1987 LJ70 frame swap + off road mods build thread (2 Viewers)

[Gubbtratt1]

Got started on new wiring for the rear lights today. Well, technically it is finished, but I haven't tested it yet, and when has any homemade wiring ever worked on the first try?

The old loom with all tape removed. I had several reasons to remake it: some wires were broken, I can't reuse the rear light plugs and the trailer plug was very badly installed.

Got the pins figured out (hopefully correctly).

And put all connections in an ip65 box with individual wires to everything. The relay is for the trailer fog light, in case I use the pin for something that uses more power than a 21w bulb, like halogen work lights or charging a caravan battery.

I then tried to double check the pins by checking for voltage on the plug on the car, but turns out neither of the ground pins are actually connected to ground. So, I get to chase loose contacts behind the dash tomorrow. How fun...

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Apparently there's a ground in the rear loom that I had forgotten I had cut off, and the two ground pins are for grounding stuff along the loom from the dash to the back. So, I added a ground, temporarily installed it and somehow everything works as it should. In fact, everything I've been able to test except the headlight washer, glow plugs and the dash lighting (possibly, might also just have been too bright outside for me to notice it) have worked perfectly. I still have to test the trailer plug, rear door stuff and reverse lights.

The snorkel is also taking shape. I'm using the exact same desing as my dad used to have on his Range Rover: some galvanised drain pipe, the cheapest "sport" air filter available and a plastic flower pot.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Got the rear wiper motor working. The wiper shaft was stuck to the outermost bushing. Pretty stupid design to not include any weatherproofing, but as long as it's used frequently it should be fine.

I then continued with the snorkel. Mounted it with rivnuts and started replacing the silicone at the seams. I already mentioned that it's the same design as on dad's range rover, but it's also the exact same pipe. I've got a new air filter and flower pot for obvious reasons though.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Speakers are installed.

I don't know if the radio is original and installed by the dealer or if it's some previous owner's work, but it wasn't very well done. The speakers were in the door trims and the radio was held in place with two different wood screws. I'll be keeping the wood screws, but as the old speakers needed replacing anyways I decided to mount the new ones in the dash where they should be.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

The superglow system might have worked perfectly all along.

The light washer problem was most likely the relay. I couldn't get it open to find anything broken, but I couldn't get continuity through it when applying 12v. I've learnt to not trust a multimeter when circuit boards are involved though. It could also have been that I never tried it with the lights turned on. I can't remember if I did. It works with a new relay though, and that's the important bit.

I also reinstalled the wings to get the wiring a bit more sorted out and protected.

As I had some boundaries of the engine bay laid out I put some thought into the placement of the batteries and the air tank. I currently have two 60Ah batteries for it, but 95Ah batteries would fit in the stock battery holders. What is stock / what does other twin battery Toyota owners have? 120Ah is already a lot for a car, 190 is getting ridiculous. If I also count the 95Ah battery I have planned for the trunk I'd get a maximum total of 285Ah. Would be useful for winching with a dead engine, I suppose. Over half an hour of winching at full load with my five ton electric winch.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Got started on the accessory wiring this weekend. Yesterday I sketched up a wiring diagram...

...and today I went shopping for supplies and started connecting stuff.

There's five relays and four fuses, plus the three in the power outlet box. I have 800 watts of extra lights alone (three 100w halogens, two 100w LEDs, six 18w work lights, one 55w work light, two 55 or 100w fog lights), so the two 10A and one 20A fuses in the power outlet isn't quite enough. 800w is getting close to the alternator capacity though, so I might downsize the halogens a bit to 2x100 or 3x55.

I made an aluminium panel for most accessory controls. From top left voltmeter for the rear battery, winch light, front fog light switch, compressor switch, front locker and rear locker, and room for four more switches. I'll also add a light for the work lights where the rubber grommet is, as well as some USB and/or 12v outlets, and one or two more rubber grommets for future lights. I also have winch in/out, work lights and LED extra light switches in empty spots on the stock dash, pneumatic valves will be on their own panel, and I'll get an 8 channel remote for raising and lowering the suspension and spooling the winch.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

The wiring work continues.

This far everything has worked on the first try. By "everything" I mean the work lights. The halogens and fog lights have no place to be mounted yet, I've lost a connector I need to wire up the LED bars and other parts of the car needs to get a bit more done for the rest of the wiring.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

The gearbox needs a rebuild. I mentioned earlier that if the problem turned out to be serious I'd source an entire 3B drivetrain, but those aren't really common and the 20€ I currently have available isn't really enough to buy one. So, a rebuild it is.

I had originally planned to remove the body from the old frame once I'm done welding, but as the gas bottle shows no signs of getting returned and I need to fix the gearbox I've decided to put the body on the new frame, roll the old frame into the 'garage', move the axles to the new frame, and roll the new frame into the tent. That way I can work on the gearbox, finish the welding, and engineer suspension and rear winch without having to move anything. Once all that is done I'll pick the body off the new frame, lay it on it's side and weld rock sliders, and send the frame off for galvanising.

I've booked a tractor with front loader to come pick off the body tomorrow, so today I've been working on disconnecting everything between the body and frame. Some body mounts had already done the job for me...

...but even the ones I had to remove normally were surprisingly easy.

To be able to engineer the suspension and rear bumper properly I need the body and frame on the right distance from each other. I'll install a small body lift, mostly to get the radiator out of the way of the pto shaft and to get the fuel tank a bit more protected. If I were to buy spacers from 4x4parts they would cost me 180€, so I decided to go to Biltema and buy eight hockey pucks for 20€ instead.

Two of them had to be made a bit smaller to fit the front mounts...

...but the rest just had to get holes drilled through.

The two rearmost mounts are also smaller diameter, but I think the full puck should fit.

I also got the compressor mounted in it's approximate spot. I think I'll try to get it a bit higher to get it further from the shock tower, and optimally it'd get a bit further forward, but then a wider part of the body gets next to the shock tower.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Today is the day when I finally got the body off the old frame.

I put it down on the new frame with the body lift spacers in place so I'll be able to engineer suspension and rear winch/bumper mounts once I get the axles off the old frame.

Once I get the old frame stripped down I'll cut it into pieces and save everything useful for future projects. You can never have enough scrap metal.

I found an old 7.50-20 tyre from my tractor caravan, diameter 89cm (35 inch). Lately I've been planning the suspension around 85cm tall tyres (33.5 inch), and I think that would look pretty perfect. I'd like to have CST CL18 in 275/85-16 or 265/85-16. I've found measured diameter of the 275s on a Russian forum at 87cm (34.5), but the 265s doesn't have a clear source, and the two unclear ones I've found differ a lot: 81cm (32) and 85cm (33.5).

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Yesterday I got the old frame rolled indoors, and today I got started on disassembling the transmission.

The oil was very dark and kind of green. I'm sure that's absolutely fantastic. At least it smelled like transmission oil.

I put the winch and new bumper on the new frame to see how everything fits. I was worried the bumper would be a bit too low with the body lift, but this far it seems fine. I'll have to modify the winch mount a bit more though to spool in on the underside of the drum, through the bumper. As I have a single speed PTO and the HJ60 the winch originally came from had a two speed PTO it spins the wrong way, which I realised after I was done modifying the mount and bumper to fit the 70 series frame.

 

[sadam_husain]

Yesterday I got the old frame rolled indoors, and today I got started on disassembling the transmission. View attachment 3917443
The oil was very dark and kind of green. I'm sure that's absolutely fantastic. At least it smelled like transmission oil. View attachment 3917444I put the winch and new bumper on the new frame to see how everything fits. I was worried the bumper would be a bit too low with the body lift, but this far it seems fine. I'll have to modify the winch mount a bit more though to spool in on the underside of the drum, through the bumper. As I have a single speed PTO and the HJ60 the winch originally came from had a two speed PTO it spins the wrong way, which I realised after I was done modifying the mount and bumper to fit the 70 series frame. View attachment 3917446

I put my PTO winch into an ARB bullbar and could only fit it with the cable spooling off the bottom of the drum, I've got a reversable direction PTO on my transfercase so I can spool in and out in first to fifth gear without having to use reverse on the main gearbox. If I didn't have the reversable PTO I'd be stuck winching in using reverse gear and spooling out in first to fifth gear which would be a pain in the ass

 

[Gubbtratt1]

I put my PTO winch into an ARB bullbar and could only fit it with the cable spooling off the bottom of the drum, I've got a reversable direction PTO on my transfercase so I can spool in and out in first to fifth gear without having to use reverse on the main gearbox. If I didn't have the reversable PTO I'd be stuck winching in using reverse gear and spooling out in first to fifth gear which would be a pain in the ass

I would like to have a pto with reverse, but I believe that even if I buy one it'll have the wrong bolt pattern, so I'll just move the fairlead instead. Before I bought the winch it was on a HJ61 (or possibly a HJ60 with a 12HT drivetrain swapped in) with the single speed PTO, but instead of winching in reverse or modifying something they had spooled the wire on the underside of the drum through the over drum fairlead.

The 70 series winch did spool on the underside through the bumper, so even though I'll be doing a lot of custom work it will end up closer to original. I've never seen a Bundera with a stock winch though, did they exist? Even in Finland where all 40, 60 and leaf sprung 70s got a PTO winch for tax reasons, the coil sprung 70s got just the PTO.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

Transmission seems to have fixed itself when I hammered the staked nut on the output shaft, so I decided to not proceed with disassembling the gearbox and just put it back together.

I then started working on the rear axle. It is a limited slip, but currently it slips quite a lot. After battling some rust I managed to get the carrier out...

...and after 16 more bolts I had the diff out and the ring gear removed.

Note to self (this is the only place I can be sure I find my notes): the pile of parts next to the vise were on the ring gear side of the diff.

Tomorrow or on tuesday I'll get the diff apart, to find hopefully fine but more likely completely worn out discs. If they need replacement I'll get an air locker instead, as new discs are ridiculously expensive. 500€ for new discs vs 750€ for an air locker.

 

[sadam_husain]

I've never found any toyota LSD's to be very good even after playing around with disc's and shimming them, personally I'd go air locker and I have done a long time ago, both my fj40 and fj75 have front and rear air lockers. Is english your second language, its exceptionally good and I did notice your wiring diagram above is written in finish.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

I've never found any toyota LSD's to be very good even after playing around with disc's and shimming them, personally I'd go air locker and I have done a long time ago, both my fj40 and fj75 have front and rear air lockers. Is english your second language, its exceptionally good and I did notice your wiring diagram above is written in finish.

Seems like I'll also go with an air locker, the discs are past saving according to @Eurasiaoverland and I'd rather pay 500 (or even 1000 for a proper ARB, but I can't afford that right now) for a locker than 250 for an LSD. The wiring diagram and my native language is actually Swedish. Reading about 40s and 75s with F engines and air lockers is a bit weird to me, as pretty much all 40s, 60s and leaf sprung 70s came as diesels with cable lockers in Finland.


I got an idea for getting the handbrake wire more protected. Is there a good reason I've never seen it done before?

Other than the rear diff and the rear brakes I've been working on the rest of the rear axle.

I'll get all brackets that need removal, relocation or making done before removing the rust and then painting it with hammerite. I've considered other paints and even no paint, but I think hammerite will be the best compromise between cost, prep required and durability.

I also got the gas bottle for the welder back. I can't continue welding the body right now as it's quite far away from the tent, but I need it for the axles and to make a hydraulic press.

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

Seems like I'll also go with an air locker, the discs are past saving according to @Eurasiaoverland and I'd rather pay 500 (or even 1000 for a proper ARB, but I can't afford that right now) for a locker than 250 for an LSD. The wiring diagram and my native language is actually Swedish. Reading about 40s and 75s with F engines and air lockers is a bit weird to me, as pretty much all 40s, 60s and leaf sprung 70s came as diesels with cable lockers in Finland.


I got an idea for getting the handbrake wire more protected. Is there a good reason I've never seen it done before?

Other than the rear diff and the rear brakes I've been working on the rest of the rear axle. View attachment 3921678View attachment 3921679
I'll get all brackets that need removal, relocation or making done before removing the rust and then painting it with hammerite. I've considered other paints and even no paint, but I think hammerite will be the best compromise between cost, prep required and durability.

I also got the gas bottle for the welder back. I can't continue welding the body right now as it's quite far away from the tent, but I need it for the axles and to make a hydraulic press.

If you want the paint to stay on for more than a season, I would not waste time with Hammerite, or any single pack product. Since you have these brackets off, I would use electrolysis to get rid of the rust with very little effort and no nasty checmicals, then spray with a 2k paint system.

I think for an off-roader the factory LSD is a bad investment.... but I've no idea if a chinese cable locker is useful or just junk that will need replacing in a year or two. Can't you get a factory open diff from a Hilux?

 

[Gubbtratt1]

If you want the paint to stay on for more than a season, I would not waste time with Hammerite, or any single pack product. Since you have these brackets off, I would use electrolysis to get rid of the rust with very little effort and no nasty checmicals, then spray with a 2k paint system.

I think for an off-roader the factory LSD is a bad investment.... but I've no idea if a chinese cable locker is useful or just junk that will need replacing in a year or two. Can't you get a factory open diff from a Hilux?

I'll get a quote for sandblasting the axle, if it comes to a sensible amount I see no reason to not have it painted properly.

I could get a Hilux diff, but it won't be any cheaper.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

I found an air locker on alibaba for 300€. I googled the seller, found their website, found their brand name, and apparently it's the exact same locker you get for 700€ on European sites.

I got a bit more done on the axle.

Rotating the hub assemblies should work fine with some minor modifications. I reinstalled the third member with no diff just to keep dust out of the axle, and started cutting off unused and rusted through brackets. Luckily the brackets I don't have a reason to redesign (shocks, trailing arms) were pretty solid. I also found a BSP adapter with the same treads as the breather plug, and a valve to keep it sealed until I get the hardware for the rest of the breather.

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

I'm not an off-roader, but I don't think the handbrake cable is particularly exposed, as it runs behind the axle housing. People compain about Land Cruiser hand brakes, but in my experience when they are set up correctly with OEM parts that are not worn out, they work (as well as a drum brake on a heavy vehicle can) for many years without maintenance. However, I don't think there is much tolerance for them being moved around. The handbrake cable is not like a throttle cable (which works on relative movement the cable compared to the sheathing), so if you move the bellcranks you will need to change the cable. Also, you may have problems with the shoes dragging as they are not designed to be mounted top-and bottom. So I think you are potentially making problems for yourself for little gain. Also, you would struggle to bleed the air from the rear brake cylinders as the bleed nipple woul no longer be at the top of the cylinder.

 

[Gubbtratt1]

The cable is very exposed, from just the small bit of offroading I've done the lever has been hit enough to be both bent and cracked. Behind the axle isn't enough when you have rocks or tree stumps, there's a reason people do high steer conversions on front axles. Both me in the Land Cruiser and my dad in his Range Rover have managed to bend the steering rod upwards by most likely slipping off a rock and having a stump hit the rod.

I don't really understand why you mean the cable wouldn't work in it's new position?

Good catch on shoes dragging, I'll have to remove a drum and make sure the springs are strong enough.