Land Cruiser/Land Rover comparisons (1 Viewer)

After reading about the 80 compared to the G500, someone brought up the Defenders and other Rovers along with gray matter and other things, so after I did a search, I decided to do a new topic instead of adding to the gray matter!.
Here is my question… I’m sure most of you have seen the test track at the Rover dealers. Can a Land Cruiser do the same thing? The side tilt is 30/35° or so, they say it will do 45°. I have not seen anything about the LC’s. but do know for a fact that the LC 80 will out climb the Discovery (series 2 )! The test track is quite impressive though. Mercedes has a track in Santa Fe next to the Rover dealer & it has a HUGE hill but I’ve only seen something parked on it. Probably won’t even let me sit in one, let alone ride in it!!
My wife and I had looked into a Disco a while back. We went to the dealer and was wanting to take my wife on the test track. However the track was shut down because of some rain we had earlier that day. So the dealer took us on a test drive. Just down the road there was a huge concrete arroyo, I SWEAR it was something close to 45°. He drives straight down the embankment into the arroyo and then turns parallel to the water. Looking at the flowing water he comments on how fast it was flowing, he looks at it and says we can cross it. He started down at an angle towards the water when we entered the water came up over the hood monetarily as the front was pointing straight down into the fast water. My wife was freaking out long before we reached the water! She was about to tear off the handles that are on the headrests (she had a great view as they have stadium style seating).
As we crossed the water I thought we were moving sideways with the water, then we went straight up the other side. I got worried when he turned the Disco parallel to the water again. I had a flash back to a story of a 4x4 sliding off a cliff because of the water running off the frame and loosing traction. I thought for sure this was going to happen to us! But we didn’t, we went back through the water and up the other side with not even a wheel spin! That was a test ride my wife and I will never forget. I told everyone at work about it too. I had thought the water was 2ft deep. So the next day I went back down there to measure it. I was afraid to drive my FJ62 in it, cause I was not sure it would make it out. It was very hard to walk down to the water do to the steepness. I made reference to the height of the water in relation to the stencil saying “CAUTION BOTTOM SLIPPERY”, so with a tape measure I was able to get an approximate depth of 14-16 inches.
However we did a lot of research and as far as reliability & availability of parts the LC beats the Disco hands down.
I also got registered at Discoweb’s forum, asked how the vehicle was like towing etc. (Land Rover rates it in both hi and low range, like any one will tow a boat or something in low range down the freeway!) But I’ll tell you they act like there s*** didn’t stink and they told me if I wanted to tow something to get a Chevy Suburban! They are some of the unhappiest people I’ve talked to! Nothing compares to this site!

>> Can a Land Cruiser do the same thing? <<

Yes.

-B-

[quote author=DMX84 link=board=2;threadid=13113;start=msg120980#msg120980 date=1079285070]
However we did a lot of research and as far as reliability & availability of parts the LC beats the Disco hands down.
I also got registered at Discoweb’s forum, asked how the vehicle was like towing etc. (Land Rover rates it in both hi and low range, like any one will tow a boat or something in low range down the freeway!) But I’ll tell you they act like there s*** didn’t stink and they told me if I wanted to tow something to get a Chevy Suburban! They are some of the unhappiest people I’ve talked to! Nothing compares to this site!

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You mean there were folks on Dweb who were less than helpful? Poppycock.

I work with/on Rovers all the time and drive an FJ.

RJ

I had my 80 up to a solid 40 degrees two weekends ago. I did not like the feeling. It bouced a couple of times past 50 but that wasn't a true reading. I know I went beyond 40 but who knows how much? I was driving not watching the tilt-o-meter. My wife is good to 30, anything after 30 and I better have let her out before the obstacle because I will pay for it later. This is all on the side. I've dropped in and landed the 80 on its nose pretty hard a couple of times. Even with my lower profile bumper it still hits occasionally. This is not as scary feeling as the side hill. I've pretty much never had a scary feeling climbing with my 80. As long as it is straight up! I've never doubted the off road ability of a Land Rover. What I've always questioned was the reliability. It is the same with Jeeps. There are some awesome off road Jeeps out there, and I sort of admire the Rubicon from a far. But how long will it last without having to be rebuilt or modified?

Some basic comparisons between a 94-99 Disco Series 1 (regarded to be the best off-road of the Discos, DII is similar) and a 93-97 FZJ80 (FJ80 is similar) from my perspective, a former 95 DI owner:

Disco: 24 spline toothpick axles
FZJ80: 30 spline (bigger) with what is presumably a better alloy (read: a lot stronger)

Disco: CV joint similar size as earlier, read pre-91, Land Cruisers
FZJ80: CV joint 1 1/2 times the size of the Disco's, DII's are enclosed in a rubber boot only.

Disco: Reliability? Mine had 20K on it and my 130K FJ60 was far more reliable.
FZJ80: In 3.5 years of ownership, other than regular maintenance, all I've had go wrong is starter contacts--which could almost be argued as maintenance themselves.

Disco: How can an aluminum rig rust so much? Door sills, hinges, roof rack, frame...
FZJ80: Some may get rust spots on rear lift-gates, otherwise not at all.

Disco: No available diff locks, center diff locks on DI only, DII has ETC read electronic stuff (not notoriously reliable on Rovers)
FZJ80: Center Diff lock on every one ever made, optional front and rear

Many Rover owners will go on about how their vehicles have "soul" and that they just don't get the same feeling from a Land Cruiser. Whatever. These guys also complain how Land Cruisers retain their value so much and don't depreciate like a Rover. Gee, I wonder why?

Take your FJ62 on the same course the salesman went on. 16" of water isn't that much, expecially if the bottom is even. Sounds like you had your first four-wheeling experience and you didn't realize you could have done it all along in your rig.

FJ's ooze soul!



...and not as much Oil!!!

RJ

I bought a '01 Disco II a couple years back. I can vouch for the feeling of owning and driving a Rover. Especially sweet was the way I was treated at the dealer's whenever I went in. But that's as far as it went. At about 25k it sprung a leak and required major work, i.e. water pump, head gaskets, valve job. It was under warranty and didn't cost me a dime; they even picked it up (200 miles) and dropped it off after they fixed it, and all with a smile! I sold it a month later. I now have a '97 FZJ80 with diff locks, and am confident that nothing on the planet made for civilians is better.

In Venezuela I did some incredible stuff on my stock FJ60, stuff that doesn't sound any different from your Disco test drive, but without concrete to give me traction!

I agree with lizardking and admire the cachet thing about Rovers. But if anything should be reliable, it should be the thing that takes you out to the middle of nowhere.

A little OT but in the future the point will be mot regarding Discovery, as the next generation is a gussied up Ford Explorer, might be a little more reliable, but no off roader.

I forgot to mention: my current '85 FJ60 has 253,000 miles on it, and all the engine has ever needed is a water pump. The rest of the chassis?. . . nothing worse than a clutch, starter, alternator, shocks. But all this in a span of about ten years!

Hello, first time post,

The only rover owner I know is/was my wife's brother in law. After years of trouble with his Range Rover( air springs collapsed and couldn't drive over 25 for a week, months long mystery of poor running, shorted out a/c controls and other micellaneous items) I just found out that over the weekend he was 3 hours from home on business and the truck blew either the engine or the transmission and he ended up selling it to a mechanic at the rover shop for $1500. This was a 1996 that he paid about 30K for.

I read Discoweb for quite a while, at the same time reading 80scool. While there are things that people still discuss such as repacking Birfs, PHH, etc. Those things pale compared to reading about blowing CVs, transmissions, and axles(often within two years and 50,000 miles) and the recommendation of replacing U-joints (rotoflexes?) at 40-50,000 mile intervals.

I like soul too, but damn.

I agree with all comments said above. A couple years ago, I used to go blind reading the discoweb forum for hours...when I should have been studying. I was initially attracted to the LR for the same reasons other people are. The green oval is appealing. Then one day I realized this thing is going to be in the shop more than on the road. That's when I decided to buy a Cruiser and convinced my brother also to get an 80. I do not regret that decision. If you want soul buy a 40 or 60, there is plenty of soul in those cruisers. If you want to see how much $$$ you can spend in repairs on a brand new vehicle, buy a LR.

[quote author=DMX84 link=board=2;threadid=13113;start=msg120980#msg120980 date=1079285070]
After reading about the 80 compared to the G500, someone brought up the Defenders and other Rovers along with gray matter and other things, so after I did a search, I decided to do a new topic instead of adding to the gray matter!.
Here is my question… I’m sure most of you have seen the test track at the Rover dealers. Can a Land Cruiser do the same thing? The side tilt is 30/35° or so, they say it will do 45°. I
[snip]

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I know the Hilux Tiger extended cab 3.0 liter D4D Tturbo diesel pickup sold in Thailand for $17K can do 44 deg/46 deg side traversal. So 30/35 deg for a rover doesn't impress me.

Isn't marketing great. I mean LRs do appeal to folks because of the marketing, after they get over that junk, they are left with junk. Another marketing great is the rebodied tahoe, ie H2. Most of the world is impressed with marketing and it works on most folks however there is growing number of informed consumers who do not put up with that nonsense. Real Land Cruiser owners for 1. You can tell a real LC owner vs the jones. The real LC person purchased the LC because it is the best civilian 4x4 suv in the world. The jones purchased it because it was the most expensive. Now there are a number of suv's available at that higher price point so the jones have to go shopping again. Most folks do not even know what a Land Cruiser is because there is no advertising/marketing to go with the LC. I think it is great because there will always be tons of good 100 series for sale. Most people think I drive a 4Runner or Sequioa.

Enjoy the LC's, they are the best, even thou a tv commercial did not tell you so.

Later,

uzj100

[quote author=uzj100 link=board=2;threadid=13113;start=msg121996#msg121996 date=1079453626]
Isn't marketing great. I mean LRs do appeal to folks because of the marketing, after they get over that junk, they are left with junk. Another marketing great is the rebodied tahoe, ie H2. Most of the world is impressed with marketing and it works on most folks however there is growing number of informed consumers who do not put up with that nonsense. Real Land Cruiser owners for 1. You can tell a real LC owner vs the jones. The real LC person purchased the LC because it is the best civilian 4x4 suv in the world. The jones purchased it because it was the most expensive. Now there are a number of suv's available at that higher price point so the jones have to go shopping again. Most folks do not even know what a Land Cruiser is because there is no advertising/marketing to go with the LC. I think it is great because there will always be tons of good 100 series for sale. Most people think I drive a 4Runner or Sequioa.

Enjoy the LC's, they are the best, even thou a tv commercial did not tell you so.

Later,

uzj100




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I guess the other alternative is to get the new V8 full-time 4WD 4runner and do a solid axle swap and add front/rear diff locks. I also agree that it's great that the Jone's buy the 100/LX470 since it's the most expensive. This gives us a good supply of cruisers at more affordable prices after their leases expire, plus we don't have the guilt factor or abusing a new vehicle.

There is no comparison. When I was purchasing my Cruiser through a broker in the area, I asked him what his thoughs on the Discovery's were. He pointed to a 1998 Disco and said that he took it on trade in and the guy had $10,000 in receipts from the last year (fortunately covered under extended warrantee).

I have a friend who purchased a Disco for his wife and after riding in the 80 for about 5 minutes asked her if she would be willing to trade her Disco in. He mentioned $1200 for a brake job on the Discovery.

Well I guess it's time for something other than Jabs about rovers from me LOL.

The majority of our business is rovers....I do Love them, but I drive and wheel a cruiser. I will one day have another series rig.

Most of this is comparing the Rangie/Disco II to the 80's and 100's....The D90 is just a Series Four Rover in my opinion...it is such a throwback to the Series rigs. I love D90's but can't see plunking down the $$ for one....you WILL have to work on it all the time, so I'd rather have a '73 109 for less $$....simpler to work on too LOL!

The DII's are a mixed bag for us wheelers...Crappy departure angle (Worse than the DI) fickle compouter systems (STILL) and TERRIBLE axles. Mods are pricey...I'd say a bit more than the standard 80 series. The reliabilty on a small scale and larger (more amjor issues) is terrible when compared to Toyotas.

The New Rangie is a Mall Barge plain and simple.

I liken the Series rigs and Defenders to the FJ's...you will see them everywhere for the next 75 years in the most remote of places, held together with with bubble gum and duct tape....They will survive because they are simple to fix when the break....

Guys who wheel their discos hard tend to have deep pockets...whenm they brake they fix them and don't complain. Discos are cool as hell, but it's no series, or FJ62.

I guess I've rambled enough.....

Any thoughts about comparing FZJ80's to 2002 (and prior) Range Rovers? Besides the obvious difference in price.

[quote author=hoser link=board=2;threadid=13113;start=msg122385#msg122385 date=1079487899]
Any thoughts about comparing FZJ80's to 2002 (and prior) Range Rovers? Besides the obvious difference in price.
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Once the Rangies went to the Airbags they lost any real wheelablility IMHO (for a long range wheeler or a crawler)....anyone with a 94+ rangie who really wheels has done a coil conversion from what I've seen.

if you must compare a new Rangie to a cruiser do it to the UZJ100 rig (IFS is an obvious disadvantage...kinda even out against the Ragies Crappy axles and electronique suspension....)

The british manufacturers don't really make reliable cars, look at the jaguar. I think that there is more style than substance in their marketing and the products.

Personally I wouldn't compare a Disco to Land Cruiser, they're different class. Disco is the same class a 4Runner espcially new 4Runners with V8. I would choose a 4Runner over a disco anyday now. I have bike buddy always complained about his Disco and drooled over my Land Cruisers.

/td