tongue weight-m416 (1 Viewer)

[missipboy]

i'm starting to plan my winter trailer mods and had some questions about putting all this weight on the tongue. i'm liking the way the at trailers are setup and want to mount my 21gallon water tank, two five gallon fuel cans and a tongue box with two batteries and all my elec. gear in front of the tub. i know the water and fuel will weigh 250lbs and then the batteries and box i'm sure will be another 100lbs. i've seen several trailers with this much gear on them, but are there suspension upgrades i need to do? maybe distribute the weight differently? most of the stuff in the trailer tub will be lightweight gear such as tables, chairs, cooking gear and such, so i know most of the weight will be in front. my suspension is stock right now except the springover. thoughts?

 

[Brian in Oregon]

I'd distribute the weight better.

You need to get an M416 manual. In fact, there's one on this very website:
http://www.ih8mud.com/tech/pdf/trailer/m416.pdf

Empty, there is 540 lbs on the wheels and 130 on the landing leg, 670 total.

Loaded max, there is 148 on the landing leg, 1022 on the wheels, 1170 total.

Center of gravity empty is over the rear axle, which is 72" back from the forward edge of the lunette.

Center of gravity fully loaded (500 lbs) and properly distributed is 9" forward of that, which would be 63" back from the forward edge of the lunette.

There is a copy of the data plate in the above file showing all of this.

 

[KOWBOY]

A good rule of thumb for any trailer is 15% of total weight on the tongue.

I had the same concerns so I put the toolbox and water tank on the front and then the fuel cans and high-lift jack on the back. Tent's centered over the axle.

One thing to consider is leavin' yourself some adjustability in the design. If'n your heavy in the ass on the trailer then she's gonna be all over the road. With my monster toolbox on the front, I can either fill it with heavy tools or light clothes bags to get the balance right.

Just some deep thoughts from a shallow mind.

 

[missipboy]

i had read about the 15%, but didn't know if it was as much of a concern in a small trailer and then also with more weight being in front instead of in back. i should also point out that i extended my tongue by two feet, so that helps distribute the weight a good bit. i could also slide my tent towards the back as it is now as far forward as possible. i guess i'll just have to weigh it as i mod it.

 

[LCOwner]

i had read about the 15%, but didn't know if it was as much of a concern in a small trailer

You're right but 15% is a good place to start. In a nut shell keep 15% or more on the tongue without exceeding the tongues/hitch capabilities.

 

[missipboy]

so, i can put all of that weight on the tongue as long as it and the hitch are strong enough to handle it, right? will it affect the trailer's handling?

 

[LCOwner]

so, i can put all of that weight on the tongue as long as it and the hitch are strong enough to handle it, right? will it affect the trailer's handling?

Whe you say "all" I assume you mean 600lbs or less. Every receiver hitch I've seen has a max tongue weight limit of 600lbs. So if you have a TW of 600 how much is gross of the trailer loaded?

 

[missipboy]

when i said "all of that weight" i was referring to the items in the first post. two 5 gallon fuel cans, a 21 gallon water tank and a battery box with one, maybe two batteries. sorry for the confusion. i don't think it would be more than 350lbs.

i'm new to trailer weight talk, but tongue weight is what weight force is actually at the tongue, right? 350 pounds probably(not looking at the trailer right now) located midway between the axle and tongue would produce 175lbs of tongue weight. that leaves me 1166.67lbs that i can distribute evenly over the axle without lowering the tongue weight below 15%. luckily, that is just shy of the max load of 1170lbs. am i even in the right ballpark here? like i said, it's all new to me.

 

[LCOwner]

I see now. Run it!

 

[titanpat57]

This is the way I'm figuring it. I'm not an engineer or certified in in it. My thoughts are this..if you have 400lbs. between the wheels on the trailer and the truck hitch, basically the trailer picks up half and the tow vehicle the other half. I also think you could consider this "dead load" Now baring any structual failure or a weld busting loose, I wouldn't consider this excessive. I'm planning on at least that and also adding in another 150 lbs. of dead weight IN the trailer (before the wheels). Then you have to take into consideration of the actual weight in the tub, and the weight distribution based on the size (sq. ft.) of the tub. My personal thought is one that it will tow one hell of alot better with 400 lbs. on the "tongue/hitch" than with out. My case is even more unique simply because my tent is mounted 6' in the air, and my tongue is 6' long at least...I'm looking for hitch weight to stay well..grounded..lol. If the tow vehicle won't mind a few extra pounds than I say tow with confidence.

 

[missipboy]

i don't think with a short trailer and small amount of weight, the weight distribution is that significant. so long as i keep these items on my tongue i'm pretty sure i'll always have at least the 10 to 15%. i can then load my trailer any way i want and not really have to worry bout it.

 

[Brian in Oregon]

One drawback to a lot of tongue weight - If you have to move the trailer by hand, how ya gunna do it without a small army? A 100 to 150 lbs is OK for one or two people, but if you hit 200 to 500, well, what are you gunna do? Offload everything?

I think balancing the load is the best way. If you're running out of room in the box, then build a rear bumper extension and start putting weight back there to counter the weight on the A frame. You can also space out jerry can holders from the sides and mount them behind the fenders. Sink a battery box into the floor if you have to.

 

[missipboy]

very good point.

i may try and center the water tank over the axle. it's just that i really like the simplicity of putting a handpump on it and having it right there on the tongue. an idea that came from adventure trailers. mounting the two jerry cans in the back and then moving my tent to the rear would probably make a significant difference. i guess it'll be a trial and error kind of thing. one thing's for sure, i'll be getting a trailer jack instead of the stock landing leg-which is what i have now.

 

[boctor12]

I have two 5 gallon gas tanks, propane tank, 16 gal wtr tank, and a battery up front. What helped with the tounge weight is cuting the tub and building the box up front to put everything. With the weight of the tent and loading the trailer, the weight distribution is dam near perfect.

 

[missipboy]

almost the same weight i'll have up there. my tongue is extended about two feet, though, so with exact same setups mine would have less tongue weight. maybe that extra five gallons of water i'll have will take up the difference.

 

[titanpat57]

One drawback to a lot of tongue weight - If you have to move the trailer by hand, how ya gunna do it without a small army? A 100 to 150 lbs is OK for one or two people, but if you hit 200 to 500, well, what are you gunna do? Offload everything?

Me strong like Bull.....smart like Tractor!...lol...jk

You're right..I guess what I was trying to say is that if the trailer tongue weight is excessive, that's why I put a decent jack and a wheel on. In my case the cooler and water jugs would come off, leaving only the battery...so I guess you could say my "ballast" was adjustable.

 

[Brian in Oregon]

Well, keep in mind that small trailer jack wheels tend to dig into anything that's not a paved surface. Meaning they will be a royal pain on gravel, dirt or mud. If you do install a jack with a wheel, get the largest wheel you can find to increase the footprint. I've seen some homemade ones using the spindle of a small import car with 13" rims. Crude, but effective.

 

[likhary]

One thing to consider is leavin' yourself some adjustability in the design. If'n your heavy in the ass on the trailer then she's gonna be all over the road. With my monster toolbox on the front, I can either fill it with heavy tools or light clothes bags to get the balance right.