Recovery Damper

[rusty_tlc]

Are you worried about abrasion resistance?

Enough people I know have already worn out synthetic rope that I won't be re-spooling my winches anytime soon.
Problems include;

UV deterioration
Lower abrasion resistance
Wear caused by dirt inside the rope
​

It works great for the guys with competition buggies though, and if I had a sponsor I'd be all over it.

 

[Southeast Overland]

Problems include;

UV deterioration
Lower abrasion resistance
Wear caused by dirt inside the rope​

I'm familiar with the pros and cons of synthetic - but they are weighed differently by different people depending on individual use. Just wonderun' what your specific issues were with synthetic.

OK - back to the topic of winch line dampeners. (and dangit - your indent that followed me is annoying! )
​

 

[80t0ylc]

More violent compared to......

I was thinking of the older synthetic lines. I'm not up on the latest synthetic rope as I have very little interest in it. For my use, the expense is prohibitive and my wire rope works fine.

 

[80t0ylc]

YouTube - Dyneema rope VS steel rope - strength test - break test

Wire rope

YouTube - In House Break Test B -- Halo, LLC.

Both will recoil... But syn. line has less mass coming at you than steel.

Thanks for posting these links. I've never been around when a winch line has broke (thank God), but after watching that video, and I understand it's just a test or demo, I remain convinced that safety, and a recovery damper are important. Some people have posted that when their lines broke, they just dropped on the ground. Ok, cool! They must know, they were there. But, the only way I can see that happening is if little or no energy (read stretch) was stored up. So in the video, there must have been substantial energy because that wire rope just shot across that test fixture when the line came apart. Pretty violent and dangerous, IMHO. Serious motivation to switch to synthetic rope for safety alone. Like someone already said, "If I had a sponsor, I'd be all over it."

 

[greentruck]

The problem with a cable breaking is that it's hard to tell exactly where the pieces attached to it -- whether a hook or recovery point failure, whatever -- may go, in different directions than you might think. True, maybe not directly back along the cable, but who plays that kind of lottery?

Heck, that'd be the only time I'd likely ever "win" anything at a game of chance.

As far as laying something over the cable to act as a damper, it'll be most effective to have two, one basically flopped over the hook-up and another a few feet further back from the end of your cable.

Sure, probably overkill.
Sure, doesn't guarantee you'll be safe.

I wouldn't spend money on a fancy one, but the floor mats are right there -- and you usually have two.

I also am unlikely to use this in every situation. Getting the little bro's Highlander outta of the ditch on Xmas with a brand new cable and a downhill pull? Nah.

Somewhere else? I might.

But I'll also be putting what I can between me and the pull. I don't count on the damper, either. It was like what was said about the seatbelts earlier. Why not? [Realizing some people have an abnormal fear of drowning belted in the truck or are just bad at statistics...]

To each his own. I have enough other folks that usually want a chunk of my hide just driving through town. Why not make the odds better for yourself when you get a chance?

 

[rusty_tlc]

I'm familiar with the pros and cons of synthetic - but they are weighed differently by different people depending on individual use. Just wonderun' what your specific issues were with synthetic.

OK - back to the topic of winch line dampeners. (and dangit - your indent that followed me is annoying! )

I think the biggest thing that swayed me was input from guys who spend a lot more time off road than I do and have a lot more real world experience to draw from.

 

[greentruck]

OK, not sure from the text exactly how it happened, but it did with synthetic, not cable. Glad everyone ducked
foreshortened Switz run and a myth debunked - Colorado4x4.org Forums

Pretty good aim, but not sure that was intended, either.
It would've done a pretty good job of taking some teeth out, at a minimum, if your face got in the way.

 

[Southeast Overland]

OK, not sure from the text exactly how it happened, but it did with synthetic, not cable. Glad everyone ducked
foreshortened Switz run and a myth debunked - Colorado4x4.org Forums

Pretty good aim, but not sure that was intended, either.
It would've done a pretty good job of taking some teeth out, at a minimum, if your face got in the way.

It's hard to follow the original post in your link - but it appears that the Jeeper might have used a snatch strap as a winch extension??? If that was the case then the 'recoil' was because of the stretch in the snatch strap - not the synthetic winch line.

I just tried to read the thread again and it appears I'm not the only one having a hard time figuring out what happened.

 

[greentruck]

The details worry me less than the need to be cautious in general when doing off-road recovery. You use what you brung. The situation is what it is. If it hits you, it doesn't matter why it happened.

Of course, if it hits your heep, What, me worry?

Being safe is about making your own luck, anticipating what could go wrong and taking whatever precautions are possible.

I think the discussion was confused, too. That's why I take all the precautions I can in a given situation, especially if you're working with someone you just met. Not that they're untrustworthy, it's just that communications can go wrong, even when you and your buddy have done this for years.

Don't ever dismiss the idea that something could go wrong, unless you're the kind of guy who always gets away with saying, 'Here, hold my beer..." without losing any hide -- or worse.

 

[opie74]

It's hard to follow the original post in your link - but it appears that the Jeeper might have used a snatch strap as a winch extension??? If that was the case then the 'recoil' was because of the stretch in the snatch strap - not the synthetic winch line.

I just tried to read the thread again and it appears I'm not the only one having a hard time figuring out what happened.

I got that impression as well. Heres my thinking on this... If you are using a snatch strap or rope as your tree saver and something in the set-up breaks, the energy will be dissipated away from your vehicle as opposed to towards it just from the standpoint of whats wrapped around the tree. Since its stretching towards your vehicle, it will want to snap back away from it carrying whatever happenes to still be attached to it.

 

[Southeast Overland]

I got that impression as well. Heres my thinking on this... If you are using a snatch strap or rope as your tree saver and something in the set-up breaks, the energy will be dissipated away from your vehicle as opposed to towards it just from the standpoint of whats wrapped around the tree. Since its stretching towards your vehicle, it will want to snap back away from it carrying whatever happenes to still be attached to it.

It 'might' or 'should' are different than it 'will.'

 

[Southeast Overland]

It 'might' or 'should' are different than it 'will.'

My reply sounded a bit short when I read it again. Let's add another in there.

 

[tclark]

I've never been around a cable breaking so I have no real world experience, but how would the hook ever come flying back if the cable broke? I get it if the mounting point breaks but not the cable

 

[yycranger4x4]

I've never been around a cable breaking so I have no real world experience, but how would the hook ever come flying back if the cable broke? I get it if the mounting point breaks but not the cable

It seems like the person in that link used a recovery strap to effectively extend the length of the winch. Doing this loads the strap and stretches it. With the strap stretched, something broke (my guess is the strap itself judging by the talk of old and new straps). With the amount of potential energy stored in the stretched recovery strap, it was enough to bring the hook back towards the vehicle. The thing that probably helped to slow the hook down enough that it didn't come through the windshield is that there was probably a length of recovery strap still attached to the hook, acting like a streamer to slow it down.

This is the reason I have a 50' winch extension cable that I keep, along with both a good recovery strap, and a 15' rated lifting sling that I can use for extra reach or a tree saver.

 

[tclark]

Gotcha--so the strap broke not the actual cable(which is essentially the mounting point in that situation).

 

[opie74]

It seems like the person in that link used a recovery strap to effectively extend the length of the winch. Doing this loads the strap and stretches it. With the strap stretched, something broke (my guess is the strap itself judging by the talk of old and new straps). With the amount of potential energy stored in the stretched recovery strap, it was enough to bring the hook back towards the vehicle. The thing that probably helped to slow the hook down enough that it didn't come through the windshield is that there was probably a length of recovery strap still attached to the hook, acting like a streamer to slow it down.

This is the reason I have a 50' winch extension cable that I keep, along with both a good recovery strap, and a 15' rated lifting sling that I can use for extra reach or a tree saver.

It depends on where in the strap it broke. If it broke at the point the hook and strap are connected, the energy in the strap would release away from the connection between the strap and hook. The energy stored in the winch line would come back towards the vehicle. Where in the strap the failure occured is a major factor in how much energy it transferred to the winch line.

 

[TexasJack]

I have seen people fill balloons with sand and place them in a sock. They then tie the ends of 2 socks together and wrap that around the cable. If it breaks, it takes the cable right to the ground and the sand is a lot safer than rocks. It is also cheaper.

Thoughts?

 

[Mark W]

The cable weighs plenty all on its own. A blanket or jacket or something like that with will provide aerodynamic braking is much more effective for any sort of "safety damper.


Mark...