scenario" situations and pretend you're an ambulance... (would work for an expo 70 troopie too as long as you have no junk on the outside).
The one really off-putting point was mentioned above - accident safety. I really like having like 3 feet of steel and engine block between me and oncoming traffic.
Anyway, that's my opinion... I guess as usual it all depends on your defenition of expedition, and what you're planning to do (ie cross deserts for weeks, or continents for years).
There are a lot of reasons, but the main one is living comfort. If you're on any long-term expedition, I think it's hard to modify a large SUV to equal the comfort level you can get in a small van... comfort matters after a while on the road, and can save you a lot of money.
An expo modified SUV probably can't take passengers as it likely will have no back seats... the comfy little van can. It's nice to share your adventures.
From where I've been parts availability is massive for these little vans as they're everywhere outside Canada and the US.
Nobody's going to steal it if you're in a third world country because it will blend in as 80% of the taxis/small buses are the exact same van. Likewise cops won't hassle you as much... you'll blend in and that is a massive asset. All you have to do is not put lots of stickers on it and paint a huge world map on the side!
They're tough little suckers. If you don't believe me, drive from Georgetown to Brazil... it's a very long, very rough road through the jungle in the middle of nowhere and these vans are what is used for the local buses... that alone would convince me.
If it's white, you can keep a magnetic red cross with you for "worst case scenario" situations and pretend you're an ambulance... (would work for an expo 70 troopie too as long as you have no junk on the outside).
The one really off-putting point was mentioned above - accident safety. I really like having like 3 feet of steel and engine block between me and oncoming traffic.
Anyway, that's my opinion... I guess as usual it all depends on your defenition of expedition, and what you're planning to do (ie cross deserts for weeks, or continents for years).
Also, you can probably buy like 20 bare-bones models of these vans for the cost of an expo modified cruiser.
I have a feeling the "Toyo van" we get in canada and the US are not the same as the HiAce vans I'm thinking of though...?
I have a feeling the "Toyo van" we get in canada and the US are not the same as the HiAce vans I'm thinking of though...?
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Correct,the one pictured above a is based on a LiteAce ,which is lighter duty version.
I actually have one of these vans, right now it is my work/play vehicle, but I have plans of expo'ing it out one of these days. There are some misconceptions thrown around here so far.
1. To get a good working 4wd van is not going to be cheap as they are getting pretty rare.
2. Don't know about the autos, but the 5spd transmissions are pretty tough and come with a 2 spd transfercase. The 4wd automatics (at least in the U.S.) only came with a push button 4hi. However, the 2spd case from a 5spd can be made to fit an auto.
3. They actually get pretty good gas mileage. I am a tile contractor and my van is my main work vehicle, it is always loaded with tools, saws, supplies, tile, etc...., most of my driving in it is "in town" type driving, and I consistently get 21 mpg. If I get a job that's farther out and do more highway driving, I easily get 24-25mpg. When I bought the van and drove it home to CA, one tank of gas I got 27mpg.
4. They have a 1700 # payload which isn't bad. They aren't fast by any means but the little 2.2L 4YEC is a good little motor. The biggest problem they have is keeping them running cool due to the radiator placement. Therefore, you really have to stay on top of your whole cooling system to make sure it stays cool. When I go to expo mine, I will be adding another cooler with its own fan either up front somewhere, or whereever it will fit.
Like was already pointed out, they are easy to steal just like the toyota trucks of the same time period. I will be installing a kill switch in mine real soon and definately would before anytype of expedition trip.
The motor can be a royal pain to work on sometimes, if you need to do much more than change/check fluids. Good thing is, if you were to use it to travel to mexico and farther south, parts are in abundance down there. Parts are slightly harder to find here and most guys I know who are really into their van, have 1 or 2 parts vans.
I try not to think about head on collisions when I'm driving mine.
Still doesn't keep me from having a perma-grin when I'm driving it though! I've had mine on some decent 4wd trails, and due to their weight distribution they climb hills like a goat. I've also had mine out in the dunes quite a few times. Aired down to 12psi, and had no problems. Some of you at last year's SnT probably saw me driving out during the poker run. 
Mine has 213,000+miles on it right now and it's still trucking. It leaks some oil, but still pulls really well doing daily duty as a work vehicle. It is very common to see these go 300,000+ Mine's an '89 and I bought it last year with 205,000+ On the drive home, the temp needle started to rise a little while on I15 while it was close to 100* out. Was able to keep the temp at a respectable level with the heater running and made it home just fine. Even drove it through part of the Mojave Trail that way, just to get off the freeway for a bit. Anyways, I was already planning on going over the whole cooling system anyways, as I knew one of the problems was the fan clutch. Got home took the WP off and it was the original waterpump TEQ stamp on it and everything! You can guarantee, that I bucked up the cash to put another toyota waterpump on there, considering the original lasted that long.
Well now I'm just rambling, here is a link to my van with more facts.
UltimateYota.com - 89 Toyota Van Deluxe 4wd 5spd
Soda Lake Bed, on the Mojave Trail
1. To get a good working 4wd van is not going to be cheap as they are getting pretty rare.
2. Don't know about the autos, but the 5spd transmissions are pretty tough and come with a 2 spd transfercase. The 4wd automatics (at least in the U.S.) only came with a push button 4hi. However, the 2spd case from a 5spd can be made to fit an auto.
3. They actually get pretty good gas mileage. I am a tile contractor and my van is my main work vehicle, it is always loaded with tools, saws, supplies, tile, etc...., most of my driving in it is "in town" type driving, and I consistently get 21 mpg. If I get a job that's farther out and do more highway driving, I easily get 24-25mpg. When I bought the van and drove it home to CA, one tank of gas I got 27mpg.
4. They have a 1700 # payload which isn't bad. They aren't fast by any means but the little 2.2L 4YEC is a good little motor. The biggest problem they have is keeping them running cool due to the radiator placement. Therefore, you really have to stay on top of your whole cooling system to make sure it stays cool. When I go to expo mine, I will be adding another cooler with its own fan either up front somewhere, or whereever it will fit.
Like was already pointed out, they are easy to steal just like the toyota trucks of the same time period. I will be installing a kill switch in mine real soon and definately would before anytype of expedition trip.
The motor can be a royal pain to work on sometimes, if you need to do much more than change/check fluids. Good thing is, if you were to use it to travel to mexico and farther south, parts are in abundance down there. Parts are slightly harder to find here and most guys I know who are really into their van, have 1 or 2 parts vans.
I try not to think about head on collisions when I'm driving mine.
Still doesn't keep me from having a perma-grin when I'm driving it though! I've had mine on some decent 4wd trails, and due to their weight distribution they climb hills like a goat. I've also had mine out in the dunes quite a few times. Aired down to 12psi, and had no problems. Some of you at last year's SnT probably saw me driving out during the poker run. Mine has 213,000+miles on it right now and it's still trucking. It leaks some oil, but still pulls really well doing daily duty as a work vehicle. It is very common to see these go 300,000+ Mine's an '89 and I bought it last year with 205,000+ On the drive home, the temp needle started to rise a little while on I15 while it was close to 100* out. Was able to keep the temp at a respectable level with the heater running and made it home just fine. Even drove it through part of the Mojave Trail that way, just to get off the freeway for a bit. Anyways, I was already planning on going over the whole cooling system anyways, as I knew one of the problems was the fan clutch. Got home took the WP off and it was the original waterpump TEQ stamp on it and everything! You can guarantee, that I bucked up the cash to put another toyota waterpump on there, considering the original lasted that long.
Well now I'm just rambling, here is a link to my van with more facts.
UltimateYota.com - 89 Toyota Van Deluxe 4wd 5spd
Soda Lake Bed, on the Mojave Trail
About dang time you posted up in this thread Chris...and whoa, a lot of info there. 
As for the cooling, on a pal's in Gunajuato, he used an exterior scoop/cooler/fan setup similar to VW van setups.
Haha, yeah a little birdy let me know about the thread. 
They really are cool little machines, but one more thing I should add. If you do get one, it is better if you are prepared to work on it yourself. Mechanics hate to work on them and usually will give inflated estimates for work so that you will go away. Good news is that they are simple engines to work on similar to a 22RE but just harder to get to everything.
Like everything else, there is a forum for them. ToyotaVanPeople.com • Index page
My dream expo van would be a dual tank (bio and regular diesel), mitsubishi delica. Similar size and stuff to the toy van, but have more options for lifts, aftermarket accesories, etc...
They really are cool little machines, but one more thing I should add. If you do get one, it is better if you are prepared to work on it yourself. Mechanics hate to work on them and usually will give inflated estimates for work so that you will go away. Good news is that they are simple engines to work on similar to a 22RE but just harder to get to everything.
Like everything else, there is a forum for them. ToyotaVanPeople.com • Index page
My dream expo van would be a dual tank (bio and regular diesel), mitsubishi delica. Similar size and stuff to the toy van, but have more options for lifts, aftermarket accesories, etc...
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have heard that the engines in these last longer than 20R/22R because it is basically a forklift engine or some other industrial application engine, to be able to fit it into that tiny spot under the front seats.
Chris’s van is really awesome. I had a chance to check it out at Pismo last year.
The HiAce is a fantastic van as well. My parents had a '78 model while we lived in the Philippines. It was a stripped down model with the 4 cylinder gas motor (18r?) and manual trans. They hauled about a ton worth of equipment up and down the mountains, and the van never gave them any problems. There were a few moments where they though they would lose the van in the ocean while driving over planks and onto ferries, but that's a whole other story.
HiAces are all over Mexico, as well as the Nissan vans (forgot what they were called). Some folks on expeditionportal also use the VW Syncro (iirc, that's what it is called), although I don't know much about their reliability.
Anyways, just my $.02.
The HiAce is a fantastic van as well. My parents had a '78 model while we lived in the Philippines. It was a stripped down model with the 4 cylinder gas motor (18r?) and manual trans. They hauled about a ton worth of equipment up and down the mountains, and the van never gave them any problems. There were a few moments where they though they would lose the van in the ocean while driving over planks and onto ferries, but that's a whole other story.
HiAces are all over Mexico, as well as the Nissan vans (forgot what they were called). Some folks on expeditionportal also use the VW Syncro (iirc, that's what it is called), although I don't know much about their reliability.
Anyways, just my $.02.
I love those things and probably would have bought one if I would have found one in good shape with low miles before I found my 80. They are really capable with just a little work and are, largely, very stout. Then there is the interior space .... NICE. I spent many a hour on YouTube watching those things (and syncro vanagon's) conduct off-road antics far above and beyond anything a minivan should be able to pull off. Yeah, you can't work on the engine without pulling the front seats, but they are pretty easy to pull.
I'd say go for it, I think for 95% of expedition travel, they would be ideal.
I'd say go for it, I think for 95% of expedition travel, they would be ideal.
I'd second a Hiace. Many of the diesel JDM ones are sold off to buyers in Africa to become public transport. Those little vans go the distance and carry lots of people on that continent. But if you want a fully capable 4x4, then as Josh says a modded 70 series would be my pick: rock solid and simple.
The actual name in Latin America is TownAce, the LiteAce is the cheaper version with manual windows and carb engine
The Liteace came with many options and trims including a diesel engine with or without factory turbo and also the 3Y-EU EFI engine.
Toyota Lite Ace (used and new) - specs and pics at AMAYAMA.COM The diesel engine models were/are prone to head issues.
Hi! That is my old van! Funny to have randomly stumbled across it. This one was manual 5 speed with hi/lo manual transfercase. Feel free to ask any questions!
