100 series measured weight

[whitenoise]

Guys, I'm not trying to argue the merits of aftermarket bumpers. Just saying that I personally won't consider it as my first option to add a winch or carry extra fuel etc. since I like to keep things lightweight, simple and as close to stock as possible. People like to customize and often times its more for appearance and "peace of mind" than anything else, and I totally get that. As Tom Sheppard said "The proportion of heavily modified vehicles gets smaller and smaller the closer you get to areas where actual expeditions are undertaken...". Pick your poison - stock and vulnerable or modified and compromised, I'd be willing to argue a stock LX or LC would get to and from 99% of the same places a typically modified one can.

 

[whitenoise]

If your really that concerned about the affect on handling with the addition of bumpers you could always do something like this to offset the affect
View attachment 1128774

LOL. yes, I am that concerned, and that is why I have AHC and will work hard to keep it.

 

[dubitup]

@whitenoise to each their own. If you want your truck to stay stock, cool, no harm no foul. These rigs are very capable off the show room floor.

Your OP was great concerning the stock weight etc...but quickly jumped the shark. Coming here swingin data and your opinions about these modified rigs, adding armor, lifting claiming we've ruined the handling, safety etc... is a bit off putting. I do not daily drive my rig , it wasn't built to serve that purpose nor built to save weight, gas...pure and simple it was built to enjoy off road areas where speed and handling at speed is not a concern.

I personal feel that the mods I've done have made my rig way more capable offroad, handles better offroad and I have peace of mind knowing I can get myself out of a situation via winching. Protection of the vitals via adding amor etc is not a license to be reckless either. As far as wildlife is concerned, I've seen far more damage/deaths done by vehicles that avoid, land change etc... I have a simple rule for wildlife. Pause for no paws. As others have stated here as well, when I do drive my rig on pavement, care, caution is taken to give more room for braking, lanes changes etc....accidents happen and some are unavoidable.

 

[cap80]

I think the most important take away here is that whitenoise has supplied some valuable weight distribution information on a stock rig. And valuable relative weight distribution information depending on where additional weight is located in the vehicle. Thanks for that.

Bumpers, winches, 700 gallons of fuel, tents, fridges, water, ect.... are kinda irrelevant to the pertinent info. He isn't running them or plans to and plenty of others do and don't crash every time they leave the house.

But the interesting thing is that all this talk about additional weight from bumpers and how it affects the handling of the vehicle is kinda moot with out discussing how to address vehicle suspension to account for it. So you add 800lbs worth of gear to your truck or 15% of the curb weight of a stock rig. You are still under the GVWR but what has been done to handle the extra load? Greater damping in the shocks, springs with a higher spring rate, E rated tires, stiffer sway bars? I can't imagine the additional 1.5-2" of lift that most people are running makes as much a difference in handling as under inflated tires or worn out shocks. And I can't imagine that a truck with appropriate suspension upgrades to accommodate the additional weight of bumpers and gear isn't just as safe as a stock rig. Throwing 800lbs of gear on a truck with stock dampers and springs, well yeah it's going to handle different. Just like p rated Michelin LTX's and E rated Duratracs handle differently. Throw any vehicle sideways on the highway at 70 and you are rolling the dice.
Do I have a point, I guess not really. Enjoy your trucks drive safe and thanks for the data. I sure like mine a whole lot and really don't want to crash it.

@benc if I lower my truck like the one on the pic will your high clearance bumper help me get over speed bumps.....

 

[PADDO]

I wonder if this thread would have taken a different direction regarding handling, safety, stability etc if Toyotas OEM alloy and steel bull bars that are standard dealer options in Australia had been made available to the NA market? Vehicle Frontal Protection Systems (VFPS) are a hot topic in Aus, particularly regarding pedestrian safety, and I suspect that before Toyota puts their name on a bull bar, sells and installs it they have satisfied themselves that it is safe, design compliant and does not pose any undue hazard to dynamic stability or SRS operations.

 

[whitenoise]

@dubitup , just as how you like your modified LC, I love my stock LC. Measuring the stock weight was just the beginning, and I felt like sharing not only this info, but also my philosophy to benefit others - after all this is a discussion forum is it not? The degraded handling is a fact, not my opinion, and if you don't believe me, read the NHTSA reports I linked to earlier, and deduce what you wish. Sorry for your hurt feelings.

@PADDO - Interesting. Do you have a link to a parts microfiche or pictures of these OEM parts? I'd be curious to know the details of the design and weight of the parts.... Thanks in advance.

 

[hoser]

Pick your poison - stock and vulnerable or modified and compromised, I'd be willing to argue a stock LX or LC would get to and from 99% of the same places a typically modified one can.

I don't think you need to pick your poison because there are many shades in between... all depends on where you are traveling and your usage. If you are overlanding through Australia or anywhere there are lots of larger wildlife, that bull bar could be worth it to you. For snow country, I'd like a winch. Another vehicle with a snatch strap won't always have enough traction to pull you out. Trips down to Baja and you'll probably want to change those lightweight P-rated tires for LTs.



Also, here's a similar thread from awhile back...
I weighed our stock 98 470

 

[PADDO]

@dubitup , just as how you like your modified LC, I love my stock LC. Measuring the stock weight was just the beginning, and I felt like sharing not only this info, but also my philosophy to benefit others - after all this is a discussion forum is it not? The degraded handling is a fact, not my opinion, and if you don't believe me, read the NHTSA reports I linked to earlier, and deduce what you wish. Sorry for your hurt feelings.

@PADDO - Interesting. Do you have a link to a parts microfiche or pictures of these OEM parts? I'd be curious to know the details of the design and weight of the parts.... Thanks in advance.

Don't have access to design data, just know that Toyota Australia tries to compete with the main players in after market parts by installing desirable stuff at the point of sale. My brother is negotiating a new diesel 70 and is trying to get a bull bar thrown in

 

[Manhattan]

If I'm understanding your findings... If I were to load a stock 100 Series for a big family trip, say 200 lbs of gear in cargo area, 250 pounds in the backseat and 320 pounds in the front seat... I would be closer to the ideal weight distribution WITH a winch bumper and winch mounted.

Oooh, wait. What about fuel?

My point: Static weight is not "constant" weight. When the 100 is sitting empty - no people, no luggage, no fuel - the weight and weight distribution is hugely different from how the truck is actually used.

You mentioned that 95% of miles are spent at 70+ mph on the highway. Probably true. But for me - and a lot of guys - those miles are with a somewhat to very loaded truck... which of course is in the "cargo" area over and behind the axle.

Not trying to sound douchey, but you kinda reinforced my decision to get that Dissent Offroad bumper and Warn winch... and question going with the lighter synthetic line

 

[whitenoise]

My measurements are with a full fuel tank. And your point is well taken, which is why I measured the corner weights with weight at different points on the vehicle. With that you could construct your own spreadsheet for, among other things, finding where to add weight


@PADDO thanks for the link.... no 100 bull bar? From just looking at these products its not unreasonable to think they're heavily weight and performance optimized (aero, crash, safety etc)....

 

[Bubba68CS]

As I said, I'm flexible in my thinking - but you've hardly offered anything concrete to change my mind. No offense intended, but it sounds as though you've dug a bit too deep into your high school physics and are blowing some things out of proportion. It also sounds as though you have no real-world experience with adding weight to an off-road rig (feel free to correct me if that impression is wrong). No one is arguing that handling isn't worse - they're arguing that the difference doesn't matter much in the real world. You are essentially arguing that no one should ever load their vehicle with anything for fear of rolling over - wildly overblown fears. Towing the rated 6500 lbs is going to change your braking/handling/acceleration far more than a pair of bumpers will. Hauling 8 people will affect your handling far more than a pair of bumpers will.

Most of these rigs are also fitted with stability control...and it works.

Situational awareness trumps all. Its been said that the most skilled pilots in the world rarely make use of that skill because they avoid putting themselves in a situation where it is needed. You adjust your driving to your load. I certainly don't drive this thing the way I did my Camaro - but I've had to make no adjustments since bumping up to a 33" tire. The biggest impact has been acceleration - I notice no difference in braking nor handling with the larger sidewall. Probably because I never come remotely close to using 100% of the traction available.

The sky isn't falling - people drive around in mildly lifted and weighed down off-road rigs all the time without issue. You don't need to modify your rig or like anyone else's rig, but your attitude toward others has certainly been off-putting.

 

[PADDO]

My measurements are with a full fuel tank. And your point is well taken, which is why I measured the corner weights with weight at different points on the vehicle. With that you could construct your own spreadsheet for, among other things, finding where to add weight


@PADDO thanks for the link.... no 100 bull bar? From just looking at these products its not unreasonable to think they're heavily weight and performance optimized (aero, crash, safety etc)....

Toyota Au used to offer a number of Toyota Genuine bars for 100s for dealer installation. I guess they just offer equipment for current models. Here are some words from a Toyota Australia release.

 

[Hayes]

It's good to see measurements.
The other discussion about what is good, bad, better, or worse is irrelevant without context. And it's not just personal preference--It depends on the intended usage.
Armor does protect the truck from slow speed collisions with animal, vegetable, and mineral, but at the expense of static weight and possibly occupant protection. Depending on where and how you're driving you may favor one over the other.
Increased tire size does increase the ability to overcome obstacles, but at the expense of other handling characteristics.
Etc. etc.

I also think the discussion needs to be tempered with consideration for the actual operating environment--which is not a level, planar surface with a scale at each wheel.

I'd be willing to argue a stock LX or LC would get to and from 99% of the same places a typically modified one can.

Respectfully, I think you would lose that argument.

 

[whitenoise]

@Hayes , you're saying a stock AHC-equipped LX on 33" AT tires can't get to most of the places a 2" lifted, "armored" (I LOL at that term every time), LC can on similar tires?

 

[Hayes]

@Hayes , you're saying a stock AHC-equipped LX on 33" AT tires can't get to most of the places a 2" lifted, "armored" (I LOL at that term every time), LC can on similar tires?

33" tires are not stock.

I suggest that a "typically modified" 100-series is 33" tires, lift, locker(s) and armor.
I'm saying no, an open-diffed un-lifted LC or LX on 31" tires cannot go "99% of the same places." Many of the same places, yes. But virtually ALL (99%), no.

 

[Hayes]

@Hayes , you're saying a stock AHC-equipped LX on 33" AT tires can't get to most of the places a 2" lifted, "armored" (I LOL at that term every time), LC can on similar tires?

And "armor" is an absolutely appropriate term. If I had spent last weekend with factory bumpers and no sliders, I would have come home with no bumpers and dented rocker panels. Bumpers and sliders DO protect (armor) the rest of the body under certain types of usage.

 

[whitenoise]

Sorry for the lack of clarity. My definition of stock did include AT tires. ~33" do fit without any other mods, don't they? Doesn't need any time or money invested other than a trip to the tire shop, since tires are something you replace periodically anyway.

Anyway, I think this is my last post on this subject. I apologize for people's hurt feelings, but then again it's human nature to defend your choices regardless of their merits.

 

[Manhattan]

@Hayes , you're saying a stock AHC-equipped LX on 33" AT tires can't get to most of the places a 2" lifted, "armored" (I LOL at that term every time), LC can on similar tires?

This isn't rocket science @whitenoise - dragging a plastic bumper off a ledge, or gently setting a rocker panel on a root or rock will exemplify why "armor" is very useful on the trial.

The goal of a build is not just to "get" down the trail. It is also to survive undamaged. Steel bumpers, sliders and skid plates - a.k.a. armor - helps mitigate that damage. Lift improves approach/departure angles, lockers add traction and reduced strain (spinning, catching, etc.) on the drive train. You get the point. Right?

 

[Hayes]

Sorry for the lack of clarity. My definition of stock did include AT tires. ~33" do fit without any other mods, don't they? Doesn't need any time or money invested other than a trip to the tire shop, since tires are something you replace periodically anyway.

Anyway, I think this is my last post on this subject. I apologize for people's hurt feelings, but then again it's human nature to defend your choices regardless of their merits.

No hurt feelings here.
Let's go wheeling and put the question to the test. You have to bring the stock truck, though.

 

[whitenoise]

Yes, @Manhattan, you're points are well taken. But the choice of whether or not to have "armor" is entirely up to the terrain and for the areas I intend to travel through, I don't see the need to penalize myself with 300 lbs of it. Sliders, maybe.... Front and rear bumpers, nah..