Why? 2005 LC - Only 235 hp

[Jim_Chow]

Hello all you guys make me laugh the horsepower issue shouldn't be a problem Yes it would be nice to get to 60 faster but if you want that go buy a corvette). One big point I would like to make is that the lc and the lx usually get stuff which is tested out from other vehicles to make sure they work; thats why the are so reliable and are usually found all over the world were your dealership or road side assistance does not exist!!!

You've got a point, but it took until around '02 until Toyota introduced the 2UZ V8 as the stock gasoline engine on overseas, non-Lexus models (at least in Oz and in Japan). Pretty much everyone else had to choose between the 1HD-FTE or the 1FZ (again, for their proven track records). But at that same time, the LX470 was being sold in those same countries w/ the V8 stock. The 270hp VVT-i sounds like the 2UZ w/ tweaks (new chip?) for some additional horses w/o having to go w/ the S/C. They outta just include the S/C as stock equipment on a Limited version and w/ a factory chip so it can run on regular.

 

[lurker]

98-99 is not the same as 2000+. That's where you get traction control, brake assist, ESP, etc. etc. Build quality is second to none, and component strength is tank-like. Compared to similar competitors from Land Rover, Mercedes-Benz, Infiniti, GM, and Ford, it is a relative bargain for what you get.

Consumer Reports and JD powers consistently rate it as the best full-size SUV for reliability, durability, build quality, and longevity. That has been my experience as well, and not just mine. If you like buying a new vehicle every two or three years, buy a GM. If you want to keep it, and pound on it, for decades (or the rest of your life), the Cruiser is part of a very small group that can take that kind of abuse. A group that does not include a single current GM, Ford, or Chrysler product.

You get what you pay for. If you don't understand why the Cruiser is worth $50-60K, then there's no use trying to explain it to you.

BTW, making a lot of money does not mean you have to throw value out the window. If thinking long-term, not short-term, there is very little that can touch the value of a Cruiser, IMHO. Here's an example of value for money: our Mercedes SL is 14 years old. $90K new in 1990. DBAG ran that body style up until 2002 (12 years!) and it is still the best built SL ever made, IMHO. And runs like it's new. DBAG is the only manufacturer that I am aware of that offers a 1,000,000 mile certification (yes, one MILLION miles, at which point they give you a free car). Try that with any cheaper-priced alternatives. Again, you get what you pay for, in the long-run.

I'm just trying to point out that for $60K, realistic HP should not even be an isssue.

The rest of your point was unneccessary.

 

[macneill]

I'm just trying to point out that for $60K, realistic HP should not even be an isssue.

The rest of your point was unneccessary.

As unnecessary as you telling us you're "probably in the top 10 percentile of salaries in the US?"

 

[dclee]

The "unnecessary-ness" of my point was in response to the "unnecessary-ness" of this statement of your's:

"Baffling, considering I'm probably in the top 10 percentile of salaries in the US."

Who cares?

As for the rest, you asked why the premium. I attempted to explain. Horsepower may be part of the equation, but only a small part. There are a vast number of other considerations in a world vehicle of this caliber. Notice I said "world" vehicle, not "U.S." vehicle. Sure the Corvette may have gobs of horsepower, but where else in the world can you find a Chevy dealership that carries them (besides on a special order basis)? As much as I appreciate the C5 (and now C6) Corvettes, I'd never own one, `cause they're built like the stuff that comes out of my nether regions after bad Mexican food.

 

[r3run33]

sorry have been away and missed all the fun pitbul ask any gx 470 owner about the reliability issues with their vehicles the 4.7 is great but they all have bad drive safts (anything built before june 2004 I think) that was what i was referring to. the gx's also have some other problems i can't remember and by the way the problems are all us based because in other parts of the world the prado ( gx 470) does not have the 4.7

 

[Pitbull]

sorry have been away and missed all the fun pitbul ask any gx 470 owner about the reliability issues with their vehicles the 4.7 is great but they all have bad drive safts (anything built before june 2004 I think) that was what i was referring to. the gx's also have some other problems i can't remember and by the way the problems are all us based because in other parts of the world the prado ( gx 470) does not have the 4.7

I've read about some of them having problems with this on the Lexus site, along with steering wheel vibration. Not many 4runner owners have complained about either problem. Don't understand it since they are both made in the same factorys in Japan. I think it could be a couple of reasons. One most people that buy the Lexus GX470 are not "Truck" people and any type of vib or thump gets them all excited so they go in and complain. I think Lexus came up with some bushing to further isolate any vib's from the owner, that's their fix which comes with a new drive shaft. But I've seen many of the Lexus owners complain even after the new drive shaft. Most of the complaints have to do with the drivetrain thump that all of the 80 owners are use too feeling. I've had no problems with mine but I owned a 95 FZJ80 before this vehicle.

 

[cary]

No I think you are missing the point.

It's 2004 soon to be 2005, reliablity it's so much an issue anymore and every manufacture is creating SUV's in the low to mid 300 TQ/HP range.

On top of this statement is only goes to ASSUME that with the premium that LC owners pay, this should translate into superior metallurgy/engineering from Toyota. Toyota are you listening?

but I truely do not understand how people can justify $60,000 new for this vechile?

BTW the Corvette is JUKE, for 1/2 the price you can get almost a McLaren F1 like performer, have a look at this Ultima Sport.

http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/

To your points:

1) Quality is still very important to people. Most people who spend $60,000 on a vehicle do not want to take it to the shop every week. Drive a LC, then go drive a Navagator or Cadillac SUV, no comparison in the quality. Take a look at how poorly the american SUV's hold up after 3 years compared to a LC. My wife, a lifetime BMW driver, is constantly impressed with the feel and solidity of the LC.

2) Horsepower: Horsepower is nice, but torque is what gets you going. The last generation 4 runner was only "190" horsepower, but the 240 ft/lbs of torque caused it to be be competitive in 0-60 acceleration. Same for the LC. Sure the "competition" has 300 hp, but they are all hovering in the 320-350ft torque range. Note the "hot" new suv, called the H2 has more horsepower and torque, but is considerably slower due to extra weight.

3) Corvettes. On paper a great car. But having spend some time in them (including the C4 ZR1), comparing them to a Porsche is like comparing a scapel to a machettee. Also, they do not hold up will in the long run, look wise, reliability wise, price wise. Which would you rather have? A 1974 Porsche 911rs, or a 1974 Corvette. How about the brand new C4 from 1984 compared to the then freshly revised 1984 911 Carrerra. Perhaps a 1994 Corvette versus the 993?

 

[dclee]

Which would you rather have? A 1974 Porsche 911rs, or a 1974 Corvette. How about the brand new C4 from 1984 compared to the then freshly revised 1984 911 Carrerra. Perhaps a 1994 Corvette versus the 993?

The one Porsche I would like to own wears a three-point star! The 1992-1994 Mercedes-Benz 500E/E500 was partly designed and fully assembled by Porsche in their Zuffenhausen factory, former home of the 959. It was handbuilt from start to finish, taking 18 days for a single car, with the same V8 powerplant as the SL (322 hp, 354 lb. ft. torque). They widened and reinforced the body to shoehorn in the V8 and tranny and new suspension/brake bits. It had more than 4000 different parts from a standard 300E. Awesome Autobahn cruiser! 0-60 came in 5.9, but that's WITH slip control on. Disabling it via the aftermarket makes mid 5's quite attainable. Not bad for a 3900 pound four-door family sedan!

 

[cary]

The 500e was a great car when it came out and was the factories answer to AMG prior to the aquisition of AMG. The flared fenders were really cool and let you know it was not some poser car. The problem is the current standard e500 is just as fast and much less expensive.

Now the current generation E55AMG is nothing short of unreal. Rated at 470hp (commonly accepted to really be about 550) and an equal amount of torque, the thing is a Corvette eater. Guys running them bone stock at the dragstrip are breaking into the high and mid 11 second quarter.

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

VVTI = Variable Valve Timing....it's not a chip change but a valve train change
More power in the HIGHER RPM.

Great on-road if you leave the pedal; down, not much meaning off-road.

I'll take the VVTI though (if I could)!
(Becky let's me buy ANYTHING for the 100 I want BUT an S/C.....because she knows we don't need it, she puts her foot down. GOOD WOMAN.....KEEPING ME IN CHECK (from putting my foot down!)!

 

[dclee]

John - Naw, don't kill your reliability with the S/C. Take the money you would have spent (say $3800 plus $500 for the install) and buy an old 5.0L Mustang (you can S/C that engine with the money you'll still have left over) and that should satisfy your need for speed!

Cary - Build quality on all current Daimler-CHRYSLER cars is s#!t. E55 AMG is nice, but I'd sell it as soon as the warranty ran out. However, those old W124 chassis cars just don't die, and they're built like tanks. It's like driving around in a bank vault. Even the 100 Series can't compare to an `80s/early-`90s Benz for tank-like build quality. I just wish they put a manual tranny in them, that's the only thing that kept the 500E from utterly dominating its Bavarian neighbor's E34 chassis M5. You could also regear, and then I'd bet you could get close to 5 seconds flat in the 0-60. Standard final drive ratio on the 500E was a miserable 2.82:1!!!