Air Filter preference

[DMX84]

Two of my rigs runs conical filters that clamp around a tube. With the LC, I'm using the drop in filter. As for the guy with the jeep, it's hard to say what his problem is. Could be improper installation of the drop in, i.e. not properly seated or ???

With as much dust as he was showing inside the tube, the front side of the filter should have been black. It looks properly oiled based on the color.

I'm pretty impressed with how much gunk builds up on the exterior of the filter. I clean mine at least yearly, if not sooner if they start to get dirty. Mine are all clean right now. I wish I'd taken a picture before I cleaned them.

Adam

I tend to agree that allot of problems are due to improper cleaning of the filters.
Thats part of the problem with them. Too much oil at craps up the sensors, not enough lets dirt in.
DMX

 

[ZJ2UZJ100]

I first bought K&N for the Jeep ZJ 5.2L when I was under the impression I would get MORE POWER!!!!!.

But it fell far short of my expectations. No extra kick in the pants. If it added 1 or 2 horsepower, I couldn't feel it. The downside was having to clean this $45 filter. That takes time and makes some minor amount of mess. After 3 times, I felt I broke even on costs, but decided it wasn't worth the hassle.

Compared to buying $25-30ish paper media filters, the bang was not worth the extra bucks, or time to maintain the K&N. So I have decided to stick to stock OE air filters from now on. They have pretty thick media. They are cheap and easy to swap out, no mess, no extra hassles, no worrying about fouling MAFs or whether dirt is bypassing the gauze because of dusty road conditions.

When I pull out the used one, I see the dark grey color of the cotton on the prefiltered outside, and the contrast with the still-very-white postfiltered side. That tells me the filter has been doing its job.

 

[2001LC]

I've run K&N's for the last 15 years or so. All of my vehicles run them without any issues.

To dispell some of the negative claims about K&N's letting dirt get through, I started smearing a thin layer of clear grease on the inside of the intake tubing (just a small area). I've never found any discoloring or grit on this grease.

my .02

Adam

Hi Adam

The grease test is smart of you.

How long and under what condition have you been running the grease test?

2001LC

 

[DMX84]

Hi, I am new member to this site and want to ask peoples exeprience with K & N air filters vs. OEM.

Thanks

BTW-welcome to Mud from New Mexico....as you can see it don't take much for us to debate around here.
It's all fun, so make yourself at home.

 

[2001LC]

True, they do see the same amount of dirt, however the K&N will allow more dirt to get in – by design. This is to increase horsepower. Engines are large air pumps and if you restrict air in (or out) it holds the potential HP down.
Other wise we all would use hepa filters. We all know there is nothing better than a good hepa filter, but hepa filters are restrictive and will hurt hp ratings & economy.

There is only two ways to increase airflow. Increase physical size of the filter eliminates.
(Pleats help to increase square inches)
Or lessen the filtration ability.
So take your pick.

The argument is the oil will catch the dirt. Well it helps. But the large openings in the gaze still will let dirt by. Notice how K&N say the more dirt that is on the filter the better it filters?


2001LC
K&N filter.
No stock air filter makes that claim? Should they?
Run the K&N long enough it will filter as good as a stock filter!
Using K& N’s idea, a dirty stock filter = hepa.




Partly BS/hype - they claim it flows more air, and that it does.

Hi DMX,

I must admit the fact K&N states "not to clean the filter to often" recommendation has troubled me; I think its 20,000 miles or more between cleaning.

The element on the K&N looks to have more physical size as it has more pleats.
Are you saying the more pleats reduces the filtration ability?

I'm talking about the series 100 were the filters look the same size and the K&N has about twice the pleats giving it about twice the surface area. I've not set them side by side only notice the OEM at the dealers parts show room, they may be thicker I don't know.

 

[Abe Nitro]

paper always works well the other stuff is hype....

Sorry, wrong answer, I have dealt with a wet paper filter on a toyota truck and wet paper does not work, let alone work well....

 

[zmw100]

man... this seems to be fairly controversial - but Ihave run K&N's and more often than not the entire intake systems on my vehicles for nearly 15 years... I had planned on doing the same on the LC but not if i am going to be the laughing stock

I honestly think this is one of those polarizing subjects that just seems to depend on personal experience, I have had a fantastic experience with K&N filters and intakes, including measureable dyno proven increases in performance on many of my vehicles - But I know how to wash them and oil them and am well acquainted with the process, in fact I clean and oil mine straight out of the factory seal because they quite often come with far too much oil in their pre-oiled state...

Paper filters are just as good, maybe even better at filtration - I would just question whether many of us drive in conditions often enough that it makes ANY difference. I put over 60k miles on a subaru with a k&n and didn't clean/oil it once - however I often removed the entire intake system and I never saw anything beyond the filter... no dust, no debree... If I had to guess many of the complaints revolve around improper installation and or lack of experience with cleaning and oiling...

I've had this conversation before with many people and I often liken it to cleaning/oiling a gun... Many people want to use the crappy all in one cleaner/oiler stuff - which don't get me wrong, works fine - but must be repeated frequently to prevent smoke stacking - however a properly cleaned gun that is set to dry and then oiled and worked properly will remain functioning and operational for hundeds more rounds...

If people clean and oil their K&N's PROPERLY and install the instakes PROPERLY they should have no problems on them. My Diesel Dodge sucked WAY WAY more air than this 4.7L v8 ever could and i ran the piss out of that thing without a single spec of dust being visible on a highly polished intake tube that was practically big enough to put my head in...

I just don't buy the snake oil comments is all, k&n has been in business for a LONG time doing JUST air filters, they are fairly well respected amongst motor sports enthusiasts world wide it can't ALL Be snake oil...

-Z

 

[DMX84]

Hi DMX,

I must admit the fact K&N states "not to clean the filter to often" recommendation has troubled me; I think its 20,000 miles or more between cleaning.

The element on the K&N looks to have more physical size as it has more pleats.
Are you saying the more pleats reduces the filtration ability?

I'm talking about the series 100 were the filters look the same size and the K&N has about twice the pleats giving it about twice the surface area. I've not set them side by side only notice the OEM at the dealers parts show room, they may be thicker I don't know.

The more pleats the more square inches= more filter area. Don't get me wrong
they do flow, it's the size of the opening in the material that will let dirt pass.
I still won’t run one. They say don’t over clean it, because they claim it filters better with some dirt on them.
DMX

 

[2001LC]

I pulled the air sensor out of the air tube between filter and throttle body, looked much cleaner than one would expect with 100,000 miles. Almost look new with very little dust if any. Use cotton swab and head cleaner alcohol, pick up small amount of black grim from sensor wires. TLC has been driven 200 miles on dirt roads each year, sanded streets in winter and naturally dusty climate.

K&N filter for more than 40,000 miles (maybe closer to 100,000 miles)

K&N looking pretty good to me.

 

[jonah]

i like my k&n and i put them on every thing

2002 land crusher
2001s40 volvo
1991 yota flatbed
1994 yota pu
2000 ford f 450
2001 ford f 550
1998 dodge pu

all 4x4 but the volvo

 

[DMX84]

I pulled the air sensor out of the air tube between filter and throttle body, looked much cleaner than one would expect with 100,000 miles. Almost look new with very little dust if any. Use cotton swab and head cleaner alcohol, pick up small amount of black grim from sensor wires. TLC has been driven 200 miles on dirt roads each year, sanded streets in winter and naturally dusty climate.

K&N filter for more than 40,000 miles (maybe closer to 100,000 miles)

K&N looking pretty good to me.

That's what you can expect with K&N, it will allow that dirt to flow through, where the stock filter will keep it out. For the cost of these engines, I'll pay more now and live with any performance loss.
So, the argument here is if they are better.
Does K&N they flow better- Yes
Does K&N Filter better-no
Does K&N have a cost savings- if the engine needs to be replaced definitely not savings. IMO with the added wear your gas mileage will start suffering long before engine failure. With gas approaching new highs I doubt there will be any savings.
Do an analysis and let them show how much dirt got past the wire you cleaned. Your oil's most likely black too.

I'm glad you are happy with your K&N. I've replaced an engine to what I now believe to be K&N related.
Search my name here...I was a true believer in K&N and argued until I was blue in the face. I ended up eating my words (not something I'm proud of). I’m just trying to save you from doing the same thing! I'm really not an A$$hole.
Good luck to all you K&N fans.
I saved the trouble of searching, click here.
DMX

 

[2001LC]

That's what you can expect with K&N, it will allow that dirt to flow through, where the stock filter will keep it out. For the cost of these engines, I'll pay more now and live with any performance loss.
I’m just trying to save you from doing the same thing! I'm really not an A$$hole.
Good luck to all you K&N fans.
I saved the trouble of searching, click here.
DMX

I welcome your statements on none OEM filters, as i want what's best for my TLC as i plan on keeping it for 500,000> miles or until death do use part.

I don't think any filter would have done any better job keeping my air sensor any cleaner, it look very good for 100,000 miles. As no filter filters 100% do they?

 

[DMX84]

I welcome your statements on none OEM filters, as i want what's best for my TLC as i plan on keeping it for 500,000> miles or until death do use part.

I don't think any filter would have done any better job keeping my air sensor any cleaner, it look very good for 100,000 miles. As no filter filters 100% do they?

K&N’s are designed to flow more air, and to achieve this the filtration media is opened up. They claim it filters better, but it doesn’t. They claim it filters better when dirty….
DMX

 

[dtt255]

K&N’s are designed to flow more air, and to achieve this the filtration media is opened up. They claim it filters better, but it doesn’t. They claim it filters better when dirty….
DMX

Wow...thanks for this info... I just installed a k&n...will be removing it today!

 

[hoser]

I'll repost this air filter test.

http://duramax-diesel.com/spicer/index.htm

 

[2001LC]

DMX and hoser you have my attention

I'll repost this air filter test.

http://duramax-diesel.com/spicer/index.htm

Now that got my attention, looks like AC delco is the way to go, is that what the Toyota dealer has.

 

[hks3sgte]

Toyota uses NipponDenso air filters. For years and years and years in any kind of situation you can think of.

 

[CrusrDug]

Wow, $32 bucks for a air filter at Roseville Toyota! Denso site had it for 16 or so. No mark up there!!