Parasitic Draw - Fuse identified…

[Fof5]

In my uneducated opinion that blue connector was the cause of your blown fuse. The green stains are copper salts that are conductive and wash out of the connectors and cause short circuits while the black is burnt/melted plastic and possibly metal. To get hot enough to melt either takes a pretty heavy draw and it wouldn’t surprise me that those connections turned out to be unrepairable and will have to be replaced in a worst case situation. I’ve used q tips, wire brushes, toothbrushes, plastic brushes and toothpicks to try and clean up those connection blocks as well as spray cans of contact cleaner, even brake cleaner and some other “green” cleaner before brushing on some dielectric grease. All of that green corrosion has the potential to be another path for a short so you have to get rid of as much as possible.
On the burnt connectors, I would try to scrape away as much of the “black” that I could, maybe a welding tip cleaner or dental pick, to get to shiny metal so that you have good metal to metal contact. If you use some sort of contact grease you have to make sure that you don’t create more shorts by smearing it around, I’m a klutz so I avoid using it.

Thank you for the reply and advice…the odd thing is I have not blown a fuse. Just the dead battery and the significant draw measured. A whole host of dead features but no blown fuses. Rear dvd/tv, front console usb, and now the key fobs. Any idea why i wouldn’t have blown a fuse with all the corrosion and possible burnt connectors?

Thanks again!

 

[Sandroad]

Thank you for the reply and advice…the odd thing is I have not blown a fuse. Just the dead battery and the significant draw measured. A whole host of dead features but no blown fuses. Rear dvd/tv, front console usb, and now the key fobs. Any idea why i wouldn’t have blown a fuse with all the corrosion and possible burnt connectors?

Thanks again!

Arcing in DC from loose/corroded connectors doesn’t blow fuses. Overcurrent blows fuses. It’s entirely possible to start a fire with DC circuits and never blow a fuse. That’s why arc-fault detection is so important in high current applications like solar. I’m still not convinced you have burned connectors, but it’s certainly possible. The corrosion was enough to shut down certain circuits and leak current between certain circuits. Good luck with the cleaning!

 

[linuxgod]

Thank you for the reply and advice…the odd thing is I have not blown a fuse. Just the dead battery and the significant draw measured. A whole host of dead features but no blown fuses. Rear dvd/tv, front console usb, and now the key fobs. Any idea why i wouldn’t have blown a fuse with all the corrosion and possible burnt connectors?

Thanks again!

luck?

I'm assuming it's not a short to ground. If there's water in the connector or enough corrosion it could even be multiple circuits intermittently shorting across. i.e. your headlights or interior lights don't require the engine to be on but your nav system does, and if the short connects the nav system to the interior light circuit (two positive lines) but doesn't short to ground then your nav system would power up but it wouldn't necessarily pop a fuse. Fuses only pop when you exceed the max current, which happens quickly when you short to ground, but not necessarily when one circuit powers two devices instead of the intended single one.

 

[linuxgod]

BTW I would use the Toyota tool to remove each pin, clean it and sand it with some high-grit paper, maybe lightly coat with dielectric grease, and then reinstall. If you find a pin that's really bad you'll need to cut it and replace. It's a time-consuming job but otherwise you may end up chasing occasional electrical gremlins for years.

Good luck. My windshield is not original and this is one of those problems that I worry about myself since slow corrosion like this is like a cancer to the electrical system.

 

[GordJ]

Thank you for the reply and advice…the odd thing is I have not blown a fuse. Just the dead battery and the significant draw measured. A whole host of dead features but no blown fuses. Rear dvd/tv, front console usb, and now the key fobs. Any idea why i wouldn’t have blown a fuse with all the corrosion and possible burnt connectors?

Thanks again!

The short may be ahead of the fuse?

 

[Redmdrider]

The short may be ahead of the fuse?

Hi all, wondering if Fof5 fixed his issues? In any case I was very lucky to find this thread.
Here’s my fact pattern: 2009 LX570 with entire systems gone dead: (1) radio; (2) backup camera, and (3) backup sensors. Checked fuses, all good (engine compartment + driver’s footwell).
Following all the great advice here I opened driver’s and passenger’s footwell areas. Passenger’s was prestine, but I found corrosion in driver’s side.

Starting from the top, there are 3 main bundled connectors: Gray, Blue and White. I found corrosion in each one. Unfortunately, the corrosion (or short or something else) actually ate through pins in each of the connectors. These are pictures of all the male sides (attached to the car after removing the connectors). You can see one of the pins dangling, and a couple missing.

The female side of the connectors also exhibit corrosion, and remnants of the pins that corroded and broke inside the female end.

I cleaned all the connecting areas with contact cleaner. I’m not sure how successful that was. I buttoned everything back up, but the same systems are still dead. So it’s possible that the broken pins are the cause, or maybe corrosion in other pins is the culprit. Or some other issue? I love my LX, but the list of issues with her is getting real loooong. Here’s a few questions I’m hoping someone can chime in and help:
(1) How would you go about fixing these pins? Can I simply bypass the wiring?
(2) Can you suggest a way to trace the wires in the repair manual wiring diagrams to see if broken pins correspond to dead functions (again: radio, backup camera and backup sensors). Thus far I’ve figured out the following:
-Top bundle (Grey) is labeled ‘EA2’ and pin 34 is bad.
-Middle bundle (Blue) is labeled ‘EK1’ and pin 36 is bad.
-Bottom bundle (White) is labeled ‘EK2’ and pin 70 is bad.
(3) As I said above, each connector is actually a bundle of smaller connectors. On the female side I figured out how to press a tab to separate individual connectors. Each connector in turn has a small side tab that can be lifted, but when I do I cannot pull out individual wires. How can I pull wires from a bundle to make sure the female side is good?
(4) The male side (attached to car) seems much tougher. The connector receptacles are firmly attached. Is there a procedure to be able to access the wiring behind the male side of the connectors?
(5) Finally, any suggestions as to where to look for water intrusion are appreciated. I believe my windshield has been replaced (likely many years ago). But I live in Seattle, and the car is parked outside. I saw mentions of sunroof leaks, maybe I’ll look into those.

 

[Leaky2014]

1. Yes you can bypass
2. fsm can be used to trace the pins, its a pain to do but the info is there, just not simple.
3. female side is bad, just bypass
4.I just busted mine, it's already junk
5. Check sunroof drains.

welcome to the ever growing club

 

[doru]

I do not have experience with these connectors but I do with replacing terminals in auto connectors. You need access on both sides of the connector and some space to maneuver. You also need some "Terminal Extractor Removal Tool Kit" - search for that on amazon. You do not need all those but they are cheap and come in kits. Then you need to identify which type of terminal you are dealing with - basically which connector side should it be pulled out and the retaining scheme it uses. Usually there is a small tab either on the terminal itself - metal, or on the connector terminal hole - plastic, that latches into the other part - connector or terminal respectively. You then have to insert the proper size and shape tool along the terminal into the connector from the appropriate side to release the tab while pulling the terminal out.
On Toyota most of the terminals I dealt with are pulled out from the back of the connector - the wire side. But the tool insertion side varies so you have to figure it out. A pair of magnifying glasses and a strong light is highly recommended. You can get both in these glasses from amazon: YOCTOSUN LED Head Magnifier, Rechargeable Hands Free Headband Magnifying Glass.
Many times the wires are tightly packed in the harness bundle up to the connector. In your case with missing pins you will have to cut and replace the terminal anyway. So you might as well cut the wire in the back of the connector and make your extraction easier. You'll have to source a good terminal from junkyard and then solder it to your harness. Adding a small extra bit of wire will make life easier.
There are places that sell terminals: Connector Kits, Terminals, Wiring, Tools | Corsa Technic - https://www.corsa-technic.com/ . I do not know who sells Toyota style connectors/terminals. In the old days Toyota actually sold them for the service department to fix the harnesses - not unlike in your case. There is also a Toyota published harness repair manual (I have a PDF one from 2002). Now days they just replace the harness at your expense.
Hope this helps or at least gives you an idea.
pin == terminal

 

[Redmdrider]

1. Yes you can bypass
2. fsm can be used to trace the pins, its a pain to do but the info is there, just not simple.
3. female side is bad, just bypass
4.I just busted mine, it's already junk
5. Check sunroof drains.

welcome to the ever growing club

Hey Leaky2014–thanks for the welcome! I joined in 2015 but have only posted 2x

(1) That’s awesome that you agree I can bypass. I’m looking for t-connectors that are low profile—these seem to fit the bill: Amazon t-connectors. If I get these I’ll crimp and then try to cover with silicone.
(2) Yeah the FSM is kind of a nighmare, especially the wiring side. I have a dvd version that’s not properly installed, so I need to manually open pdf after pdf. I’ll make the repairs and hope the systems come back online.
(3) Agree that bypassing is the best solution.
(4) Can you elaborate what you busted? How did you get behind the male side of the connectors?
(5) I’ll research sunroof drains.

Thanks for all your help!

 

[doru]

2. fsm can be used to trace the pins, its a pain to do but the info is there, just not simple.

The "not simple" is actually simple but only after you understand how the diagrams work and the notations used. Having it electronic is a life saver as you have to jump from one side of the manual to another to fully understand the circuit from battery all the way and to identify where the connectors are.

On the other had you do not have to figure that out or to use the manual. It is obvious you have to fix those connectors first. Not some of the terminals but all of them. Then you can test and only if that does not fix it figure out the next step. At least this is what I would do...

 

[Redmdrider]

I do not have experience with these connectors but I do with replacing terminals in auto connectors. You need access on both sides of the connector and some space to maneuver. You also need some "Terminal Extractor Removal Tool Kit" - search for that on amazon. You do not need all those but they are cheap and come in kits. Then you need to identify which type of terminal you are dealing with - basically which connector side should it be pulled out and the retaining scheme it uses. Usually there is a small tab either on the terminal itself - metal, or on the connector terminal hole - plastic, that latches into the other part - connector or terminal respectively. You then have to insert the proper size and shape tool along the terminal into the connector from the appropriate side to release the tab while pulling the terminal out.
On Toyota most of the terminals I dealt with are pulled out from the back of the connector - the wire side. But the tool insertion side varies so you have to figure it out. A pair of magnifying glasses and a strong light is highly recommended. You can get both in these glasses from amazon: YOCTOSUN LED Head Magnifier, Rechargeable Hands Free Headband Magnifying Glass.
Many times the wires are tightly packed in the harness bundle up to the connector. In your case with missing pins you will have to cut and replace the terminal anyway. So you might as well cut the wire in the back of the connector and make your extraction easier. You'll have to source a good terminal from junkyard and then solder it to your harness. Adding a small extra bit of wire will make life easier.
There are places that sell terminals: Connector Kits, Terminals, Wiring, Tools | Corsa Technic - https://www.corsa-technic.com/ . I do not know who sells Toyota style connectors/terminals. In the old days Toyota actually sold them for the service department to fix the harnesses - not unlike in your case. There is also a Toyota published harness repair manual (I have a PDF one from 2002). Now days they just replace the harness at your expense.
Hope this helps or at least gives you an idea.

Hey doru thanks for your reply!
I researched most everything you suggested. The FSM actually goes into a lot of detail about the different types of connectors—dimensions, removal, replacement, etc. I’ve done somewhat similar type of work (back in my USAF days), and the concepts are similar. Bottom line, as you say, good lighting, making room and proper tools are key.
All this said, I think that I’m going to take the easier route and simply bypass the wiring. It’s not the proper procedure, but given all the roadblocks it’s the most cost effective, time and materials wise. I love my SUV, but just need to get it fixed in a reasonable manner.
Other than picking the ‘best’ t-connectors and best way to waterproof, I’m left with figuring out how to get to the back of the car-side connector (the male side). If anyone has done this please feel free to let me know.
Thanks a lot!

 

[Leaky2014]

Hi all, wondering if Fof5 fixed his issues? In any case I was very lucky to find this thread.
Here’s my fact pattern: 2009 LX570 with entire systems gone dead: (1) radio; (2) backup camera, and (3) backup sensors. Checked fuses, all good (engine compartment + driver’s footwell).
Following all the great advice here I opened driver’s and passenger’s footwell areas. Passenger’s was prestine, but I found corrosion in driver’s side.
View attachment 3035578
Starting from the top, there are 3 main bundled connectors: Gray, Blue and White. I found corrosion in each one. Unfortunately, the corrosion (or short or something else) actually ate through pins in each of the connectors. These are pictures of all the male sides (attached to the car after removing the connectors). You can see one of the pins dangling, and a couple missing.
View attachment 3035582View attachment 3035583View attachment 3035584
The female side of the connectors also exhibit corrosion, and remnants of the pins that corroded and broke inside the female end.
View attachment 3035593
I cleaned all the connecting areas with contact cleaner. I’m not sure how successful that was. I buttoned everything back up, but the same systems are still dead. So it’s possible that the broken pins are the cause, or maybe corrosion in other pins is the culprit. Or some other issue? I love my LX, but the list of issues with her is getting real loooong. Here’s a few questions I’m hoping someone can chime in and help:
(1) How would you go about fixing these pins? Can I simply bypass the wiring?
(2) Can you suggest a way to trace the wires in the repair manual wiring diagrams to see if broken pins correspond to dead functions (again: radio, backup camera and backup sensors). Thus far I’ve figured out the following:
-Top bundle (Grey) is labeled ‘EA2’ and pin 34 is bad.
-Middle bundle (Blue) is labeled ‘EK1’ and pin 36 is bad.
-Bottom bundle (White) is labeled ‘EK2’ and pin 70 is bad.
(3) As I said above, each connector is actually a bundle of smaller connectors. On the female side I figured out how to press a tab to separate individual connectors. Each connector in turn has a small side tab that can be lifted, but when I do I cannot pull out individual wires. How can I pull wires from a bundle to make sure the female side is good?
(4) The male side (attached to car) seems much tougher. The connector receptacles are firmly attached. Is there a procedure to be able to access the wiring behind the male side of the connectors?
(5) Finally, any suggestions as to where to look for water intrusion are appreciated. I believe my windshield has been replaced (likely many years ago). But I live in Seattle, and the car is parked outside. I saw mentions of sunroof leaks, maybe I’ll look into those.

Ea2 34 should be fog light


Ek1 36 should be a/c amplifier


Ek2 70 should be interior light, front door, courtesy light assembly LH

 

[Leaky2014]

Hey Leaky2014–thanks for the welcome! I joined in 2015 but have only posted 2x

(1) That’s awesome that you agree I can bypass. I’m looking for t-connectors that are low profile—these seem to fit the bill: Amazon t-connectors. If I get these I’ll crimp and then try to cover with silicone.
(2) Yeah the FSM is kind of a nighmare, especially the wiring side. I have a dvd version that’s not properly installed, so I need to manually open pdf after pdf. I’ll make the repairs and hope the systems come back online.
(3) Agree that bypassing is the best solution.
(4) Can you elaborate what you busted? How did you get behind the male side of the connectors?
(5) I’ll research sunroof drains.

Thanks for all your help!

The welcome is, for the corrosion problem, not a matter of if it will happen but when.

4. The plastic bull**** that holds the junction box on, I just cut and ripped it off to get room to work on the backside.
5. step one is find the leak, you can bypass, replace pins etc, but if the leak is still there it will just happen again and get worse.

Took care of this on mine over 3 years ago, found leak, mine was sunroof drains that did not get reconnected after some mouth breather put it back together after some hail repair.
Cleaned the corrosion, bypassed broke pins, coated with dielectric grease and I mean COATED, put back together and haven't had a single issue since.
Good luck.

 

[Leaky2014]

-Top bundle (Grey) is labeled ‘EA2’ and pin 34 is bad.

this is actually pin 35

this could explain the radio and parking assist

 

[Redmdrider]

-Top bundle (Grey) is labeled ‘EA2’ and pin 34 is bad.

this is actually pin 35

this could explain the radio and parking assistView attachment 3035730
View attachment 3035726View attachment 3035727

The welcome is, for the corrosion problem, not a matter of if it will happen but when.

4. The plastic bulls*** that holds the junction box on, I just cut and ripped it off to get room to work on the backside.
5. step one is find the leak, you can bypass, replace pins etc, but if the leak is still there it will just happen again and get worse.

Took care of this on mine over 3 years ago, found leak, mine was sunroof drains that did not get reconnected after some mouth breather put it back together after some hail repair.
Cleaned the corrosion, bypassed broke pins, coated with dielectric grease and I mean COATED, put back together and haven't had a single issue since.
Good luck.

The "not simple" is actually simple but only after you understand how the diagrams work and the notations used. Having it electronic is a life saver as you have to jump from one side of the manual to another to fully understand the circuit from battery all the way and to identify where the connectors are.

On the other had you do not have to figure that out or to use the manual. It is obvious you have to fix those connectors first. Not some of the terminals but all of them. Then you can test and only if that does not fix it figure out the next step. At least this is what I would do...

The "not simple" is actually simple but only after you understand how the diagrams work and the notations used. Having it electronic is a life saver as you have to jump from one side of the manual to another to fully understand the circuit from battery all the way and to identify where the connectors are.

On the other had you do not have to figure that out or to use the manual. It is obvious you have to fix those connectors first. Not some of the terminals but all of them. Then you can test and only if that does not fix it figure out the next step. At least this is what I would do..

-Top bundle (Grey) is labeled ‘EA2’ and pin 34 is bad.

this is actually pin 35

this could explain the radio and parking assistView attachment 3035730
View attachment 3035726View attachment 3035727

Thank you thank you!!! I will correct my Pin 34 to Pin 35. At least that explains 2/3 of my issues. Now just to figure out backup camera—but maybe they are all related.
Thanks again for your help!

 

[Redmdrider]

The welcome is, for the corrosion problem, not a matter of if it will happen but when.

4. The plastic bulls*** that holds the junction box on, I just cut and ripped it off to get room to work on the backside.
5. step one is find the leak, you can bypass, replace pins etc, but if the leak is still there it will just happen again and get worse.

Took care of this on mine over 3 years ago, found leak, mine was sunroof drains that did not get reconnected after some mouth breather put it back together after some hail repair.
Cleaned the corrosion, bypassed broke pins, coated with dielectric grease and I mean COATED, put back together and haven't had a single issue since.
Good luck.

(4) Yeah I can see why you went that route. It’s tough to figure out how to gracefully remove.
(5) I still need to research this part; maybe it’s the sunroof as in your case.

Could you share how you applied the dielectric grease? Inside the connectors liberally before putting together?

Thanks!

 

[Leaky2014]

(4) Yeah I can see why you went that route. It’s tough to figure out how to gracefully remove.
(5) I still need to research this part; maybe it’s the sunroof as in your case.

Could you share how you applied the dielectric grease? Inside the connectors liberally before putting together?

Thanks!

Inside and outside, I put it on the female side, the male side as well as behind where the wires go in to the junction block, basically I put that s*** all over.

 

[linuxgod]

I do not have experience with these connectors but I do with replacing terminals in auto connectors. You need access on both sides of the connector and some space to maneuver. You also need some "Terminal Extractor Removal Tool Kit" - search for that on amazon. You do not need all those but they are cheap and come in kits. Then you need to identify which type of terminal you are dealing with - basically which connector side should it be pulled out and the retaining scheme it uses. Usually there is a small tab either on the terminal itself - metal, or on the connector terminal hole - plastic, that latches into the other part - connector or terminal respectively. You then have to insert the proper size and shape tool along the terminal into the connector from the appropriate side to release the tab while pulling the terminal out.
On Toyota most of the terminals I dealt with are pulled out from the back of the connector - the wire side. But the tool insertion side varies so you have to figure it out. A pair of magnifying glasses and a strong light is highly recommended. You can get both in these glasses from amazon: YOCTOSUN LED Head Magnifier, Rechargeable Hands Free Headband Magnifying Glass.
Many times the wires are tightly packed in the harness bundle up to the connector. In your case with missing pins you will have to cut and replace the terminal anyway. So you might as well cut the wire in the back of the connector and make your extraction easier. You'll have to source a good terminal from junkyard and then solder it to your harness. Adding a small extra bit of wire will make life easier.
There are places that sell terminals: Connector Kits, Terminals, Wiring, Tools | Corsa Technic - https://www.corsa-technic.com/ . I do not know who sells Toyota style connectors/terminals. In the old days Toyota actually sold them for the service department to fix the harnesses - not unlike in your case. There is also a Toyota published harness repair manual (I have a PDF one from 2002). Now days they just replace the harness at your expense.
Hope this helps or at least gives you an idea.
pin == terminal

Bmotorsports.com has most of the connector pins I’ve searched for, at reasonable prices, if you try to re-pin stuff

If you need electrical wiring diagrams let me know. You can download the Toyota FSM using the instructions I posted at FSM for 200 series - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/fsm-for-200-series.765372/page-6#post-14229850.

 

[McCoyFarm]

Any idea what a dealership would charge to fix this wire harness by replacing?

 

[CanadianRockyCruiser]

Any idea what a dealership would charge to fix this wire harness by replacing?

A stealership will charge you for a new harness plus install. Get ready for a 4 or 5 digit bill.