What do you pull out with your hand winch? (1 Viewer)

[slowLC]

So I am stuck between a Chinese electric winch (probably a runva 9000 or engo) or a tirfor/ MPP Hand winch. I like the blackrat because it can be used to pull or assist a vehicle down something. The problem with the blackrat is the rating, it just seem like much. The MPP has a higher rating, amsteel blue line, but much less length.*

If I purchase the electric I will be mounting it behind the stock bumper of my 80 and cut a hole for the fair lead. Obviously these are less work and more capacity, but there are way more things likely to fail including other components like your alternator or battery.*

So what are people using the blackrats on? What vehicle and what kind of stucks? I am by no means a rock crawler, but my wife and I get out on our own a lot off the beaten path. I have been stuck in mud ( not too deep) and snow and am ready for some kind of winch. Pics are always appreciated! Thanks everyone

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[Gottagetone]

Get the electric winch and a couple of snatch blocks with tree savers. If you really want a hand winch then get a Hi Lift and utilize it as a hand winch in a pinch. If you get only the hand winch you will not like it if you get really stuck.

I have used my Smittybilt for lots of pulls without issue. When I pulled it out of my old bumper I found the motor connections rusted together and I had broken part of the housing, it still worked. I ended up replacing the motor with a Tuff Stuff motor, thanks to another thread here, and it bolted right up. I now have a higher HP 12k Lb winch that works extremely well.

Keep up on your maintenance meaning work the electric winch regularly and always before heading out on the trail and you will be fine.

 

[slowLC]

Thanks, any other people that are using a hand winch with some result info?

 

[80t0ylc]

Thanks, any other people that are using a hand winch with some result info?

No offense intended, but are you serious? You've got an 80 series in your sig line. We're talking about a 3 ton rig. I threw my hand winch in the tool box of my Mini, but even on that I'm running a 8K electric. About the only thing a hand winch will help you with an 80 is one step above titty-bumping and that's if you're not winching into the wind. Looks like you'll be spending almost $300 for the MPP. Hell, I got my Badland 12K at Harbor Freight on sale with a 2 yr warranty for $350. Checkout the Chinese built electrics

 

[slowLC]

The military has been using tirfor style hand winches to pull massive rigs out of bad stucks that are WAY bigger than an 80. Obviously these are higher rated then say the small blackrat, but I'm talking about any style of hand winch. You can pick up a used 4 ton tirfor for 300. I appreciate and understand what your saying though

 

[Yukon LX]

i pulled my 100 out of bumper deep red clay with my MPP. I put my highlift handle over the mpp handle for leverage. It wasn't fun by any means, at all, but it worked. It was about a 15 foot pull, up a slight hill. I have the standard steel cable. It does just fine, and cuts cost significantly.

That being said, and electric winch will be added at some point. Also, there is ALOT of other stuff you need for recovery other than just the winch.

Below is what i carry.


1- 15,000lb 25 ft Snatch Strap
2- 10,000lb 25 ft Snatch Strap
1- 5,500lb 20 ft Tow Rope with hooks
1- 100 ft 5/8th inch warn winch cable with hooks (Extension Purposes for Hand winching)
1- 8,000lb 3 hook Hand Winch
1- 12,000lb Wyeth Scott Cable Puller/ Hand Winch
1- 60 inch High Lift Jack
1- Shovel with Gloves
4- ¾ inch Clevis Shackles
1- 15 feet of chain
1- Set Max Trax
1- ARB Snatch Block

 

[80t0ylc]

i pulled my 100 out of bumper deep red clay with my MPP. I put my highlift handle over the mpp handle for leverage. It wasn't fun by any means, at all, but it worked. It was about a 15 foot pull, up a slight hill. I have the standard steel cable. It does just fine, and cuts cost significantly.

That being said, and electric winch will be added at some point. Also, there is ALOT of other stuff you need for recovery other than just the winch.

Below is what i carry.


1- 15,000lb 25 ft Snatch Strap
2- 10,000lb 25 ft Snatch Strap
1- 5,500lb 20 ft Tow Rope with hooks
1- 100 ft 5/8th inch warn winch cable with hooks (Extension Purposes for Hand winching)
1- 8,000lb 3 hook Hand Winch
1- 12,000lb Wyeth Scott Cable Puller/ Hand Winch
1- 60 inch High Lift Jack
1- Shovel with Gloves
4- ¾ inch Clevis Shackles
1- 15 feet of chain
1- Set Max Trax
1- ARB Snatch Block

More power to ya! If you have the energy to go through all the set up and can find the leverage and the elbow grease - go for it. I would remove the first 3 items on your list, though. Any stretch in extraction lines is not good. Snatch straps, IIRC are designed to stretch and the 5500 lb tow rope with hooks sounds damn dangerous. If it lets go, the hooks can become projectiles.

As a last thought, I don't really think you are enjoying much "significant cost cutting", considering the current price of the Badland Winch line at Harbor Freight, but hey - it's the USA! Whatever floats your boat

 

[Yukon LX]

Snatch straps are for "snatching" others out of stuck situations. This is not for use with the hand winch, just part of my recovery gear. The tow rope with hooks is for light duty in the city removing stuck civics and C-Classes with their tires on a little bit of ice in the winter.

Also, i will put an electric winch in as funds allow, and the build progresses, but all the listed is gear above is what i would want to have in support, and in backup, with an electric winch anyways. thus, i went with this stuff first. Also, this was not all purchased at once. Much of it came off my old rig, or was picked up on mud or amazon when good deals were presented.

Would i rather press a button? Hell yes. Will i in the future? For sure. Is this also a viable option, and a solid back up and compliment to an electric winch? I think so.

 

[80t0ylc]

Snatch straps are for "snatching" others out of stuck situations. This is not for use with the hand winch, just part of my recovery gear. The tow rope with hooks is for light duty in the city removing stuck civics and C-Classes with their tires on a little bit of ice in the winter.......

Yeah, I know exactly what they're for. Bad idea -- burn 'em. Best advice I can give you. If you don't want to listen, that's your business. If you need a snatch strap to extract someone, you're under equipped. I've done this myself when I was young and foolish, but even then it was a last resort. Yeah it can and has worked, but if you knew the dangers and saw the results of this little stunt gone wrong, you'd torch them and get proper equipment.
As for the rope, you'd better hope it doesn't get substituted in a situation by a helper or someone you've loaned your rig to that's ignorant of it's limitations.

Just trying to help a fellow mudder, it's free advice - so I'm down off my soapbox.

 

[Yukon LX]

1- i dont loan my rig to anyone, except when my wife drives it to work every day (it is our rig)

2- when it comes to recovery, weather i am the stuck, or the puller, i dont let anyone do the rigging on my lx except myself.

3- I have used many a snatch strap and have broken several as well. I think most would agree that a snatch strap is a viable option for many situations, and when properly used can unstuck someone safely and successively.

I do appreciate any advice as i am always looking to learn new things, this is just how i use my rig and equipment.

If used properly, and in the correct situation, what is so horrible about using a quality snatch strap?

 

[slowLC]

This would not be my only piece of extrication equipment. I have a hi lift, snatch strap, tow strap, shackles, 2 shovels ( to put the wife to work!! haha) and gloves. I dont think anyone is arguing which is more convienent, but with that being said there are many bonus' to having a hand winch. Approach angles, expensive bumpers, cutting stock bumpers, mounting plates, weight, drain on electrical, etc... Thanks for the info on what you were stuck in and what you got out with

 

[Yukon LX]

^ sooooooo wacha gonna do?

 

[45Kevin]

When I used to wheel an early bronco I always carried one of those cheapish hand winches. It only had about 15' of cable on it. By the time I got it hooked up and winched until I had the line loaded i only got about 10 feet of tow out of it.

I mean it worked, but what a f'ing effort it took.

Also, looking back it was quite dangerous, you standing right in the middle in the line.

 

[80t0ylc]

..........If used properly, and in the correct situation, what is so horrible about using a quality snatch strap?

I dunno, I guess that it happens so rarely as perfect as you describe.

Here's a couple of links for those that aren't aware of the dangers involved and precautions necessary.
Dangers of using Motor Vehicle Recovery Straps

Snatch Straps | Motoring | RACQ

Precautions when using a snatch strap. - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

If you're aware of all this, maybe some poor unsuspecting, well intentioned Samaritan will read this and not use a tow ball or other unsatisfactory snatch point. Or it might save a life or a trip to the ER to have a fragment of steel removed from their body because they had such a good view point of all the action.

 

[slowLC]

Any other first hand accounts of hand winches?

 

[Yukon LX]

no,because they are all dead, or dead tired

 

[slowLC]

Well you ate still alive aren't you???

 

[80t0ylc]

Any other first hand accounts of hand winches?

Only ones I've had were no sweat scenarios. Long before I even had one, I was out wheeling and came upon this rancher pulling himself (full sized F250) out of a shallow ditch about 6-8" of fresh snow on ground. He gladly disco'd far end of hand winch, which was across the road anyway and we hooked to me and used hand winch for tow strap and pulled him out.

The other time, I was in the ditch next to a highway, myself, after hitting black ice with my 2WD Ranger. I was without any tow straps, but had my hand winch under the seat. A guy stopped to help and we used hand winch as a tow strap.

So, I'd say they're handy to have (pun intended), but I would not be comfortable using as main extraction tool.

 

[Everett80]

I have used hand winches a number of times, and while they are certainly a lot of work, I don't think it's as big a deal as some are making it out to be. I've been stuck in mud just past the floorboards and got out with a cheap 2.5 ton hand winch. Having somebody else there to give a little throttle and take turns with helps drastically! Same deal in snow... Got buried in some nasty slush past the diffs and backed it out with the same hand winch. Most of the time you just need to help get it moving a little. Other times you get your weeks exercise in! A hand winch IS more versatile then an electric for obvious reasons of using it at whichever end you need it, and a $300 hand winch I would wager is MUCH more dependable than a $300 electric cheapy winch. Besides, an electric needs a good battery, a mount, etc. as has already been discussed. My dad found a really nice 4 ton hand winch on Craigslist for $30... And I've seen them for around $75-$100 several times as well. I will still carry a hand winch, even though I scored a Warn M12000 for $100 a few weeks ago. It doesn't sound like you will be pulling yourself up and over obstacles, so I would think going the man powered route would be just fine. My .02 as always...

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[slowLC]

^^ that's what I probably thought. I have no plans on winching myself up a sheer wall! I do my best to not get stuck, so when I do, it shouldn't be too bad. Any others?