100 Series Calipers + Rotors?
- Thread starter chibo
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- #22
Everything starts with assumptions, reading, and trial and errorYou should do more research and get some hard numbers before you price parts out and make performance assumptions.
good luck
I do know that my girlfriend works at autozone so I get 20% off whatever price things end up at 
On another note, does anyone have both a 100 and 80 rear rotor laying around? I'd like to see comparison shots so that I could overlay them ontop of each other.
According to my FSM the front rotors are 32mm thick and the rears are 18mm thick (80).
According to DBA the front brakes are 311mm in diameter (80), does anyone know what the rears are?
According to DBA the front brakes are 312mm in diameter/32mm thick (100) and 330mm in the rear, I do note that apparently the GX470 has ~338mm front discs, but that would require moving to 17's.
According to cross referencing, the following all use the same rear caliper: FJ80,FZJ80,HDJ80,HZJ80,FZJ75,HZJ75,FZJ78,FZJ79,HZJ79,FZJ105,HZJ105.
The FZJ80 has a brake master cylinder with a pistion diameter of 1".
It would appear the front rotors are nearly the same size, I'll edit this post when I find details on the calipers. If they're the same I'll tell myself I'm a dumbass and this will have just been a waste of a few hours.
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Chibo,
You said "My 80s brakes suck"
I said "Replace the rotors and pads"
You said "That's irresponsible $1000 advice"
Then you said "They are nonToyota calipers and nonToyota pads"
Then you're off with thousands of dollars of proposed brake mods.
Let's start over. You are not unhappy with Toyota's brake system on the 80. You are unhappy with a modified brake system on the 80. Since many of us here with track experience, with racing experience are happy with the braking of our stock 80s with well maintained brake systems, consider that you might also be happier with the system restored to its stock design.
I have no idea why those parts were put on the 80. Could be the parts they replaced were simply worn and someone in your family simply decided to give the slotted rotors and EBC pads a shot. And they didn't work out, apparently.
If I were you, I'd spend WAY less than a grand to put new rotors and pads on it from Toyota. Then I'd properly bed the brakes and see where I'm at based on advice from a bunch of guys who know 80s pretty well.
DougM
You said "My 80s brakes suck"
I said "Replace the rotors and pads"
You said "That's irresponsible $1000 advice"
Then you said "They are nonToyota calipers and nonToyota pads"
Then you're off with thousands of dollars of proposed brake mods.
Let's start over. You are not unhappy with Toyota's brake system on the 80. You are unhappy with a modified brake system on the 80. Since many of us here with track experience, with racing experience are happy with the braking of our stock 80s with well maintained brake systems, consider that you might also be happier with the system restored to its stock design.
I have no idea why those parts were put on the 80. Could be the parts they replaced were simply worn and someone in your family simply decided to give the slotted rotors and EBC pads a shot. And they didn't work out, apparently.
If I were you, I'd spend WAY less than a grand to put new rotors and pads on it from Toyota. Then I'd properly bed the brakes and see where I'm at based on advice from a bunch of guys who know 80s pretty well.
DougM
- Thread starter
- #24
I'll admit this is the proper course of action and I'll be giving it a shot, my mistake - I guess I got ahead of myself. After research tonight there really is no difference between the 100 and 80 braking system from a size standpoint
Oh well, worth the learning experience.Time to baseline this thing with OEM pads, rotors, and some new brake fluid with a good flush/bleed. Am I to assume the calipers could use a nice rebuild after 10 years?
I'm 20 with two accidents (one at fault) with 250,000/500,000/250,000 coverage for $1400 and I'm in a family with 2 V8 Germans.
It sounds like you are getting ripped off for insurance. Go elsewhere. And it sounds like you're on the right track with the brakes now. But baseline....? I thought this thing as in your family for its lifetime, whats to baseline?
It sounds like you are getting ripped off for insurance. Go elsewhere. And it sounds like you're on the right track with the brakes now. But baseline....? I thought this thing as in your family for its lifetime, whats to baseline?
- Thread starter
- #26
I think insurance has a lot to do with area, and my coverages are higher than that... I'm insured on an 06 M5, 07 MCoupe, and a few other things as well as the Land Cruiser, not that I ever get to drive them. Either way, yeah, I am getting screwed. I will mention that my ticket was criminal speeding, so that probably has something to do with it.
As far as baseline, I meant to freshen everything at once - it's staying in the family.
You're definitely getting screwed on the insurance, shop elsewhere.
Freshen and see how they work. You should definitely be able to engage ABS on pavement. If it's brake fade you are having a problem with, that is a whole different ballgame.
Freshen and see how they work. You should definitely be able to engage ABS on pavement. If it's brake fade you are having a problem with, that is a whole different ballgame.
Beside the rotors and the pads the biggest difference between the two crusiers(80 vs 100) is the method that they use to generate brake line pressure. The 80 uses vaccuum booster and the 100 uses high pressure electric pump to generate the pressure. You will never get the same brakeing power out of jsut changeing the caliper and rotor. You would need to adapt a HP electric pump in the system.
I do beleive the calipers will bolt straight up and you could use the stock 80 rotor(the pads do fit inside the stock 80 caliper). I have not done this, but have taken measurements and all look good on measurements. Jsut never had the spare part to try this. The calipers are a little different in the cylinders are a little bigger, but not much. I think the biggest difference is how the brake line pressure is generated. later robbie
I do beleive the calipers will bolt straight up and you could use the stock 80 rotor(the pads do fit inside the stock 80 caliper). I have not done this, but have taken measurements and all look good on measurements. Jsut never had the spare part to try this. The calipers are a little different in the cylinders are a little bigger, but not much. I think the biggest difference is how the brake line pressure is generated. later robbie
How about starting by getting the brakes to perform up to factory specs before going nuts. Autozone does not equal factory specs, they are not even close. There is a big difference. When I purchased my 80, it had aftermarket pads and rotors. They were horrible, to the point I overheated them to the point of near total failure from outgassing. I have since replaced them with Factory rotors, but substituted the front pads with Hawk LTS pads, and the Rear with Axxis Ultimates. Bite and modulation are much better, but if I did it again I would run OEM or performance Friction pads in the rear.
BTW, if you have not found out yet, Cruiserdan here is a parts guru at American Toyota and kindly sells factory parts for prices that approach what you will pay for aftermarket crap from autozone. I would suggest you contact him before purchasing you brake parts from the aftermarket.
The 80 brakes will never feel as good as a performance car. You will never get them to perform as well either. Remember you are trying to modulate a 70+ pound wheel and tire combo with a lot of rotational energy. Compare this to the much lighter and smaller diameter of a performance wheel and tire on a car, which will weigh less than 40 pounds.
Maybe they were Brembo but I am pretty sure the price was much closer (or over) $5k than $2k.
Since you can't afford the $2k brakes then I'm not going to waste my time finding you the good ones.
(Well.... cary beat me to it but I'll still leave this in because it might help sink in.)
And lemme give you another piece of sage advice. Just because your GF works at AutoZone does not mean they sell quality auto parts for your Land Cruiser. If you want your brake system to work like Mr T. designed it (and it will work very well for a 10yo 6,000# vehicle) then you need to replace those crappy AutoZone parts with Toyota rotors, calipers, pads, and do a good brake fluid flush with a premium fluid (many prefer Valvoline Syn) and do a proper pad bedding procedure.
It is also important to be sure the LSPV is working properly and is adjusted properly. BTDT.
FYI, new SS brake lines will also improve brake "feel" though most of us will not tell you this helps with the brake performance.
-B-
Your calipers may or may not need a rebuild. If they do, the kit for both fronts is $25 from Cda for factory Toyota. Depends completely on the maintenance over the years, and if there was any damage/stress from the nonstock components. Ex: factory setup soaks caliper with X amount of heat, but different pads/rotors may cause caliper to experience more than its share of braking heat (X times 1.5?) and swell or harden the seals a rebuild would replace. So, dunno. Cheap insurance would be to do it while you've got it apart for rotors/pads. Search here for my description on factory caliper rebuild kit use.
DougM
DougM
You did not post the mileage on your truck. One thing you could do is pull the fuse to see if the ABS system is the problem. It might be a good test. I ahve seen some stuff out in the aftermarket world for the LX450 with 6 piston calipers and bigger rotors, but these kits were in the $3500 range with out install.
Any how if the truck is responding differently with the fuse out(better) then you may need to look at the sensors, or other parts of the ABS system. You will need a FSM to do this.
If the truck is working properly you should not have a poor braking system. There is something wrong in the system, if the truck is a deathtrap. Upgrding will not help if the braking system is poor at this time. Find the problem. later robbie
Any how if the truck is responding differently with the fuse out(better) then you may need to look at the sensors, or other parts of the ABS system. You will need a FSM to do this.
If the truck is working properly you should not have a poor braking system. There is something wrong in the system, if the truck is a deathtrap. Upgrding will not help if the braking system is poor at this time. Find the problem. later robbie
everything I've read says avoid the Autozone rotors and go for the toyota ones. Ususally I'm fine with autozone stuff, but after reading it 80 times here, I was sold. Also, go to 100 series pads, more area. But you'll have to leave the anti-squeal shims out, they're enough thicker they won't fit.
Had the same problem. Xwife took the cruiser in for an oil change and came home with new rotors and brakes.
I was pissed, did not need them. The bad part was that the brakes were very soft. I even ran into the back of someone.
I kept bring it back for repair and got jerked around.
After about the 5th attempt They bled the system again and Bingo back in bidness.
I believe the brakes are fine for the 80's if they are working right. I know it is a pain, but try bleeding the lines again.
I was pissed, did not need them. The bad part was that the brakes were very soft. I even ran into the back of someone.
I kept bring it back for repair and got jerked around.
After about the 5th attempt They bled the system again and Bingo back in bidness.
I believe the brakes are fine for the 80's if they are working right. I know it is a pain, but try bleeding the lines again.
here are stopping distances for stock trucks...
1999 LC
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 150 ft.
1998 LC
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 140 ft.
Braking 60-0 mph: 135 feet (2005 model)
2003 LX470
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 124.24 ft.
1997 LX450
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 132 ft.
1996 LX450
60-0 mph stopping distance of 136 feet
2003 GX470
Braking, 60-0, ft: 131
FJ Cruiser
60 - 0 (ft):, 126.6
60-0 mph, 128 ft
1999 LC
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 150 ft.
1998 LC
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 140 ft.
Braking 60-0 mph: 135 feet (2005 model)
2003 LX470
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 124.24 ft.
1997 LX450
Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 132 ft.
1996 LX450
60-0 mph stopping distance of 136 feet
2003 GX470
Braking, 60-0, ft: 131
FJ Cruiser
60 - 0 (ft):, 126.6
60-0 mph, 128 ft
You guys are a patient bunch.
That was the secret to doing mine too. I tried it a few times before I changed out the master cylinder (didn't help). It was in the 3rd bleed after changing the cylinder that things got -right-.
Properly seating the pads is important too. Especially if you are putting on new rotors.
YMMV.
Interesting. Do you know the source of this information and were those from [relatively] new trucks?
-B-
I must say that this completely blows me away. The FJC is 10 years newer, thousands of pounds lighter, has Toyota's newest braking technology....
.... and the FZJ80 stops within 4' from 60 MPH. There is no way anyone can consider those brakes to be a "deathtrap" unless the owner has screwed up the braking system due to poor maintenance.
Case closed.
-B-
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